Frank Chance signed T206...Opines Wanted

[pscolgrafs]

What do you guys make of this T206? After all, Chance did perish in 1924 and this would muck the theory that all T206 cards were signed in the 1950's to 1970's.

[HexsHeroes]

.
.
. . . to most ideas.

Personally, I am alittle bias, because I too have a signed T-206 (but from an unremarkable ballplayer) who died well before the 1940's.

I know the signature on the card I have is very similar to the exemplars I have viewed. And opinions from other knowledgeable collectors/dealers have also been positive. You do the best you can, using the resources available, to make an educated guess, and hopefully it withstands the scrutiny of time.

That said, I shall step off my soapbox.

Thanks.

[Jacklitsch]

If the exemplar in Mark Allen Baker's Baseball Autograph Handbook (1990) and the analysis of Chance's signature is accurate the signed T206 card doesn't pass the smell test.

[prewarsports]

It looks like it was one of those cards with "autographs" that surfaced about 2004 on ebay. The cards were all real but the signatures were all bad and in the same hand. I dont even think they were signed with the intent to deceive but possible just some kid screwing around in the 1970's with some old cards or something because the signatures were not copied from exemplars but all signed the same way. You could get some good deals though on the cards themselves, I bought a John Ward Buchner for $50 because the autograph was bviously bad. I bet that is where this one comes from, it looks very similar to the other signed cards that person was selling.

[pscolgrafs]

No, I remember (and actually pulled the scans) from that wonderful collection of signed T206 cards (Waddell, Jennings etc.)..like five cards and the lot sold for $100 (around there). It was all in pen and the person who sold them admitted that he thought it was some kid with a pen writing on the card. The sad part was that it was purchased with the intent to defraud by another seller (he said he was not sure of the authenticity of the signatures) and he was able to make a 400% profit. That's what I recall.

[Jantz]

I can't say because I know nothing about pre-war autographs, but Beckett/JSA seem to think it is authentic.

Do you know that card has been laminated?


Jantz

[baseballart]

from the auction description

1909-11 Frank Chance Signed T206 Tobacco Card. Are you looking for a real collecting challenge? Try your hand at autographed tobacco cards. Here we present one of the only examples we've ever encountered, and what a great name to find! The last stop in the game's most famous double-play combination, and the first manager of the team officially known as the New York Yankees (after dropping their "Highlanders" nickname upon the move to the Polo Grounds) has provided a stunning 10/10 black fountain pen autograph upon the face of this card removed from a pack of Sweet Caporal cigarettes. It must be noted that the card is laminated, but this action is certainly largely to thank for the Hall of Fame autograph's unimprovable condition. Encapsulated in a Beckett/JSA slab for protection and unquestioned authenticity. Guide Value or Estimate: $4,000 - $6,000.

http://sports.ha.com/common/view_ite...o=81773#Photo\

[Jantz]

Max - I see we think alike.

Jantz

[J.McMurry]

I believe the theory is that very few to zero T206's were signed during the featured players playing days,which would be the 1908-1911 time period,aproximately. The Chance was likely signed during his managerial stint.

[collectbaseball]

Why is it thought that so few T206s were signed during the players' playing days? Just curious.

[danc]

Because nobody thought of it at the time. It would probably be considered a bizarre act to get the person on the tobacco card, to write his own name on it. The hobby wasn't the hobby back then.

Cards were a gimmick, a way to advertise the smoke brands and I highly doubt that it was the goal of the smoker to collect every possible card and from every manufacturer, either.

When you see autographs during that time, it's often in the form of clipped letters (or letters), documents, maybe a calling card, almost never a ball.

Nobody was waiting in the parking lot for these guys as I think they would have been flattered at the time, and amused by the gesture.

DanC