is an psa 8oc really a 7 ????

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Posted By: tomboy

any grading experts no the answer please help with this question

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Posted By: Elliot

that should answer your question (thanks to Bruce Moreland for the article):

http://www.brucemo.com/cards/articles/oc.htm

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Posted By: Dan Mathewson

I've heard several discussions about this...not only about the OC designation, but also about the MK.

I just bought a 1940 Play Ball that is a PSA-7 (MK). It has an old, faded, very small ink stamp on the back which doesn't take away from the beauty of the card at all. I was delighted to get it at a basically PSA-6 price. I'm still surprised that the designation OC or MK (if they don't detract from the card's aesthetics) will lower the value/cost of the card...especially if the OC is regarding the back of the card being off-center. A noticeable OC front? Yeah, that might warrant a lower value in most cases, I'd think. I just don't know if there is a static "rule-of-thumb" that applies a direct "-1" to the grade.

My Play Ball PSA-7 and PSA-7 (MK) will go into a framed display right next to each other with a few other gems (possibly the two PSA-5 1951 Connie Mack's and maybe something else...a cool display of some nice later cards)... I'll never see the difference between the 7 and the 7(MK) and both are gorgeous cards.

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Posted By: Dan Mathewson

I personally agree and prefer how other graders "mix-in" the factor of centering into the overlal grade of the card, rather than a grade and a "qualifier".

Does that author also talk about other designators, such as MK, or others?

-dan

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Posted By: Albie O'Hanian

I am not an expert on grading but here is my opinion based on cards I have and what I have seen written.
First, it would all depend on the centering. Some 8 OC cards could very easily qualify as a 7. Some might get a straight 4. A 90/10 centered card that is an 8 OC would qualify as a 4. There is a wide range of off center grades in an 8OC.
On the PSA set registry an 8OC gets the same rating as a straight 6 or two grades lower.

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Posted By: jay behrens

I have a SGC40 e93 Griffith that would easily grade 70 or better if not for the fact that the centering is about 90/10 onthe front and SGC standards state that 90/10 gets no better than 40 Personally, I prefer the o/c qualifier. Not too thrilled with MK since any writing should make any card no better than VG. But that's just my opinion.

Jay

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Posted By: Bruce Moreland

That author is me, and I don't talk about it in the article. It's mainly about OC.

I don't know how the market has handled MK. I think that most people would downgrade a card with a mark on it more seriously than they'd downgrade an OC card.

If you have a "mint" card centered 80/20, there is still some value there, it's probably EX/MT. The same card with a mark, what is that? It's not EX/MT.

bruce

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Posted By: Bruce Moreland

This is an interesting point about MK, but I'd reach the opposite conclusion. If you can say with authority that a NM/MT card with a mark is VG, then you can value a PSA-8(MK). The same can be said for a PSA-8(ST), if the seller tells you that the stain is wax on the back.

It's not really standard what you should grade these kinds of cards, but if you have your own system, you can at least know how *you'd* grade them, and from there you can value them.

OC is freaky. I had an 8(OC) that was centered 65/35, or at least that was my argument to PSA when I sent it back in. I wanted the card converted to a straight PSA-8. The best they'd do was drop it to a 7, so I narrowly lost out. But there are a few out there that would definitely go down only one grade. The rest you'd have to assume are two grades at least.

Of course, this doesn't say anything about what they'd do if you sent them to SGC in 2000 or SGC now. They might get a different grade entirely from them.

bruce

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Posted By: Jeff S

It seems like MK is a useful idea, especially for particularly rare vintage cards that have been collected for a long time--like old judges with "N172" pencilled in on the back, or nice cards with a previous owner's stamp.

It is useful in the sense that large numbers of very attractive cards (like the one Dan is talking about above) would be automatic "1's" because of a pen mark or a stamp that may not mar anything other than an unoccupied corner of the back.

If consistently applied, the MK designation also seems like a good marketing tactic for PSA. I have lots of cards like those described above -- would be "ex" but for a stamp or something. Those cards rarely get authenticated and encased because their owners assume they'll be 1's.