Update on PWCC Bid Monitoring Program

[Brent Huigens]

Dear members,

As some of you know, PWCC implemented a pilot program in partnership with eBay to limit the frequency of eBay users cancelling bids on our listings. This pilot program consists of several components including actions taken by eBay as well as actions taken by PWCC. The purpose of this post is to provide an update on this program.

As of April 1, 2017 PWCC places blocks on any user ID that has more than 10 bid cancellations in the past six months. This reflects a reduction in the number of allowed bid cancellations from 25 to 10. As the program continues to mature and continues to affect bidder behavior, PWCC will continue to reduce the threshold.

Overall, we are pleased to report that this program seems to be successfully reducing bid cancellations on our listings. You’ll see in the attached graph that while there is variety in the total amount of cancellations (generally mirroring the total number of items we have for sale each day), there has been a significant downward trend. While we used to see an average of about 14 cancellations per day, we are now seeing an average of five. We continue to work closely with eBay to highlight the problems associated with bid cancellations and ways to address them.

Thank you for your continued support of this important program.

[calvindog]

Lol

[JollyElm]

It should be a straight horizontal line at zero. Anything else is just ridiculous. Come on!!!!

Is this per listing?

[gnaz01]

Originally Posted by gobucsmagic74

is this per listing?

😂😂

[slidekellyslide]

Ummmm....Ebay allows bidders to make as many bid cancellations as they want to. Why are they in some "Pilot program" with you to try and reduce the number of bid cancellations when all they have to do is put an end to bid cancellations?

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

Is this per listing?

I'm not sure if you are being facetious, but I started laughing when I saw that post.....

I'd lower the number to 2 because I can imagine there are times when people bone head something, but 10x isn't a bone head mistake...

[CrackaJackKid]

So what he's saying is that there's only 10 fony bogus accounts shilling and bid retracting now than the previous 25 per item.

[Snapolit1]

I don't understand the hostility directed at PWCC for at least trying something. I have had real issues with them in the past unrelated to this issue, but it seems like some of you are expecting them to solve eBay weaknesses and cure a few diseases at the same time.

It may be a surprise to some of you, but PWCC can't tell eBay how to run their business. Yes, there is a problem with apparent shill bidding and BS bid retractions on some of their items. Maybe a not insignificant number of their items. There are consignors out there who will have friends and family, and maybe even themselves with alternative accounts, pump up the price of their auction items. This is an auction fact of life. Happens on eBay and happens everywhere else. Could happen at the church auction down the street. The guy bidding against you may have no interest other than helping someone else make more money. Deal with it. It's reality.

As far as bid retractions go, I have no evidence that they are worse for PWCC than any other major card seller. Nor do I have any belief that they are any worse than say some dude selling 10,000 hummels or 10,000 watches a month on ebay. Game playing will go on. If eBay allows people to retract bids with impunity, and PWCC reaches out to them to do something, I take this as both a tacit admission that there is a problem here that should be addressed and a positive sign that Brent thinks his company's credibility is taking a meaningful hit.

My final point is that I DO NOT find 5 bid retractions a day high for an outfit that often has 5,000+ items listed at a time. That might get 25,000+ bids in a day I'd guess. 5 or 10 or even 20 of those bids are retracted. I'd say at least 50% of those could have been genuine errors. Doesn't seem overly crazy to me.

Long winded way of saying that it seems many of you have real problems with eBay and blame PWCC for them.

If someone is retracting more than 5 times on PWCC in a 3 or 6 month period they should be barred from any PWCC auctions for 6 months. Although that probably wouldn't solve the problem anyway, as a person who wants to defraud others can just open a new account.

[JeremyW]

According to your graph, people who purchased items in the middle of September 2016 were extremely vulnerable. Am I mistaken?

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens

Dear members,

As some of you know, PWCC implemented a pilot program in partnership with eBay to limit the frequency of eBay users cancelling bids on our listings. This pilot program consists of several components including actions taken by eBay as well as actions taken by PWCC. The purpose of this post is to provide an update on this program.

As of April 1, 2017 PWCC places blocks on any user ID that has more than 10 bid cancellations in the past six months. This reflects a reduction in the number of allowed bid cancellations from 25 to 10. As the program continues to mature and continues to affect bidder behavior, PWCC will continue to reduce the threshold.

Overall, we are pleased to report that this program seems to be successfully reducing bid cancellations on our listings. You’ll see in the attached graph that while there is variety in the total amount of cancellations (generally mirroring the total number of items we have for sale each day), there has been a significant downward trend. While we used to see an average of about 14 cancellations per day, we are now seeing an average of five. We continue to work closely with eBay to highlight the problems associated with bid cancellations and ways to address them.

As others noted. you don't need to reduce the numbers. You simply need to be provided a line which you can cut people off at. That is on both Ebay and you to get correct if I am not mistaken. This whole post with the graph and all of that shit, is basically asking the people here if they are stupid.
Thank you for your continued support of this important program.

OK. So you are seeing 14 cancelled bids per day and the best you can do is this? This problem is way worse than anyone thought you may have known it could possibly be.

Re-read that.

Do you not get any transparency into this and have the ability to flag any of it to EBay based on your own judgment factor? I can't believe that to not be the case. This sounds like asses and elbows.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens

Dear members,
....

As of April 1, 2017 PWCC places blocks on any user ID that has more than 10 bid cancellations in the past six months.
.....

What are you doing to limit first time registrations now that you have blocked people from bidding? I have seen an influx of low feedback buyers in your auctions and to me, it looks like every single person you are quote un-quote blocking, is just registering for a new user id.

This compromises your entire graph and makes you look really, REALLY sub-intelligent. You have ZERO reputation management. You allow ebay to handle it all for you. You don't require a minimum feedback score to bid. This whole post is a freaking joke.

Lets seem some non paying bidder stats.

[toledo_mudhen]

Wow - Tuff Crowd Here...........

[Timbegs]

Just to weigh in a little...

I'm probably a good example of why you can't just blanket ban people based on criteria. I'm recently more active in the hobby after an absence, I have a low eBay feedback score (68) and I like to buy vintage cards. I don't do so too often, but I never cancel bids and always pay on time. And even for the smaller auction house websites - I lurk and if I see something, I'll sign up day of and bid on/win a desired lot. Now, it may suck for the guys who are better customers, bid all the time, follow the auction and are more active but this is how I do it - and at the end of the day, we're ALL merely trying to get what we want.

I tend to bid on some items in the last minute - definitely on a PWCC item or two over the years, I can't specifically recall what - because I KNOW that I am competing with snipers, autobidders and other people like me so, often, in the last 10-15 seconds of an auction, I put MY best bid in and hope for the best - sometimes double the current bid. I'm not shilling; I'm trying to win a timed auction. It looks and feels like 'someone screwed me' but in reality its just a different bidding style that has to do with the fact that I don't want my presence as a bidder known to the auctioneer, the other bidders or eBay, for a myriad of reasons.

[Rookiemonster]

I think it is a attempt at getting ducks in order. BUT can we now see the shady dealings chart ? I don't think eBay has a pilot program for shady dealings. ( ahh if you have 10 or more shady dealings I will not be doing business with you) I guess I got my own pilot program and it's working fine .

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Rookiemonster

I think it is a attempt at getting ducks in order. BUT can we now see the shady dealings chart ? I don't eBay has a pilot program for shady dealings. ( ahh if you have 10 or more shady dealings I will not be doing business with you) I guess I got my own pilot program and it's working fine .

Shady dealings include sending consignors their payments in cash instead of a check.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Timbegs

Just to weigh in a little...

I'm probably a good example of why you can't just blanket ban people based on criteria. I'm recently more active in the hobby after an absence, I have a low eBay feedback score (68) and I like to buy vintage cards.

You have not given any good example or reason that excludes existing problems from easy remediation.