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  #1  
Old 07-13-2006, 10:40 AM
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Default References Requested: Wade Carsel

Posted By: David

Has anyone made large mail purchases from "wadecarsel"? Would you send $10,000+ in the mail to his PO box? He refuses to sign a 2-3 line contract. No Paypal and I offered to pay the fees. I stated FedEx for the bank check. He played dumb and stated ''I still don't understand how FedEx fits into the equation''? My reply, ''I will send the Wells Fargo certified check tomorrow via FedEx overnight'' copy / pasted from the previous email sent to him. No reply yet from this email. I requested a physical (home) address not a PO Box.

He feels much older to me, not computer saavy or service oriented. He could not email images (but his g/f might in a few days) and was not willing provide cert #s until payment arrives. Strange! Images would likely ease some of my fears. No attempt to ease my fears besides telling me, since 1979, a full time dealer. So what! The one reference was a magazine editor. I have never heard of this guy (good / bad). How about a web site or some data on Google? I could not find a thing so also asked for an eBay ID / website and waiting.

I have a somewhat bad feeling so posting this info request. Could anyone provide insights into Wade with even a yes / no type statement. What would you do in my situation? I want the cards but not with big risk. The more this exposes me to risk (100% at this point), the less I want to buy any of the cards. The likely smart thing for me to do is slow down the deal, wait for scans or find someone near Cleveland I know to make the deal in person.

Please email directly.

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  #2  
Old 07-13-2006, 10:46 AM
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Posted By: barrysloate

I seem to remember Wade from a long time ago, big body building guy if I am not confusing him with someone else, and he's a good guy, been in the hobby forever. But if you are nervous sending 10K in the mail to a stranger, why are you doing it?

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  #3  
Old 07-13-2006, 11:39 AM
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Posted By: TONY

I used to deal with wade many yrs ago.......never heard anything negative on him....but again haven't dealt with him since early 90's

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  #4  
Old 07-13-2006, 12:08 PM
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Posted By: Josh K.

Dont know him, but I wouldnt send the money based on what you've stated thus far.

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  #5  
Old 07-13-2006, 12:10 PM
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Posted By: Seth B.

Don't know him either, but if you're willing to spend 10K, why not spend another $200 on a plane ticket and do the transaction in person?

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  #6  
Old 07-13-2006, 12:16 PM
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Posted By: Jim F

I do not know this person nor have I ever heard of him. That being said, I wouldn't touch this deal with a 10 foot pole!! This guy wants to make a $10k deal and can't even run out to buy a $50 scanner to send you pics? No cert numbers, no physical address? He has not givin you any proof that the cards even exist. And you're actually thinking about it?!? There lure of a good deal always clouds peoples judgements, you're ignoring every red flag. A respectable collector/dealer does not deal in this manner. Jim

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  #7  
Old 07-13-2006, 12:24 PM
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Posted By: Joe D.

makes sense to me.

On a 10K purchase you are uncomfortable with... do the transaction in person.

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  #8  
Old 07-13-2006, 12:29 PM
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Posted By: Keith O'Leary

I remember the name from the 90s. Can't remember anything negative, but I'd play it safe and not be sorry.

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  #9  
Old 07-13-2006, 01:31 PM
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Posted By: scott brockelman

Wade has been a non-sports dealer for many,many years and has been a regular at the National and Ft. Washington many times as well. The magazine he probably referred to was "The Wrapper" a non-sports card publication, where he has advertised forever. While I cannot personaly vouch for him on this deal, he has been a long time upstanding member of the hobby, however as you seemed to have sense he is a little bit different, nothing wrong with that, there are alot of different personalities in this hobby/world. He takes things at a very slow pace, no hurries, no rush, etc

Would I be afraid to do a mail deal with him? NO

I would suggest contacting him again and ask how he might like to consumate the deal.

Scott

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  #10  
Old 07-13-2006, 01:34 PM
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Posted By: mike wrenn

No scan, No home address, No signed 2-3 line contract
NO DEAL. How do you know this is his real address or real name. Many businesses offer P.O Boxes from printing stores to hollywood video and Blockbuster video. Places that offer post office boxes are a dime a dozen in New York where I live. I don't care if his name is real. You have to be able to find him if necessary. Any person with any credibility would send you a scan and a home Address, otherwise this guy sounds fishy. Even if all turns out well I would find it immpossible to deal with a guy this vauge. Just being Honest. Also if the guy is not legit and you have to hire a private investigtor to find him you could be out $10,000 on the deal plus Min $5000 to hire a PI if the PI can't locate him.

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  #11  
Old 07-13-2006, 01:49 PM
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Posted By: leon

So far I still have never been scammed by anyone that would talk on the phone (knock on wood). Sometimes a friendly phone conversation will alleviate fears. Like Scott B said he might just be an old timer and not want the hassle of all this technical crap. If he won't speak with you on the phone then by all means I wouldn't do the deal. If he does then I bet you can get a warm fuzzy and follow through. There are more folks like this one than one would imagine. Most people in the US still don't have internet at their homes, I believe. good luck and let us know how it turns out....

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  #12  
Old 07-13-2006, 02:00 PM
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Posted By: scott brockelman

here is the editor of the magazine he advertises in with his contact info. ask him for his advice.

Les Davis, 1811 Moore Court, Saint Charles IL 60174, USA

(630) 443-9690 email leswrap@cs.com

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  #13  
Old 07-13-2006, 03:18 PM
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Posted By: David

I appreciate the emails and comments on this great forum! (1) email was very negative for non receipt. I also contacted Les but all he could tell me is Wade was a subscriber and paid. What I am looking for is someone that dealt with Wade on LARGE deals and what terms were honored. The suggestion to speak on the phone is a great idea!!! Another issue, the # is unlisted. Maybe he would meet me at the airport. However, it is unlikely due to previous inflexibility. I am still researching what to do and will wait for the untimely email to arrive back to me with a curve ball.

Thanks to all for taking time to read, post and send emails. An email arrived mentioning non receipt of eBay cards and a Paypal claim was necessary. I have now located the eBay ID for Wade. He does have Paypal. Maybe it is Wade's turn to trust me and my numerous big industry contacts. When this possible deal has been completed or shelved, I will report the story with images.

Best,
David

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  #14  
Old 07-13-2006, 03:41 PM
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Posted By: leon

You have to correspond with him somehow ....telegraph, smoke signals, email or something. When you correspond with him then I would ask if he could chat with you for a few minutes on the phone and ask for his #. If there is no way to get a warm fuzzy about your transaction then I would also be careful. The gentleman is probably good but it's always good to verify.....

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  #15  
Old 07-13-2006, 04:19 PM
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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

For whatever this is worth.......I have known and made deals with Wade going
back to the Willow Grove, PA days in the 1980's. Wade is mainly into non-sports
cards nowadays and he has a vast set-up at the Ft. Washington Show. I've enjoyed
doing business with him for many years.

The comment by some that he uses a PO BOX as an address casts doubts on him,
has to be one of the most ridiculous comments I have heard all these years in this
hobby.
And, I say if you are doing many transactions, and especially big deals through the
mail, you are a fool if you are not using a PO BOX for a mailing address. And, I recom-
mend a small branch Post Office nearby where you can get personalized service.
Which really comes in handy when problems arise.

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  #16  
Old 07-13-2006, 04:20 PM
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Posted By: Cobby33

Try an escrow company or locating a PI in his jurisdiction. No joke. If you can't make it yourself, have someone else complete the trasnaction for you.

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  #17  
Old 07-13-2006, 04:25 PM
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Posted By: Gary Nuchereno

I have known wade 25 years going back to shows in strongsville Ohio. He is different but very honest and I wouldn't worry about his integrity. He sets up at most
nationals and indeed is mostly a non-sports dealer. 10k is
a big enough deal to take a ride if you are on the east coast
and if you are on the west coast see if he will be at the national and do your deal there.

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  #18  
Old 07-13-2006, 05:01 PM
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Posted By: David

I asked to complete the deal at the National and will have a table. Unfortunately, Wade mentioned the cost is prohibitive and is looking forward to the following National (in his backyard). This does not sounds like a 'big time dealer since 1979'. A PO box would normally not create red flags but does to me due to the lack of willingness to accept any form of payment that would protect my interests in the slightest including or a document. Who in the world would not sign a 2-3 line 'contract' stating the terms of the deal and the parties involved. I even offered to pay for all FedEx overnight fees. This does not create an expense and can be picked up from his home.

If a credit card was involved, home address or some comforting communications, the deal would have already been completed. I am in a holding pattern and enjoying the 5.50% interest rate, for now. Since I am on the West Coast. Paying for a plane ticket (and finding the time) is a deal breaker. I will offer Wade a 1/2 price plane ticket to the National and free admission, if interested. However, everything I have tried to do protect my interests has met resistance. The email from him just arrived with images but Wade did not address my FedEx home address request. Dealing with Wade is virtually impossible (unless in person) or one sided in regards to risk.

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  #19  
Old 07-13-2006, 05:38 PM
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Posted By: David

I have decided not to pursue the deal.

Regards,
David

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  #20  
Old 07-13-2006, 05:49 PM
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Posted By: Joann

Well, as usual, a day late and a dollar short with input.

But if he is genuinely trying to protect his privacy and not revealing home address, that explains the discomfort with anything at all FedEx - they won't deliver to PO's.

So ... maybe offer to mail the contract to the PO office, include a SASE and wait for return mail?

Just thinking out loud.

Joann

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  #21  
Old 07-13-2006, 05:58 PM
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Posted By: scott brockelman

I have bought and sold a few baseball cards, but have never requested nor been asked to execute a contract of any kind. What is the purpose of such?

I think Wade may be more than slightly miffed as why he is being asked to jump thru so many hoops on what is not a huge dollar transaction in the card world.

Scott

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  #22  
Old 07-13-2006, 06:00 PM
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Posted By: Brian E.

What were the terms of the contract?

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  #23  
Old 07-13-2006, 06:31 PM
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Posted By: Steve M.

at a fevor pitch. Just what is the deal? Maybe someone here can make it work?

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  #24  
Old 07-13-2006, 06:40 PM
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Posted By: David

All I requested was something in writing to include the cards, price and parties involved (after no Paypal, no credit card, no home address, no personal checks, no website and no eBay presence). Nothing fancy, no legal ease and only 2-3 lines. I offered to pay all FedEx Overnight fees and pay for Registered insured for the cards. I did not ask for any special favors or make unreasonable demands (in my opinion) not to mention a much higher offer then he had on the table.


Wade claims to be a big dealer. Hmmm. Wade has been terribly insulting and ignored what he did not want to read. How many dealers do not accept credit cards or Paypal (fees to be paid my me) to a confirmed and listed home address of someone with a table at the National and plenty of references? My eBay feedback is flawless. I also have a website. My address and phone # listed. There is no way I feel my demands are unreasonable rather totally prudent in this case.

In my past dealings, I have created contracts to protect all (when larger deals could not be made in person). If one did not have previous dealings (dealers or collectors), transparency lacking or emailed a horror story, hopefully you would take precautions too. Since I decided to pass, these are all moot points. What a relief. Time to focus on something else.

See you all in Anaheim. By the way, I will have on display (for sale) at Table #1550 a hoard of 1914 /15 Nagy CJs, screaming E95s, Double Folders, and other goodies (tbd) but mostly vintage non sports. Plenty of WWII - present too. Several cards have not been in circulation for years. I am selling a % of vintage sports and diversifying into super high grade 19th Century non sports.

Happy Hunting!

Regards,
David

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  #25  
Old 07-13-2006, 08:12 PM
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Posted By: PC

David: you are 100% in the right here. Whether it is $10,000 or $10, a seller should be reasonably accomodating to a buyer (and all the more so as the dollar number goes higher). This Wade character was obviously not -- to the point where you had virtually none of the typical assurances that could (and should) be given in any normal transaction.

IMO, you were smart to walk ... your $10K is better (and more safely) spent elsewhere.

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  #26  
Old 07-13-2006, 08:26 PM
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Posted By: Cobby33

I would be likewise uncomfortable. Had a similar situation with a T206 Magie. He (the seller - not this Wade guy) gave me only a "work address" and cell phone #. He would not use Paypal, an escrow company or do a face-to-face transaction. What's the big deal? I can understand privacy re: P.O. Boxes, I buy and sell from mine all the time...But I also give buyers the option of using Paypal (which arguably protects buyers) and my eBay/Paypal email is my work address.

I ended up walking on the Magie and I never saw it again. Was worth not losing $3500 over.

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  #27  
Old 07-14-2006, 10:41 AM
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Posted By: WPA

In regards to the gentleman who is the dealer in question. There are a lot of collectibles dealers that operate out of their homes, with a PO Box, that don't take credit cards, that don't operate on the internet. Its a second part time job for most of them.

While it can seem a little bit tough to understand, they 1. enjoy their privacy. 2. Don't insure their business as its really a second job, and thus don't want nor need the public around them to know what they have. 3. These are the dealers with "old time" collectors who pass away and they buy the collection back from their spouses or family members. These Old time collectors aren't using ebay, they go to the same monthly or quarterly or yearly show or visit the same shop to buy material...."kick the tires" so to speak. 4. these are the dealers that take a check from collectors at a show for 1/2 of the amount with a promise to pay the rest at the next show.

This may not match up with ebay, paypal, 20% auction commissions....but that doesn't make it wrong. I wouldn't have signed the contract mentioned either. I would think that a phone conversation where you point out that you've never met and your a little bit concerned about sending 10K to someone you've never met would have gotten a much different response.....Its difficult to commit that amount to someone you've never met...but from his perspective he probably usually conducts his deals in exactly this manner...just with people he's known for 5, 10 or 15 years.

Regards

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