Question about Old Picture + Lefty Grove Photo with Car....

[leftygrove10]

I picked up a couple pictures recently that I am excited to have....

The first picture is a baseball team. The picture (which I think you would call a cabinet photo -- correct me if I'm wrong) originated from Lonaconing, MD -- the small town where Lefty Grove and I both grew up (albeit at different times....). I have asked people in town to try to help me identify some of the players on the team, which might help narrow down the date of the photo. Notice the "L" on the uniform of the guy second from left. I am guessing that the "L" stands for "Lonaconing", but I really have no way of knowing for sure. I don't know why only one uniform would have an "L". Perhaps he was a player/manager? I am guessing that the photo was taken around 1900. Can any of you "equipment experts" help refine the date for me? Regardless of the date, I just love this picture. It is really cool!



The second picture that I picked up is a picture of Lefty Grove with a Nash Sedan. It is a great picture! I haven't done the research to refine the date of the photo, but I am guessing it was taken around 1929 or 1930 in Philadelphia. The photo is just absolutely stunning!

[slidekellyslide]

The top photo I would say is circa 1908-15..the guy wearing the different uniform probably played for a different team, but may have been filling in that day. And I don't know my automobiles well enough to tell you a date on the Lefty photo..if you hi-res scan the license plate you may be able to find the exact year.

[leftygrove10]

Here's a blow-up of the license plate....



The link below shows license plates from Maryland....



The 1927 and 1929 are similar... Based on my high res scan above, it looks more like a 1929 than a 1927. The question is, did they change license plates every year back then, or were they able to keep a given license plate for several years?

[slidekellyslide]

Looks like a 1929..and yes, you got a new plate every year.

[leftygrove10]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

Looks like a 1929..and yes, you got a new plate every year.

Really? What a pain for the motor vehicles people... But that certainly helps me nail down the year.... Thanks!

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by leftygrove10

Really? What a pain for the motor vehicles people... But that certainly helps me nail down the year.... Thanks!

Not nearly as many cars on the road in 1929 as there are today...I doubt they thought of it as a pain..more like easy money.

[Jay Wolt]

Brad, great pickups, they are fantastic.

[steve B]

Some states let you use a vintage plate on an antique car if they're the same year. Pretty cool to see a 1929 car with 1929 plates.

Certainly looks like a 29 nash.
http://www.pnwnash.org/common/gallery.php?year=1929

Although the close years look similar. The people at that site will probably know for sure.

Steve B

[leftygrove10]

Thanks, Steve.... I sent an email to the guy from the Nash website.... I'll let you know what he has to say....

[leftygrove10]

Originally Posted by leftygrove10

Thanks, Steve.... I sent an email to the guy from the Nash website.... I'll let you know what he has to say....

I did get an email back from the guy at the website and he is going to shop the photo around to the other members of his club to see if they can give a positive identification of the model and year. He did have a guess, but I don't know want to post his guess here just yet, as I want others from his club to make their own indepedent identification. He did say that he was "no expert on pre-war cars", which I thought was hysterical! I sent him the link to this page and no doubt he looked around net54 a bit while he was here.

[steve B]

That's the really incredible thing about the internet. No matter how odd something is you're seldom more than a couple emails from an expert.

I'm on a list for people that collect oldracing bicycles- Far less mainstream than cards or even cars. One guy bought a bike and asked about info on when it was made. The second reply was something like "5 april 1979 probably before lunch." After a reply about not kidding around the next response was from the same guy. He had built it, and the serial number was in his notebook under 5 april. Plus it was the third one of six on the page hence the probably before lunch comment!


Steve B

[leftygrove10]

I got some responses from the Nash car guys. Lefty's car is a 1929 Nash, Advance Six, Two-door sedan, model 463. The car sold for around $1480 brand new in 1928.

In case you guys are curious, here is what the Nash car guys had to say. (I have removed their names to protect the innocent.)

Your photo provoked some interesting discussion among our on-line members. The number of lugs on the wheels seems to be significant in determining it's age. The following is the most detailed and I believe the most authoritative reply. It is from xxx, a former editor of the club's national newsletter, an avid collector of old photos with Nash cars in them, and an owner of several vehicles of the same vintage as the car in the photo.

Quote:
Hello xxx,
Nice to hear from you. Thanks for the photo and link showing the Nash, its one I had not seen before. The photo shows a 1929 Nash. It's from the largest series, the "Advance Six". The body type is a 2 door sedan, so the specific model number is 463 (I had two of them). You can inform the people at that website, that the car is known as a 1929 Nash, Advance Six, Two-door sedan, model 463.

The 20" wheels on that car are the 5 lug disc, supplied by Budd. They share the same brake drums that Nash used when a car was supplied with the Budd brand, 5 lug wire wheels. However, Nash Motors changed to the "Cleve-Weld" brand of disc wheels, midway in production of their 1929 Advance Six cars. The newer Cleve-Weld disc wheels required a 7 lug brake drum. They are the type of disc wheels most often seen on the 1929 Nash, Advance Six cars.

I wanted to point out that detail, in an effort to help date the photo. The condition of the car (and the tires) look brand new and we know the 1929 Nash cars were introduced on June 1st, 1928. I looked at the enlarged photo of the license plate, but couldn't tell if the year is really 1928 or 1929. If the person you spoke with is sure the plate reads 1929, then I would suggest the photo must have been taken very early in that year, for the car to be wearing those type wheels with new tires.

I have attached a photo showing another model 463 with the same type of wheels. I have no information about this photo, it's just an old one from my collection.
Kind regards,
xxxx
End Quote

Another fellow agreed, writing:
The car is a 400 series 463 model advanced 6 twin ignition sedan and is known as a 1929 year model But the production started in 1928 mid year.
All the best,
xxxxx
End Quote

So I'm thinking Lefty has his picture taken with his new Nash (he had good taste in cars!). It's a 1929 Advance Six 2-door Trunk Sedan, Model 463. There were 8 models in the high-range 460 line, and total production for the line was 44,300. There is no breakdown for production of the individual models. Nash made 49,132 in the mid-range Special Six line, and 97,031 of the low price Standard Six line. The model 463 had a retail price of $1,480 in June 1928, which dropped to $1,430 by August 1929. As a 2-door sedan, it was among the cheaper models in the 460 line. It shipping weight was 3,760 lbs. It had a six cylinder 78 horsepower engine with 258 cubic inch displacement. The wheelbase was 121 inches. It could hold 5 passengers. Probably the most interesting feature about the model is that it had twin ignition (two spark plugs for each cylinder). 1929 was the first year for the twin ignition, which they used through 1941. Lefty appears to have been an "early adapter" when it came to motor car trends!