Ft Washington Show

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Posted By: Jay Miller 

Did anyone attend the show this weekend? I drove down on Friday and got a chance to meet John Spencer for the first time. He is a real gentleman and a pleasure to talk to. I also saw Kevin Struss and Terry Knouse (along with his better half). Terry's traveling museum has gotten even more impressive since I last saw it. I managed to pick up some Old Judge poses I needed from Terry as well as a few Old Judge cabinets including a brown mount Ewing and a gem Flint. Leon---I saw a few baking cards with names I didn't recognize and I tried to call you but my cell phone battery was low and I couldn't get through. Wish I could remember which dealer had them.

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Posted By: Mike Williams

I was there Saturday and most of Sunday. Had a great time chatting with a few folks from SGC. I have a renewed respect for the things they're forced to deal with on a daily basis! As Jay mentioned, Tik had some great stuff (a beautiful Just So Tobacco - $17,000 I think). It was interesting to see GAI work the floor....and even more interesting seeing previous PSA "only" dealers with a full inventory of GAI graded cards. I personally got to sift through a huge "find" of raw caramel cards. I would assume these will get slabbed. Regardless, look for high grade E92 Dockman's, E90-1's and E102's coming to auction soon. These were loaded with HOF's (Wagner, Lajoie etc. but NO Cobb's) and the horizontal Matty's were stunning! It's funny though (not really), for the most part....it was the same dealers, with the same inventory.

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Posted By: Plastic Dog

... for just a little bit. And, has been my experience several times over the last 4 years, Terry Knouse Sr. was once again just another rude and greedy dealer. I don't find him to be a credit to this hobby at all; on the contrary, I have found him to be typical of what I despise in the hobby. Just my opinion, of course.

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

1) Terry Knouse is the only dealer in the U.S. that sells exclusively (almost) 19th century stuff.

2) You like something on his table, he will say, "take it home; pay me when/as you can..."

3) I have been writing checks to him for 5 years addressed to "Terry Knause" and he hasn't once complained.

4) He's a joy to look at, well-kept body and hair, nice face.

5) WHAT'S NOT TO LIKE?

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Posted By: Bill Cornell

I was at the show this weekend and met Terry Knouse, Sr. for the first time. Besides having an absolutely fantastic stock of cards, I found him to be extremely friendly and very willing to spend time talking about collecting. I bought several cards from him and am very happy with them.

On a non-hobby note, he told me that he was taking his profits from the weekend and using them to help his daughter and her husband who are about to adopt 5 boys and girls from Russia. Easily the nicest thing I've heard in a long time...

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Posted By: runscott

I haven't met Terry Sr., but Terry Jr is a great guy to deal with, and I've heard nothing but good stuff about his dad. Did you have a bad dealing with Terry Sr.? If you didn't complete a deal, that would really piss people off. I'm just guessing - can't think of any reason why he would get along with everyone but you.

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Posted By: vorthian

<< I haven't met Terry Sr., but Terry Jr is a great guy to deal with, and I've heard nothing but good stuff about his dad. >>

I have seen and talked to Terry Sr. at many shows - quite an asset to the hobby. However, Terry Jr. is the guy to deal with.

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Posted By: sonny

This was my first time to attend the Fort Washington show--lots of great vintage cards. It was also my first time to meet Terry. I thought he was a super guy--bought a couple cards from him and plan on dealing with him again in the future.

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Posted By: autograf

Both Terry Sr and Jr are good to work with. Not sure if someone is miffed because of the high prices he charges on some items, but, last I checked, it is still a free country and you can decline the prices if you don't want the item. As for greedy, I think Terry has a pretty good pulse of what things are selling for and where they're going. At least in 19th century goods and some very scarce 20th century items. If you don't like the buy-side, then try selling to him. You won't find many dealers, if any, who'll pay more for 19th century items if he needs them. My two favorite dealers in that regards are Terry and Ron Vitro (E&R Galleries). Anyway, NO ONE can deny his inventory is the best out there.

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Posted By: Terry Knouse

Who might I ask is referring to my father as 'rude'? If anything he takes the time to talk with anyone and everyone that wants to chat -
The number of people that I have talked to in my lifetime (all of 33 years) that have thought him rude I could count on one hand -

Who are you???????

Terry

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Posted By: leon

I have only met Terry Sr. and Jr. one time in person. They were both 2 of the nicest people you would want to meet. They made me feel at home at their table, let me come behind their booth, gave me free access to their cards, and made me feel comfortable. I could not think of better people to deal with. Altough they might have a few perceived high prices they also have the best vintage inventory of anyone I have ever see. Bar none.(I still bought about 4 high end cards from them.) I enjoy their company and wisdom and will continue to do business with them as long as they can put up with my exuberance and "baldness"....best regards all....

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Posted By: warshawlaw

I've met both Terrys a number of times on the west coast at various shows including the National. They are invariably polite, patient and courteous to everyone, even the lookiloos like me (since I really don't collect 19th century stuff). The cards and other items on display are astounding, too. Tik & Tik make the shows better, not worse, although I suppose if you are trying to grind a lowball purchase, you'd not have much use for them, since they know what their cards are worth and have no problem declining lowball offers outright.

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Posted By: petecld

I will agree with the majority here. Knause, Sr. is one of the niceest people I've talked to at shows and I look for his table first. And this is from someone who doesn't collect 19th century items and can't afford to buy most items in his inventory so it's not just a case of him putting up with me because I'm a big spender. In his case, I'm not.

The Sr. Mr. Knause has never hesitated to answer all of my questions and talk with me. I never hesitate to recommend him to other collectors.

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Posted By: vorthian

<< I don't find him to be a credit to this hobby at all; on the contrary, I have found him to be typical of what I despise in the hobby. >>

I despise those that stiff others and/or take eons to pay their bills. Especially when it's to a respected board member. That is my phenomenal opinion.

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Posted By: Trevor Hocking

Hi All,
I know that I don't post that often anymore, but when this topic was brought up I had to tell my great experance with Terry Sr. I had meet up with him at the last West Coast Card Show. He had mentioned that they were trying to sell a large portion of there 20th century invintory at the time. I really didn't catch the sales pitch untill I had got home later that evening. So I called him up and with no questions asked he sent me the entire lot Fed Ex next day. I looked over the lot for about a week and found that it wasn't for me but man did he make it ever so tempting. The lot was priced very fair but it would have been too many dups for me to sell. So the morral of this story is, Terry is a very trusting and fair dealer. I think most people see his sticker prices and don't give him the benifit of the doubt. In my opinion, Terry is one of the greatest and fair dealers around. I think to many people are forgetting what a great buy 50% of the cards are on ebay. Just look at what some of the items in the Halper collection went for compaired to what they realize on ebay. You will see that many of the same items that are hyped well on ebay wouldn't even come close to the same item in a major auction or to the right seller. I think Terry has the right idea, don't be in a rush to make a quick buck, wait for the right buyer and you will be far more happy with the outcome. He must be doing somthing right, for someone who everybody thinks his prices are way to high, he seems to pay the table and travel fees and further more, it has been a long time scence I have herd a dealer more highly praised. Terry I hope the check is in the mail for the endorsment. All kidding aside, I would rather pay 10%-20% more for an item I really need that comes with the kind of fellowship and true love for the hobby that you will find at TIk & Tik.
Trevor Hocking

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Posted By: David

Apparently, from all the sentiments, the Knouses two should get out of cards and go straight to sainthood. Though, to be honest, I would never trust a man who constantly referred to his his son as a tik, or visa versa. But I guess I was brought up in a more gent-eel manner.

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Posted By: scott brockelman

i have to disagree, terry knouse is the most softspoken and polite person you will ever deal with, and VERY knowledgable!, he does have a very matter of fact attitude, all is black and white with him, you may not like his prices, if you don't like the price go to the next table and buy the same item . it ain't gonna be there!! please tell me where else this type of material is readily available and where else you could sell this type of rare material for the dollars he will pay. he probably paid over book to get the item you may want and is offering it for sale at nominal markup, just to make it available to the collectors, he may well be the most market savvy person of all, you have to pay strong to get the really scarce items. i have personally spent tens of thousands of dollars with him and never been dissapointed, because the cards i bought were literally unavailable anywhere else and he dealt very fairly with me. also, there are many times terry & i talk at shows for hours and i don't spend a dime, he still answers any and all questions i have, he is just not after the $$'s like a buzzard, but i can refer you to a few who are if you would like! he is just a genuine person (read) dealer/collector.

i have seen this man take his "traveling museum" (which is constantly changing believe it or not) to many small shows and not make any money due to extreme table & travel costs, but still enhance the hobby 10 fold.

it is very rare i take a stance on this board pro or con for any person or agenda, but i will indeed support this man 110%. as i believe ALL of the very serious collectors will, not the wannabe's who are not perhaps as well versed in diplomacy or collecting.

scott brockelman

i welcome any and all responses to this post.

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Posted By: Kevin Cummings

I actually bought my first Old Judge (Tim Keefe) from Terry, Sr. when he used to frequent the Gloria Rothstein shows in White Plains, N.Y., so he is personally responsible for my 19th century addiction [damn him ]. I subsequently bought a trimmed Old Judge Delahanty (sweet picture, though) and a Scrapps Hanlon from him, too. The Hanlon was done strictly via email, phone and fax, so after only two previous transactions, I felt comfortable enough about dealing with him that I didn't have to see everything in person. I think that speaks volumes.

While he is not known as the "bargain king," he certainly gave me fair deals on everything I bought from him. I have always found him approachable and courteous.

Unlike Julie, however, I took little notice of his physical appearance!

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Posted By: Brian Parker

I have only dealt with the Knouse's once at a card show, and quite honestly couldn't fathom shelling out the big bucks for some of the impressive cards they normally have displayed. However, at one of the shows they had some stacks of lower to medium grade Obaks and E-cards for sale at fair prices, and they seemed to have a genuine respect for me as a customer, even as it must have been obvious while I leisurely spent time rifling through their stacks that I wasn't going to spend that much dough.

If only all dealers showed the same respect--I remember at one show years ago I was making my way through a stack of W517's at a table when the dealer blurted out in mocking way "you probably don't even know what cards you are looking at". After a couple seconds of shocked silence, I proceeded to name the year of issue, the ACC designation and that they had been cut from a strip of cards, then slapped that stack back down on his table and left. I had been prepared to purchase one or two HOF players, but even if I had been a novice collector I wouldn't have wanted to be treated like one.

My guess is Plasticdog is the type who is always looking to pay substantially below the asking price, probably doing so in an agressive fashion, and when told no in a firm manner (in response to his own rudeness), he takes objection. I think the overwhelming response of this board on behalf of the Knouse's would seem to point to this as a possible scenario.

Brian Parker

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Posted By: Vintagecatcher

I have met, and spoken at great length with Terry Knouse, Sr. a dozen times, and like the majority of the board, my experience has been a positive one.

Although his prices tend to be a little on the high end, so is the quality of his material.

I have purchased several items including a Red Kleinow Turkey Red and a Johnny Kling W600 Sporting Life Cabinet, and he was flexible regarding price on both items.

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

He sold me an Old Judge O'Rourke for $2200; a day easrlier, he had bought it for $2100. "How can you do that?" I asked. "Well, you asked me to find you an O'Rourke, and I knew I was going to see you today, so I had a ready market. I don't mind small markups on ready markets."

As for "high end" and "low end" cards and stuff, I have a low end income, but like high end cards. Since Terry Knouse lets me pay slowly (and gives me the card to begin with!) I have a few middle-to-high-end cards, thanks to him. He never sends me a bill or reminds me when I owe him money. Just finished paying off an A35 Kelly, and an Old Judge Galvin. And a Tobin lithograph Keefe.

SO sorry if I offended you Mr. Cummings, by mentioning his appearance (it took up about 1/5 of my total comments), but have you ever noticed the appearance of many of the big dealers who don't take such good care of themselves physically?

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Posted By: warshawlaw

I think "pig men in Mumus" with bad male jewelry about sums up the average dealer. The caricature of the comic and card dealer on the Simpsons is mercilessly accurate.

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Posted By: runscott

...where Mr. Burns paid his "monkey" Homer to buy Spiderman #1 and then eat it in front of the dealer was a classic!

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Posted By: jay behrens

hey now, I used to resemble that remark. Well, not totally anyway. I did have hair down to the middle of my back, usually in a pony tail, but I never treated my customers rudely. The one thing we had over almost every other comic store in town was our reputation as being far with trades, reasonable prices and having the best selection of comics, vintage toys and games in town.

I do love the comic shop guy on the Simpsons because he could be 90% of the dealers in just about any collectibles field, cards, comics, toys, antiques, you name it.

I found an antique store I had never seen in an area I shop frequently. I was absolutely floored when I walked in and it was filled with vintage jukeboxes, soda machines, gas pump, etc. The thing that really caught my eye was the 20+ pinball machines from the 60s that included an old baseball game I remember playing as a kid. Oh, to $2400 and what it would cost to ship to MN. The game was fully restored and worked great. Ah, the memories

Jay

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Posted By: Kevin Cummings

Mrs. Vognar:

Do you mind if I call you Julie?

I was hardly offended.

Truth be told, whenever I was at Terry's table I was so engrossed by all the cards he had I barely noticed what he looked like at all!

OK, OK - I guess he's got that Paul Newman look!

Mr. Cummings (you can call me Kevin)

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Posted By: Plastic Dog

I struck a nerve with the board. Let me just say that I could care less about high prices. Knouse can charge whatever he wants - free country and all that. But my one transaction with 'Tik' several years ago was a horrendous experience; worse than any I've had with a "respected dealer" in 25 years of collecting. Thought I would take another shot at Ft. Washington (he doesn't know me by sight) and again I was disappointed. And I was very polite.

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

lightening can strike twice in the same place. I'm sure, P.D. that what you've read here convinces you that your experiences are the exception rather than the rule.