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  #21  
Old 10-17-2013, 01:36 PM
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Jason Simonds
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What is the solution?

Seriously, this question is always asked in these "witch-hunt" threads, but it is never answered. The silence is deafening.

Brent, at one point your auction pictures looked like someone was tripping on acid and painted a baseball card with an array of highlighters. It's okay to adjust the contrast a little, but you went over board in the past. I think your pictures now look much more realistic and you found an appropriate middle-ground; thank you for listening to our advice.

Also, several auctions appear shilled. I personally don't think there is a solution to this epidemic, but DON'T WORRY, ullmandds, Runscott, Peter_Spaeth and the-illini all have viable solutions for you!

Lets hear it.
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  #22  
Old 10-17-2013, 01:42 PM
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Brent (hi Brent) is great to work with as an advertiser. He seems like a nice guy too.
I have bid and won nice cards in his auctions and will continue. That being said, I hope he will consider banning ebayers from his auctions with inordinate amounts of bid retractions. More than about 2 per year is probably unacceptable. So there is at least part of a solution, Pete and Jason.....
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Last edited by Leon; 10-17-2013 at 01:43 PM.
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  #23  
Old 10-17-2013, 01:44 PM
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I think it's possible to monitor auctions over a certain threshold to check for consignors bidding up their own items, or suspicious patterns of bidding by bidders with huge numbers of retractions in their recent history. I would start there.
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  #24  
Old 10-17-2013, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
Brent (hi Brent) is great to work with as an advertiser. He seems like a nice guy too.
I have bid and won nice cards in his auctions and will continue. That being said, I hope he will consider banning ebayers from his auctions with inordinate amounts of bid retractions. More than about 2 per year is probably unacceptable. So there is at least part of a solution, Pete and Jason.....
wouldn't this hurt some of these ebay consignment places? one of the advantages of being a consignor there is how easy it is to shill up your items.
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  #25  
Old 10-17-2013, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by chaddurbin View Post
wouldn't this hurt some of these ebay consignment places? one of the advantages of being a consignor there is how easy it is to shill up your items.
I don't think it is ever bad to get rid of fraud. Maybe in the short run the numbers will go down a little bit, but in the long run Karma is a MOFO.....just my opinion....
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  #26  
Old 10-17-2013, 02:06 PM
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Jason Simonds
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I think it's possible to monitor auctions over a certain threshold to check for consignors bidding up their own items, or suspicious patterns of bidding by bidders with huge numbers of retractions in their recent history. I would start there.
You think it's possible?

You have been complaining about Brent since yesterday on this thread and you're uncertain if there is even a solution to te issue you are protesting?

But okay, your solution is we check the bidding activity on items above a certain threshold for consignors bidding on their own items. That's a start.

Brent currently has 11,318 completed listings on his ebay account spanning 3 auctions. What are we making the threshold? How about $250. I certainly would be sour if I was bid up on a $250 card. There are 2,219 listings above $250. Since each listing started at $.99 they all had anywhere from 20 to 30 bids (sometimes more) and usually around 10 unique bidders. I timed myself looking at each bidder on a single item to determin how many bid retractions they have had and what there bidding pattern was - it took me 2 minutes and 37 seconds. In the end, I do not believe it was shilled. It would take me over 96 hours to go through each auction above our threshold and in the end we would only have a handful of "suspicions". Of course, it would take me much longer to some how cross reference each bidding ID with the consignors information (which isn't possible) and after all that we were able to block MAYBE a dozen accounts.

Now, we're forgetting that the consignor may snipe his auction (so there's nothing we can do about that) and the consignor may create a new account not under his name (which would also make things difficult).

Please, someone walk us through a solution that would be able to solve this whole ordeal.

Last edited by jhs5120; 10-17-2013 at 02:08 PM.
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  #27  
Old 10-17-2013, 02:26 PM
AustinMike AustinMike is offline
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JHS5120 - I like your solution. Keep head buried in sand, claim it can't be fixed, and move on. With that attitude, I guess I can safely assume that you don't bother to ever lock your home or car doors. After all, burglaries happen and you can't stop them, right? So why bother to lock or even close your doors?

Leon had a great solution ... don't allow anyone with 2 or more bid retractions to bid on the auctions. You didn't address that.

How about, don't let anyone with an ebay account created when the card was consigned, or after, bid on the card without contacting the consignment house? That would prevent the consignor from creating a new account simply to bid on his card.

And I'm sure there are other ways to combat the problem other than throwing one's hands in the air and claiming it can't be done.
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  #28  
Old 10-17-2013, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinMike View Post
Leon had a great solution ... don't allow anyone with 2 or more bid retractions to bid on the auctions. You didn't address that.
I did address it. It would take approximately 96 hours to look at the amount of bid retractions for every bidder on every auction (with a threshold above $250). Which is only covering 20% of PWCC's auction. I think we can both agree that isn't a solution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinMike View Post
How about, don't let anyone with an ebay account created when the card was consigned, or after, bid on the card without contacting the consignment house? That would prevent the consignor from creating a new account simply to bid on his card.
It would take even longer to look up every account creation date and then cross-reference that to when the consignment was received and that would end up being a purely speculative process. Brent might as well quit auctioning items and just work full time trying to nab shillers.

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Originally Posted by AustinMike View Post
I'm sure there are other ways to combat the problem other than throwing one's hands in the air and claiming it can't be done.
I agree.

Some of the greatest minds in the hobby frequent this board, I am genuinly interested in hearing a viable solution to the problem.

If we're going to sit at our computers and bash a small business owner, how about we put in a little bit of thought and figure out a solution.

Last edited by jhs5120; 10-17-2013 at 02:42 PM.
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  #29  
Old 10-17-2013, 02:45 PM
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Jason, why can't Brent tell us his thoughts on these issues instead of you? Doesn't he have more invested in concerns about the fraud that might be occurring in his auctions than you do?

And why are we responsible for cleaning up his auctions? I wasn't aware of that responsibility. I thought our responsibility started and ended with the rules of his auction.

Last edited by calvindog; 10-17-2013 at 02:57 PM.
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  #30  
Old 10-17-2013, 03:11 PM
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If it takes 96 man-hours to check for retracting bidders, then hire help to do just that. As the problem is attacked it should start to get under control, with bid retractors blocked. As for new accounts being prohibited as potential shills, you can simply deny bidders with less than 5 or 10 feedback from bidding unless they get approval–no need to check account creation dates.

And no one said you have to run 12,000 auctions at a time. Turning away consignors (or postponing their orders) may seem like anathema, but the excuse of “I’m making too much money to care how I make it” is a non-starter with me. SHOW SOME INITIATIVE.
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