Need help ID of three different Prewar cards or premiums...

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Posted By: T E

I've got another oddball group here. 2 HOFs and one "who?" Lindstrom is 4 1/2" by 3 3/8" or so, Traynor is 5 3/8" by 3 1/4" and Mann is 3 1/4" by 2"


All are blank-backed. Mann card has been hand stamped on reverse by a confectioner. Mann card is sharpest of the group, perhaps it is the sort of card I should have graded?

As always, thanks in advance...

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Posted By: Jeff Drum

You appear to have a Nat. Chicle "Fine Pen" of Traynor, a Kashin Publishing card (bottom right). Not sure of the other without seeing the back.

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Posted By: T E

Thanks Jeff, here is reverse of Mann card...

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Posted By: Todd Schultz

is a Henry Johnson Confectioner's stamped card, considered by some to be stamped on w575-1, by some to be stamped on E121, and by some to have been stamped decades after the fact, on either an original or reprinted card.

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Posted By: T E

Looking into my outdated 1999 Sports Collectors Digest Standard Catalog of Baseball Cards, I don't see Mann listed in these issues. Am I missing it?

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Posted By: fkw

The Traynor is a R313, The Lindstrom is a R316 Kashin.

Now the bad news...That particular Johnson Confectioners card is a reprint. Without even seeing the back I knew it was a reprint from the cut, caption, and photo qualitly of the front. The caption is from the E135 but is missing the number.

The authentic Johnsons Confectioners backs are different in style and boldness, and the printing is a different color and quality. The card you have is similar to the Kendig Chocolate and Oodles Candy fakes that are seen from time to time.

BTW authentic H.Johnson cards are actually stamped blank backed E121 style cards, not W575-1 cards. There is a difference in photo qualtity and back surface slickness between the W575-1 and the blank backed E121 cards. And the H.Johnson cards are machine cut, not hand cut like the W575-1 or W501 cards.


authentic Henry Johnson back

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

fkw is telling you true stuff...

Do you have a black light to shine on that little card?? If so, I think it will shine and reveal its true nature, a fake.

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Posted By: leon

Personally, I can't tell from the scan about the E135-like card. Out of the 50-60 Johnson Confection cards I have seen I have never seen one on an E135 front. That makes me think it probably isn't good, as Frank does. I still have a little trouble distinguishing the W575-1 vs the E121 blank backs stock....I sort of always thought those were W575's....I will have to get mine out tomorrow and check them. At any rate get a magnifying glass and check the white borders for a dot pattern. If there is one it's a reprint. Even if there is not you need to check a few other things. Personally, I haven't been able to do too good with fluorescence but I know it works on some substances/marks. Wouldn't hurt to see how it fluoresces. I also like to look at the gloss, though I have almost been faked out on that before. I believe uneven gloss would be difficult to fabricate so if it has that it could be real. Lastly the card should be smooth. I like to hold the card and feel the paper to see if it is. I won a nice #1 Fro Joy (portrait) on ebay last week for $26....got it yesterday and the gloss is uneven and the card is smooth as a baby's behind. It feels and looks real and doesn't have any dots in the white. My guess is about 98% or more of the Fro Joys on ebay are fake. This one isn't though...Good luck with these..

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Posted By: fkw

These cards are brought up on this message board about 1-3 times a year, usually its a Kendig backstamp, and usually after one hits eBay.

I was actually fooled on the Kendig cards about 7 years ago myself.

Here is a good post below

http://www.network54.com/Forum/153652/message/1154101470/

There are many posts on them if you try seaches with "Kendig" or "Oodles".

BTW There is actually a PSA graded Oodles fake card floating around somewhere.

This is the first H. Johnson back Ive seen of these fakes. So it was good it was brought to our attention.

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Posted By: leon

I owned the Oodles chocolate fake card....bought it from a good seller on ebay and sent it to SGC where they deemed it counterfeit. I returned it and next thing I see it shows up on ebay in a PSA7 holder. The seller pulled the card as it should not have been in a holder. He said he actually sent it in by mistake with some others and it got holdered. I spoke with him at length at this last National (where I picked up a recent ebay win from him) and he told me there was a huge controversy at PSA about it. I absolutely believe this guy as he seems very honest (and did all the right things too) Something about a lawsuit and all kinds of crap after the fact. Really a big stink about it. It is fake and it did get into a PSA 7 holder. For the record, while I think they all make mistakes, I don't think too many fake cards get graded by the big 4 grading companies. This was a fluke they knew nothing about but really should have caught the weird paper. These cards all have that "rough" texture, and that is what made me think the Oodles was fake too. I have owned many fake cards and many of the 1928 era have the rough feel to them. regards

btw, the Oodles card didn't have the period gloss to it either...another telltale sign...

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Posted By: T E

I'm assuming this Mann card is fake. I bought it on eBay several years ago, don't think I paid much for it. It will go into my Hall of Shame.

From time to time I get snookered, but it is all in the game. I have never complained when I have made a deal lopsided in my direction. But I don't know how people can knowingly sell fakes and live with themselves. Jeez, if you are that desperate for money, go out and get a job!

Off to eBay go the other two cards!