PSA/DNA and JSA Question!

[pow323]

Can anyone tell me if you have known someone who sent in a Autograph item to PSA/DNA and have it come back as a fake autograph and then send it to JSA and they said it was ok? Or the other way around. Please Let me Know. Thanks! Marc

[Leon]

I will venture to guess that has happened at least hundreds of times...

[pow323]

Thanks Leon for the reply. Kinda crazy isn`t it! Marc

[thenavarro]

It has happened to items I've sent in, in both directions. While it's aggravating, I make mistakes in my job too and I'm pretty good at what I do. It is what it is.

Mike Navarro

[pow323]

Mike, Thank you also for the reply! I sent you an email but let me tell what happened on here. I sent an autographed card to PSA/DNA of Roberto Clemente and an autographed card of Carl Yaz. as a runner. They both came back as not there autographs. Well that is a LIE! because I was standing there when Yaz signed the card and have a picture of my wife standing along side of him. It cost me $137.00 for NOTHING as far as I am concerned. Tell me what I can do about this problem? Thanks for listening!! Marc

[thenavarro]

Marc,

Unfortunately, I don't have any real good advice for you. But, I can tell you that I've had items pass on the 2nd time in, when they failed the first time. The lack of consistency will drive you bonkers, but it happens. You might resend the Yaz by itself, or include it when someone else does a large order.

As to the Clemente, depending on what you want to do with the piece eventually (IE, hold,sell, trade, etc.), you might consider paying Richard Simon here on the board to authenticate it for you. But before you do that, just post a scan here, and people will probably be willing to help you out with an opinion. If the autograph guys think it might be legit, then you can send it to Richard Simon for a formal opinion. His opinion can be trusted on vintage baseball and some other areas.

Good luck, I hope you find a reasonable solution.

Mike Navarro

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by thenavarro

It has happened to items I've sent in, in both directions. While it's aggravating, I make mistakes in my job too and I'm pretty good at what I do. It is what it is.

Mike Navarro

But which opinion was "the mistake"? (And how do you know?)

[71buc]

I have had this Clemente item for over 20 years. I have never sent in for authentication due to it's large size and my desire not to remove it from the frame. I am considering doing so now. Before I go through the pain of taking it apart and submiting it I thought I would get some feedback here. Do you think it would pass PSA/DNA?

[T206Collector]

I submitted an admittedly awkwardly signed T206 of Davy Jones that was from Jeff Morey's collection to PSA/DNA. Thus, I knew it was good. But PSA/DNA said no. So i sent it to JSA, and it came back good.

You can't fault them for not authenticating good stuff (false negatives). I'd hope they err on the side of not authentic every time. It's the false positives you have to watch out for.

If you got the signature yourself, and JSA doesn't like the signature, you can't really fault them. If you do, then you do not really understand what the purpose of third-party authenticating is. You are not paying for 100% accuracy on the real stuff. You are paying to get as close as reasonably possible to weeding out the fakes.

[RichardSimon]

Why do you think you see the same auction houses and ebay sellers with COA's from both JSA and PSA?
It is because they shop authenticators till they find one (they hope) who will issue a COA for their item.

[pow323]

That Clemente sig. looks like the same one I sent in and PSA/DNA said it was a fake. I would not send anything in to PSA/DNA ever again. I would use JSA. They are more friendly anyway! PSA/DNA talks like you owe them something and that you are a low life!!!

[keithsky]

People are so brainwashed anymore with 3rd party grading it's out of control. All it is is an opinion whether someone thinks it's real or not. Heck send me your money and I'll give you my opinion on an item. I laugh my butt off when I'm at an autograph show and someone is standing in line getting an autograph IN PERSON and walk around the corner to PSA or JSA and spend money to have them authenticate the item they just saw signed. Even funnier when they tell them it isn't any good after they just had it signed.

[sicollector1954]

Or how about when they do authenticate an item and issue a COA and then you send it back to them 10 years later to be graded and now all of a sudden they change their minds!!!

[pow323]

OK! Here is my Roberto Clemente Autograph that I would like to have an opinion on weather I should send it to Richard Simon or JSA to have it Authenticated! Please let me know what you think? You can post here or email me at mpowers23@verizon.net Thanks, Marc

[Piedmont Sport]

For me and my Company it has been our biggest problem - Your damned if you do and damned if you don't - we submit to both PSA and JSA - and get stomach pains with both - but overall JSA has been the most consistent - lets not forget James Spence started PSA/DNA - and Jim has had many years collecting autographs - It's not a perfect science and many times it's a quick glance and move to the next auto - many times it's fail because of where the autograph came from - These issues will always continue because were human BUT - at least it's another set of eye's and it's certainly easier selling an item with a full letter from JSA or PSA/DNA - many times the buyer requires it. It's a serious issue. So many people are coming out and saying there the one that knows more than the other guy - hard to trust anyone at this point other than yourself.

[pow323]

Bump for Opinion on Clemente Autograph. Thank you!!

[canjond]

Marc - I'll weigh in although I'm by far an expert on Clemente signatures. Personally, I'm not that excited with it.

[ss]

Agree. I wouldn't touch that one.

[pow323]

Thanks Jon and Steve that is what I needed to hear! Thanks for your imput! Marc

[Ringking]

Originally Posted by pow323

Can anyone tell me if you have known someone who sent in a Autograph item to PSA/DNA and have it come back as a fake autograph and then send it to JSA and they said it was ok? Or the other way around. Please Let me Know. Thanks! Marc

IF a item is failed by PSA, they put some sort of mark on the item with their DNA dalb, to mark it as a failed item.

They were burned one to many times in stings, like the story on Autograph Alert with JSA and CLM items.

So, now all the stings that happen are almost always JSA as he does not put anythign on your item, he will just base it on who looked at it before him, like in the story.

You can read about PSA being tricked also on behindthegavel.com