Interesting Jay Leno Article

[samosa4u]

Hello everyone,

I was reading this article (Hagerty Magazine September/October issue) last night and I kept thinking about sports cards.

Please read over it and post your thoughts on here.

Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

There are at best a handful of people in the world alive today who saw Cobb play (and doubtful that any remember it!) Only a few handfuls of people who saw Ruth play. I'm sneaking up on 50 and never saw Mantle play. Not an apples to apples comparison with our hobby.

[MVSNYC]

Scott, I started writing this hours ago, and saved the draft...we're on the same page...

I love Jay, and I love his car show.

To me, I don’t think this article, as interesting as it is, crosses over to Sports Cards/Memorabilia...If it did, cards from 1887, 1909, 1933, 1952, etc, would not be desirable. Obviously they are still VERY desirable. And yet, we collectors, lack a direct, first-person connection to cards (and memorabilia) from those years...BUT, the players, and their stats (the really good ones), are immortal (Anson, Cobb, Ruth, Mantle...etc). And we want a "piece" of them. Nostalgia.

There's a difference between a celebrity owning a car/pipe/belt, etc...and a game used/worn item that was used/worn by a beloved athlete. And the cards, well, they're such a large segment of the collecting hobby, and will always be, like stamps, coins, etc.

BUT, very interesting article, thanks for sharing. Jay makes some very good points.


Regards,
Michael

[Topnotchsy]

I think there are a number of distinctions (these are initial thoughts)

1) With movies, the connection is generally somewhat singular. It's a specific movie, which even a big fan will likely only watch a few times, and that's it. With sports, it is 162 games per year (plus Playoffs) year after year.

2) Sports plays a much larger role in modern culture than any movie, or movie franchise ever would.

3) There is loyalty and fandom for teams and players that doesn't exist on the same scale with movies

4) Sports, because there are so many levels (games, seasons, player careers and teams) that span different lengths of time, there is a connection that spans generations. There is nothing today to connect to a 1930's movie, but my interest in a specific team or player automatically connects me the past in a way that doesn't exist for movies.

[Stampsfan]

1. Most everyone has heard the name "Babe Ruth".

2. Has anyone heard the name "Hoot Gibson"?


I cannot recall a single piece of Hoot Gibson memorabilia (autograph, lobby card, etc.) in any auction I have followed.

[sportscomicfantasy]

Originally Posted by Topnotchsy

I think there are a number of distinctions (these are initial thoughts)

1) With movies, the connection is generally somewhat singular. It's a specific movie, which even a big fan will likely only watch a few times, and that's it. With sports, it is 162 games per year (plus Playoffs) year after year.

2) Sports plays a much larger role in modern culture than any movie, or movie franchise ever would.

3) There is loyalty and fandom for teams and players that doesn't exist on the same scale with movies

4) Sports, because there are so many levels (games, seasons, player careers and teams) that span different lengths of time, there is a connection that spans generations. There is nothing today to connect to a 1930's movie, but my interest in a specific team or player automatically connects me the past in a way that doesn't exist for movies.

On the large scale, I would agree with you but there are notable exceptions. The biggest I could point out are Star Wars and Star Trek!

There are plenty of Star Wars items getting major bucks, week in and week out. I remember about 10 years ago, there were several items going for 6 figures from a major auction house for Star Trek. One of the models used in the movies or series went for $250, 000.

When my wife was alive, I went to DragonCon in Atlanta for many years in a row. I don't know how many go there now, but one year they had 80,000 people over a 4-day extended weekend. I think it's this weekend that it is probably going on right now. I felt it seemed busier at that convention then it did the year they had the Sports Card National in Atlanta, don't remember but that was about 18ish years ago.

I think it really depends on the actor, film, series etc. There is always someone willing to pay more money than someone else for something that most would think is crazy. I have plenty of sports items that guys on this site would think is crazy and visa versa.

I do think sports is more far-reaching than movies and TV for longer periods of time because most are people who have followed certain teams their whole lives. There are few series that you can do that in movies or TV, but there are some.

The other possible examples that come to mind are Lord of the Ring and James Bond 007, and the new kid on the block I would say is Harry Potter.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Stampsfan

1. Most everyone has heard the name "Babe Ruth".

2. Has anyone heard the name "Hoot Gibson"?


I cannot recall a single piece of Hoot Gibson memorabilia (autograph, lobby card, etc.) in any auction I have followed.

Maybe someday I'll come across a Babe Ruth card that was owned by Hoot Gibson.

[danf19]

I always thought Jay Leno was a pretty classy guy and I enjoy his writing in the Hagerty publication and other articles.
I'll say in advance that this is non card related.
Funny story, years ago, we took the kids to California for a trip. I wanted to meet Jay Leno so about 4 months before we left , I wrote him a letter asking if we could meet him and his cars. I really didn't think I'd get a response and we went on the trip and had a great time.
About 6 months after our trip, my phone was running low on battery so I plugged it in to charge and went outside to work around the house. When I came in there was a voice mail from an unlisted number. It was Jay Leno apologizing that he had just gotten my letter and he was sorry we couldn't meet.
Needless to say, I was pretty disappointed but thought that was a pretty nice thing to do. I kept the message for years and to this day, always try to carry my phone around, just in case !
Happy Labor Day,
Dan

[barrysloate]

Back around 1971, I was a student at Boston University and I was visiting my close friend at Emerson College, which was a couple of miles from the BU campus. We were standing in the hallway of one of the dorms when he pointed to a tall guy standing across the hall. My friend said, You see that guy over there, he performs stand-up at the comedy clubs in Boston. I thought that was an unusual thing to do. He approached us and stopped to say hi. It was, of course, a 21 year old Jay Leno. Looking back, it was really cool that I got to meet someone who was virtually unknown at the time but would go on to achieve amazing fame and success.

Getting back to his point in the article, we all assume baseball players will be remembered forever and baseball card will always be collected. While that is a reasonable position to take, there is always a chance that the collecting community will shrink in size. We have no idea how important collecting antiquities will be to future generations, and we probably won't be around to find out.

[MVSNYC]

Michael- I totally agree. There are many movies that have transcended generations, and collectibles surrounding those films are highly coveted- Star Wars is a great example. A few more that come to mind- Wizard of Oz, Rocky, ET, etc...and any memorabilia associated with those films are very popular, especially anything screen used in the film.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Stampsfan

1. Most everyone has heard the name "Babe Ruth".

2. Has anyone heard the name "Hoot Gibson"?


I cannot recall a single piece of Hoot Gibson memorabilia (autograph, lobby card, etc.) in any auction I have followed.

You never heard of Bob 'Hoot' Gibson?

There's the connection...thin though it may be.

.

[PowderedH2O]

Why compare Babe Ruth to Hoot Gibson? Ruth was the biggest star athlete in the world. Hoot was just another moderately popular actor. Ask the average person on the street who Bogart is, and they can tell you. Then ask them who Joe Medwick is, and you would get less than 3 out of a hundred would get it right. But, in his element Keswick cards have value.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by sportscomicfantasy

On the large scale, I would agree with you but there are notable exceptions. The biggest I could point out are Star Wars and Star Trek!

There are plenty of Star Wars items getting major bucks, week in and week out. I remember about 10 years ago, there were several items going for 6 figures from a major auction house for Star Trek. One of the models used in the movies or series went for $250, 000.

When my wife was alive, I went to DragonCon in Atlanta for many years in a row. I don't know how many go there now, but one year they had 80,000 people over a 4-day extended weekend. I think it's this weekend that it is probably going on right now. I felt it seemed busier at that convention then it did the year they had the Sports Card National in Atlanta, don't remember but that was about 18ish years ago.

I think it really depends on the actor, film, series etc. There is always someone willing to pay more money than someone else for something that most would think is crazy. I have plenty of sports items that guys on this site would think is crazy and visa versa.

I do think sports is more far-reaching than movies and TV for longer periods of time because most are people who have followed certain teams their whole lives. There are few series that you can do that in movies or TV, but there are some.

The other possible examples that come to mind are Lord of the Ring and James Bond 007, and the new kid on the block I would say is Harry Potter.

but you're using contemporary examples which isn't making the same point Leno is. Call me 50 years after the last Star Wars movie or Star Trek movie is in theaters.

[Troy Kirk]

Well, I have to show some Hoot Gibson cards. I'm surprised none have shown up already in this thread.

[sportscomicfantasy]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

but you're using contemporary examples which isn't making the same point Leno is. Call me 50 years after the last Star Wars movie or Star Trek movie is in theaters.

I will concede your point only slightly, maybe I should expand a little more.

Babe Ruth will transcend sports for years to come, but will always be remembered in by sports fans as his name will be brought up forever. Babe Ruth expanded the Yankee fan base as he created more Yankee fans, which the kids of those Yankee fans became Yankee fans more times over than not. So there are now grandkids and great grandkids of those Yankee fans who watched him play.

The Star Wars and Star Trek franchises are doing the same things, they are just not as old. I used to go to the shows which have gotten only bigger over the years. Yes the last one I went to, Harry Potter had a bigger turn out than did the Star Wars and Star Trek sessions did. But the Star Wars and Star Trek session were filled with parents bringing their kids. The Harry Potter had the kids bring their parents to them.

My point is I don't think Star Wars or Star Trek are going away. I think they will have more movies or series to come still, as long as they make money they will continue to come. I don't think the collectibles will catch Babe Ruth, but I think the original stuff will continue to go up in value if it is rare.

I don't think that Star Wars or Star Trek or Harry Potter will transcend as much as Babe Ruth will. However, more people of today can probably name more movie stars of today than they can their own politicians!

[Gary Dunaier]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

My friend said, You see that guy over there, he performs stand-up at the comedy clubs in Boston. I thought that was an unusual thing to do. He approached us and stopped to say hi. It was, of course, a 21 year old Jay Leno. Looking back, it was really cool that I got to meet someone who was virtually unknown at the time but would go on to achieve amazing fame and success.

Since we're talking early Jay Leno - which we're really not, but since it was mentioned I get to do this - I thought I'd share an image of a check he wrote on 2/24/77 - less than a week before his first-ever appearance on The Tonight Show (3/2/77), which as you all know would eventually be a major part of his legacy by virtue of his taking over the host duties after Johnny Carson resigned.


(Personal information digitally removed from the image.)

[BobC]

And don't forget that sports is used and portrayed quite a lot in the movies and media that also helps to perpetuate and continue the spread of the legends and names of the past, and keeps them in front of new fans even today.

Ruth appeared in movies, especially the 1942 film The Pride of the Yankees with Gary Cooper, it's an all-time classic. And there are so many others that keep the names and events alive for future generations. Field of Dreams combines fictional and historical characters, especially Moonlight Graham. How many people would know of him if it wasn't for that movie? And the girls leagues from the 1940's, collecting and knowledge of them got a huge boost when A League of Their Own came out. Eight Men Out brought additional knowledge and interest into the Black Sox Scandal of 1919, and even The Natural created a renewed interest in older players and times. Dimaggio was married to an all-time movie legend in Marilyn Monroe, and the list goes on. As long as the media and movies continue to be made, people will still see, appreciate and relate to these stars and players from prior generations. And as long as baseball and sports are popular and still around, their will always be interest in the stories and lives as well.

Hoot Gibson was a reasonably popular actor at one point in time who played characters on the screen. Ruth, Cobb, Gehrig, Mantle, Robinson and others, actually lived and performed such athletic feats and endeavors that made them popular and loved by the fans. People will always remember Babe Ruth for his legendary feats and performances, maybe one day not so many will remember William Bendix (or more recently John Goodman) who have played him in the movies.

[Snapolit1]

Leno is absolutely spot on correct. People grossly exaggerate the extent of current/recent celebrity staying power. Most of these people have zero staying power over time.

The folks paying huge bucks for the Tupac stuff that has been sold the last few years by Golden? Enjoy your purchases. It will never be worth much. Ditto people paying for Kurt Cobain or many many other celebs. They will be dust in the wind. To quote Kansas. Who are also worth bubkiss.

Try getting $2 for a David Cassidy autograph.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Leno is absolutely spot on correct. People grossly exaggerate the extent of current/recent celebrity staying power. Most of these people have zero staying power over time.

The folks paying huge bucks for the Tupac stuff that has been sold the last few years by Golden? Enjoy your purchases. It will never be worth much. Ditto people paying for Kurt Cobain or many many other celebs. They will be dust in the wind. To quote Kansas. Who are also worth bubkiss.

Try getting $2 for a David Cassidy autograph.

+1. I recall that some few years ago, someone paid either $25K or $16K (or both, with subsequent buyers) for a one of one Strasburg rookie refractor--does anyone think you could get $2500 for it now? Same thing with $1500-$2000 for one of fifty refractor rookies of Mauer and Wright. So many stars of the (brief) time turn into bit players over a longer period. That having been said, even the popularity of Cobb, Wagner, Ruth, Gehrig, Williams, Mantle and the like will depend upon not only a fervent interest in our game, but also it's history. MLB used to do more to cultivate that, with shows like the best 9 players of all time at each of the various positions. Lately, that task seems to have fallen into the hands of the Smithsonian channel (with specials on Ruth, Gehrig, Williams, etc.), and PBS with American Masters (great feature on Teddy Ballgame!).

Hi, Steve,

Larry

[Gary Dunaier]

Originally Posted by ls7plus

I recall that some few years ago, someone paid either $25K or $16K (or both, with subsequent buyers) for a one of one Strasburg rookie refractor--does anyone think you could get $2500 for it now?

The Strasburg card sold for $16K in May 2010 and the seller flipped it for $21K a month later. (Source: The Definitive History of the Legendary Stephen Strasburg 2010 Bowman Chrome Superfractor)

The 1997 Tiger Woods Grand Slam Ventures card once sold for over $100,000, if you believe the hype Don West used to do on Shop At Home. (For example, at 0:42 on this video.) Did the card really sell for that much, and if it did is there any information on that sale?