I am gonna vent

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

I hope I don't hurt feelings with this post, however with that being said, I know some will agree and the ones who don't are probably the ones I am talking about.

Ok so I want to speak about 2 things.

First....

I HATE when someone (especially someone I know is knowledgeable) asks me what I'm looking for when I say make an offer. Are you hoping I say $50 on a $1000 and you can rob me?

If I say make an offer, I simply mean make an offer.

The excuse I always get when I respond to "what are you looking for?" is I just don't wanna throw out a number too low and insult you.

Why not throw out a number that's fair?

First off, why are you trying to low ball someone in the first place who is a active member of the community?

Secondly, that's like saying "I don't wanna embarrass myself with a cheap ass offer so I rather you give me a number so I can say I'll think about it but really never contact you again".



NEXT....

This is my BIGGGGGGEST PET PEEVE!

The worst worst thing someone can say to me is.... " I know you paid X for this so would you take Y?"

What does that have to do with ANYTHING!???

If I was able to scoop up a steal on BIN for $500 on a item worth $2500, do you think just because you have that public information, I now have to sell it to you for a $150 profit?

Stop it!



I could go on and on, but I'll stop here.

Thoughts?


I feel like this is the person who I'm writing to...

[vintagetoppsguy]

I may or may not agree with you on your first point, depending on the circumstances. If you're offering something for sale, it's your responsibility as the seller to throw out the first number. If you've done that and the potential buyer asks, "What is your best offer?" then I can understand your point. If you throw out the first number, then he ball is in their court to counteroffer. However, if you list something without a price and you're just fishing for offers, then shame on you.

On the second point I agree with you.

[MikeGarcia]

How much are you looking for on it ?
.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I may or may not agree with you on your first point, depending on the circumstances. If you're offering something for sale, it's your responsibility as the seller to throw out the first number. If you've done that and the potential buyer asks, "What is your best offer?" then I can understand your point. If you throw out the first number, then he ball is in their court to counteroffer. However, if you list something without a price and you're just fishing for offers, then shame on you.

On the second point I agree with you.

This was more for ebay when I price is up with best offer. I get so many "What are you looking for on it" messages and I always respond with make me a fair offer and its yours... 99% never get back to me.

[Snapolit1]

Don't disagree it's annoying, but everyone is looking to make the best deal they can favoring them to the max. It's human nature.

There is a guy on ebay I've alluded to a few times who purchases items at AHs for a couple hundred bucks and often tries to sell on eBay a few days later for multiples of what he paid. I do think what he paid is a relevant point in any negotiation. If 20 people bid on something and it settles at $750, I think it's a little ridiculous to list it on eBay for $3700. But it's a free country and he can obviously try to sell it for $250,000 if he is so inclined. It annoys me but not a damm thing I can do about it.

[kvnkvnkvn]

Both people write their numbers on a piece of paper. Flip them over on the count of three, Add the numbers, Divide by 2 and there is your price...

I like to live dangerously sometimes...

[ullmandds]

it kinda sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too! It's ok if you get a really good deal on a bin on ebay...but someone else is not entitled to get a good deal from you?

Personally...I hate the old "make me an offer!"

It's your card...you know what you paid for it...price it!

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

it kinda sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too! It's ok if you get a really good deal on a bin on ebay...but someone else is not entitled to get a good deal from you?

Personally...I hate the old "make me an offer!"

It's your card...you know what you paid for it...price it!

If you are selling something, I can't imagine a legitimate reason to ask for an offer in direct negotiations. Make an offer to sell and see what the reaction is. (Obviously if you accept offers on ebay that's a different deal.)

It's sort of like everyone is trying to see if the other side is a rube with no clue.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I may or may not agree with you on your first point, depending on the circumstances. If you're offering something for sale, it's your responsibility as the seller to throw out the first number. If you've done that and the potential buyer asks, "What is your best offer?" then I can understand your point. If you throw out the first number, then he ball is in their court to counteroffer. However, if you list something without a price and you're just fishing for offers, then shame on you.

On the second point I agree with you.

Originally Posted by ullmandds

it kinda sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too! It's ok if you get a really good deal on a bin on ebay...but someone else is not entitled to get a good deal from you?

Personally...I hate the old "make me an offer!"

It's your card...you know what you paid for it...price it!

Make an offer is referring to BEST OFFER on ebay.

[bobbyw8469]

Great points. I agree with them. I have nothing to add.

[Batpig]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

it kinda sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too! It's ok if you get a really good deal on a bin on ebay...but someone else is not entitled to get a good deal from you?

Personally...I hate the old "make me an offer!"

It's your card...you know what you paid for it...price it!

I hate this saying. What the heck is the point of having the cake if you can't eat it? I know the point is you can't eat the cake and still have it, but the phrasing is still annoying. For an alternative, I suggest "You can't sit in two chairs with one butt." Or maybe a more appropriate alternative for this situation is "You can't keep your card and sell it too."

Carry on.

[bigfish]

Originally Posted by EYECOLLECTVINTAGE

Make an offer is referring to BEST OFFER on ebay.

If you're disenchanted with getting offers don't offer that as an option on eBay. List a fixed price. Problem solved.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Batpig

I hate this saying. What the heck is the point of having the cake if you can't eat it? I know the point is you can't eat the cake and still have it, but the phrasing is still annoying. For an alternative, I suggest "You can't sit in two chairs with one butt." Or maybe a more appropriate alternative for this situation is "You can't keep your card and sell it too."

Carry on.

that's funny...as I was typing it I was kinda thinking the same thing!!!!!

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by bigfish

If you're disenchanted with getting offers don't offer that as an option on eBay. List a fixed price. Problem solved.

Honestly, I never thought of that. Thanks for the advice I will look into that

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by EYECOLLECTVINTAGE

Honestly, I never thought of that. Thanks for the advice I will look into that

So you buy something as a BIN and it never occurred to you to sell it as a BIN.

[packs]

I absolutely hate hearing some dealer at a card show tell me what they have into a card when I ask about the price. Why do I care what you paid for something? If you made a bad buy, don't even bother putting it out. I'm not going to pay $200 more for a card because you did.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

So you buy something as a BIN and it never occurred to you to sell it as a BIN.

yea cause I wasn't messing with him

Originally Posted by packs

I absolutely hate hearing some dealer at a card show tell me what they have into a card when I ask about the price. Why do I care what you paid for something? If you made a bad buy, don't even bother putting it out. I'm not going to pay $200 more for a card because you did.

+1111

[icollectDCsports]

Originally Posted by packs

I absolutely hate hearing some dealer at a card show tell me what they have into a card when I ask about the price. Why do I care what you paid for something? If you made a bad buy, don't even bother putting it out. I'm not going to pay $200 more for a card because you did.

Agree. I understand the psychology of it, because a dealer who buys something for resale will likely do so with a profit margin in mind, but sometimes a seller misjudges the market and what they "have into it" isn't relevant to a prospective purchaser. I realize that market prices for some (particularly less common) items may not be readily apparent, but there are dealers who will hang on to an item seemingly forever because of what they "have into it." Of course, it's perfectly within their rights to do so and if an item isn't available at a price that suits the buyer, then it's best to just move on.

[Hankphenom]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

it kinda sounds like you want to have your cake and eat it too! It's ok if you get a really good deal on a bin on ebay...but someone else is not entitled to get a good deal from you?

Personally...I hate the old "make me an offer!"

It's your card...you know what you paid for it...price it!

Exactly. Price it! If you walk something into a show and want me to buy it, how will you know to accept any offer I might make you if you don't know what you want for it? Of course, I know there's a good chance you're just going to take my offer and use it to sell to a dealer who's willing to give you a dollar more. I'll tell you what, go and try to get the other dealers to make you an offer, and then come see me! And if you're a dealer, and you can't tell me what you want for your own goods, I'll see you later--not!

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by packs

I absolutely hate hearing some dealer at a card show tell me what they have into a card when I ask about the price. Why do I care what you paid for something? If you made a bad buy, don't even bother putting it out. I'm not going to pay $200 more for a card because you did.

I'm not sure I believe most who tell me what they're into something they're selling any way. And even if it is the truth it does not affect what I'm willing to pay.

To the OPs post it should be the seller's responsibility to list a starting price. Listings with no asking prices are one of my pet peeves around here. Asking someone to negotiate against themself is equally ridiculous. If a price is set make an offer.

I do like Jake's note on his listings that any inquiry asking what's the lowest price you will take will be met with what's the most you will pay.

[Topnotchsy]

Originally Posted by Batpig

I hate this saying. What the heck is the point of having the cake if you can't eat it? I know the point is you can't eat the cake and still have it, but the phrasing is still annoying. For an alternative, I suggest "You can't sit in two chairs with one butt." Or maybe a more appropriate alternative for this situation is "You can't keep your card and sell it too."

Carry on.

Original statement was "you can't eat your cake and have it to"

[Jenx34]

In line with what you are saying, I was always taught in business never to bid against yourself. If you have a price posted then that is your price until someone makes you an offer to consider less. I hate it when I see people who say I'd like $100 but I'll take $80. Why bid against yourself?? If anyone ever asks me "what will you take?", I simply reply "My price is what's posted unless you make an offer that motivates me to change it."

As to your part 2... My wife and & decided to try and sell her old house by owner, hoping lightning would strike, so to speak. Apparently, these free courses people offer on how to flip houses, teach them to ask how much they owe on the house, in hopes they can make a low ball offer and "bail someone out". We can discuss trying to feed on the poor and desparate separately, but why in the hell how much I owe on a house is ANY of your business? It's such a stupid way of doing business, but people do it in all walks of life. I'm with you, I HATE IT. The same goes to dealers offering what they paid for a card unsolicited. I've found myself guilty of doing so before trying to justify the high price I have a card listed for, almost apologetically. I need to stop doing so.

Lastly, I'd like to add a 3rd pet peeve... I hate it when people try to tell me why the price I am asking is wrong and send me examples of lower priced cards sold. There is a difference when someone asks $800 for a $100 card. But if I price something at, near or even above high VCP, there is a reason. If you don't want to pay it, no problem. But don't lecture me!

[JollyElm]

Originally Posted by Topnotchsy

Original statement was "you can't eat your cake and have it to"

In the recent miniseries about how the FBI finally tracked down the Unabomber, that phrase took a front seat in the examinations and comparisons of text/writings in the case. I was laughing because I always hated the way the phrase is generally said (wrongly) in our country, "You can't have your cake and eat it too," and one of the things that led them to Kaczynski was his repeated use of the 'correct' wording of the phrase. Fascinating stuff.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Don't disagree it's annoying, but everyone is looking to make the best deal they can favoring them to the max. It's human nature.

There is a guy on ebay I've alluded to a few times who purchases items at AHs for a couple hundred bucks and often tries to sell on eBay a few days later for multiples of what he paid. I do think what he paid is a relevant point in any negotiation. If 20 people bid on something and it settles at $750, I think it's a little ridiculous to list it on eBay for $3700. But it's a free country and he can obviously try to sell it for $250,000 if he is so inclined. It annoys me but not a damm thing I can do about it.

well if that same seller likes to say 'i cant sell it for x because i have more than x into the card' Then they should be prepared for buyers who know how much another card they bought to offer them more than that number and state that.

I am assuming the new buyer people who are quoting what seller bought the card previously for are making their offer in the context of a 'reasonable range' comparable to prior sales.

People who are afraid to list prices usually are too scared to sell a card because they are worried they wont get enough so they want to just listen to offers which usually wont work out OR they want a ridiculous amount

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

er.

I do like Jake's note on his listings that any inquiry asking what's the lowest price you will take will be met with what's the most you will pay.

funny i was going to mention that..

[the-illini]

My pet peeve is when someone comes on a message board and repeatedly asks other people’s opinion on the value or authenticity of an item so that they can buy it and sell it for a profit instead of doing their own research...

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by the-illini

My pet peeve is when someone comes on a message board and repeatedly asks other people’s opinion on the value of an item so that they can buy it and sell it for a profit instead of doing their own research...

one could argue that doing that is part of doing their own research..

Ill add a pet peeve

'priced to sell' yet listed for years

[JollyElm]

Originally Posted by the-illini

My pet peeve is when someone comes on a message board and repeatedly asks other people’s opinion on the value or authenticity of an item so that they can buy it and sell it for a profit instead of doing their own research...

Amen times a frickin' million!!!!

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

one could argue that doing that is part of doing their own research..

Ill add a pet peeve

'priced to sell' yet listed for years

Couple of times, sure. On a regular basis? Not so much.

[AddieJoss]

Not pricing your cards in your case at a card show, so you look them up on sheet of paper for every card....or priced but on the back of the card.

[Snapolit1]

How about people who say they want to trade up to an iconic card worth six figures by stating clearly that their plan is to repeatedly give board members something worth less than what they receive in return.

Love those guys.

Just sayin.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

How about people who say they want to trade up to an iconic card worth six figures by stating clearly that their plan is to repeatedly give board members something worth less than what they receive in return.

Love those guys.

Just sayin.

Great Steve - I thought I was the only one who saw through that plan. LOL

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Topnotchsy

Original statement was "you can't eat your cake and have it to"

have it to what? To hold? To eat again? To smash in someone's face? I need to know

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

How about people who say they want to trade up to an iconic card worth six figures by stating clearly that their plan is to repeatedly give board members something worth less than what they receive in return.

Love those guys.

Just sayin.

Except I was trying to trade up to a 5 figure PSA 1 or 2 and didn't rip anyone off as every single trade partner on this site can attest to.

You need to be locked in the bathroom though because you're a mush.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by the-illini

My pet peeve is when someone comes on a message board and repeatedly asks other people’s opinion on the value or authenticity of an item so that they can buy it and sell it for a profit instead of doing their own research...

^^This^^ Plus those that lie and say it is for their personal collection only to find out they are full of it. They are only on here to make cash. Nothing wrong with being on here to make cash, just the lying part is BS.

[Snapolit1]

If any board member sends me $500 I will send them $300. Promptly. With a smile. All in fun of course.

But those buyers who try to get cards at a discount. Man those guys are kill joys.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by AddieJoss

Not pricing your cards in your case at a card show, so you look them up on sheet of paper for every card....or priced but on the back of the card.

or they look up the price in those fantasy price books and always at 'mint'

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by bnorth

^^This^^ Plus those that lie and say it is for their personal collection only to find out they are full of it. They are only on here to make cash. Nothing wrong with being on here to make cash, just the lying part is BS.

right selling the card to pay taxes or health or whatever......i just dont care of the reason for they buy or sell


I also like the guys that make posts about wanting to trade 4 or 5..low grade non-key cards for a 1951 bowman mantle

Its never someone wanting to sell a 1951 mantle psa 3 for a bunch of non rookie brooks robinson/Yaz etc.. always a 6 for 1 key iconic card ie.RC mantle/1933 ruth/t206 cobb

Those are the same guys that try to do 3 for 1 NL fantasy baseball trades...where its their 3 curtis granderson/#4 Starting pitcher and a .270 17 homer 70 rbi fill in the blank guy for bryce harper

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

How about people who say they want to trade up to an iconic card worth six figures by stating clearly that their plan is to repeatedly give board members something worth less than what they receive in return.

Love those guys.

Just sayin.

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

If any board member sends me $500 I will send them $300. Promptly. With a smile. All in fun of course.

But those buyers who try to get cards at a discount. Man those guys are kill joys.

You are seriously a ray of negative energy. Such a mush.

[Dewey]

Sellers want to sell for the most profit possible. Buyers want to buy for the lowest price possible. No duh, right? If someone doesn't make you an offer while asking you to negotiate against yourself, move on. I wouldn't even respond. Respond only to offers and legit item questions.

You ask, why not throw out a number that's fair? But that is precisely what is being negotiated. A potential buyer might ask, why not start with a number that is fair? I think you have items with very, very robust asking prices. Items where asking is 5-7.5x your purchase price (since I was underbidder or watcher of items you bought). And purchase prices were right about fair market value! Sorry, but I can't understand how you can cry foul about lowballers and be fine ripping the piss out of...in your words...active members of the communiy if they bought the item at asking.

Maybe I don't trust your pricing because I don't trust your expertise. I don't trust your write-ups or valuations, because you solicit much help from the board. My 2 cents.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Someone claiming they are leaving the hobby but their prices listed for their cards are 'make me leave the hobby' because they are priced waayyy to high

someone listing a card they have asking for comments how nice looking it is....and then suddenly a few days later an emergency/house needs to be bought (i already covered that issue) so now the card is listed for sale...

[Dewey]

OT: does your ebay store collect CA tax (since it says you are in CA) though you are in NY? I don't know how it works. But it always struck me as weird.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Dewey

OT: does your ebay store collect CA tax (since it says you are in CA) though you are in NY? I don't know how it works. But it always struck me as weird.

It is probably just one of many divisions of the brick and mortar store.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by Dewey

Sellers want to sell for the most profit possible. Buyers want to buy for the lowest price possible. No duh, right? If someone doesn't make you an offer while asking you to negotiate against yourself, move on. I wouldn't even respond. Respond only to offers and legit item questions.

You ask, why not throw out a number that's fair? But that is precisely what is being negotiated. A potential buyer might ask, why not start with a number that is fair? I think you have items with very, very robust asking prices. Items where asking is 5-7.5x your purchase price (since I was underbidder or watcher of items you bought). And purchase prices were right about fair market value! Sorry, but I can't understand how you can cry foul about lowballers and be fine ripping the piss out of...in your words...active members of the communiy if they bought the item at asking.

Maybe I don't trust your pricing because I don't trust your expertise. I don't trust your write-ups or valuations, because you solicit much help from the board. My 2 cents.

LOL aren't you the one that offers me $8 on 15 stubs? stop it.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by EYECOLLECTVINTAGE

LOL aren't you the one that offers me $8 on 15 stubs? stop it.

$9 for 15 stubs - final offer.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It is probably just one of many divisions of the brick and mortar store.

Originally Posted by Dewey

OT: does your ebay store collect CA tax (since it says you are in CA) though you are in NY? I don't know how it works. But it always struck me as weird.

The best is when people talk smack (like you two) but when I get something you need you come slithering out of your holes acting like everything is cool lol

I PRAY I get something you guys need bad, because I will never sell to either of you again.

Especially since you both nickel and dime me on $20 error cards and $15 undated ticket stubs lol

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Also Dewey,

How shall I gain expertise without asking questions? In just over a year I have learned more than I have ever expected in the ticket field, publication field , photo field, and much more. I have put in over 12 hours a day to the hobby, reading over 10 books, researching, asking questions, talking to experts, talking to dealers, talking to auction houses etc.

I am gonna be a force in a few years trust me. A big force. Everyone needs to start somewhere though. I am not scared to ask questions or look bad in the process if it means furthering my knowledge and or my career. I am not afraid of losing money and making bad buys, if it means learning a lesson and speeding up the learning curve.

My write ups take a lot of time and effort, and I put in hours of research on items, make calls to head authorities in the fields etc. so if me asking questions on the board makes you doubt me, then it's plain stupid.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by EYECOLLECTVINTAGE

The best is when people talk smack (like you two) but when I get something you need you come slithering out of your holes acting like everything is cool lol

I PRAY I get something you guys need bad, because I will never sell to either of you again.

Especially since you both nickel and dime me on $20 error cards and $15 undated ticket stubs lol

Please tell me and everyone else about any time I tried to nickel and dime you. We have had 2 transactions. 1) I slightly overpaid for a ticket stub I needed. 2) Several people made you trade offers on a group of 3 error cards and you accepted mine, so mine must have been the best offer.

I do know the return address from both transactions was to a brick and mortar card and memoribilia shop called Top Tier Collectibles.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Back to some of the original thoughts >gasp< I post a price on everything I sell, and the vast majority of my inventory at any given show is stickered. That still doesn't stop people from approaching me live, and online, with "what's the best you can do on that." It happens a lot. It doesn't bother me so much on a $20 card, but I don't want to try and make a living constantly selling at "the best I can do" on $1000 items!

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Please tell me and everyone else about any time I tried to nickel and dime you. We have had 2 transactions. 1) I slightly overpaid for a ticket stub I needed. 2) Several people made you trade offers on a group of 3 error cards and you accepted mine, so mine must have been the best offer.

I do know the return address from both transactions was to a brick and mortar card and memoribilia shop called Top Tier Collectibles.

Whats the brick and mortar store have to do with anything? I never understood your point.

Also the card I got from you in the 2nd transaction... well let's not get into that.