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  #1  
Old 10-23-2014, 04:21 PM
ErikV ErikV is offline
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Default Amazing E95 Discovery

As many on the board are probably aware, I'm a big Philadelphia Caramel
collector and researcher. Today I just uncovered a 104 year-old mystery.

Back in 2009 Heritage auctioned off this Ty Cobb E95 look alike with some
sort of advertising on the reverse including the words "Paste Drops, Jelly
Confections, Chocolates" and the like. See images below.

The following Philadelphia Caramel Advertisement dated May 1910 depicts the
same arrangement of words in almost exactly the same format. (Area shown
in red box.)

I have little doubt now that this Cobb was in fact part of a large advertisement
of perhaps 4 or 5 E95 cards and at some point was hand cut from the ad. With
today's discovery my theory that the E95 set was actually issued in 1910 seems
to have gained some credence. Wouldn't it have made sense that this new
promotion debuting in May 1910 would have fit right in to baseball's opening day
which began two weeks earlier on April 14, 1910?

Thoughts anyone?

ErikV
Attached Images
File Type: jpg cobb_ad2.jpg (62.6 KB, 2240 views)
File Type: jpg cobb_ad3.jpg (52.8 KB, 2237 views)
File Type: jpg cobb_ad.jpg (70.5 KB, 2229 views)

Last edited by ErikV; 10-23-2014 at 04:37 PM.
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  #2  
Old 10-23-2014, 04:39 PM
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Daryl
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Great discovery - thanks for sharing!
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  #3  
Old 10-23-2014, 04:47 PM
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Default Caramel Ad

Very cool find.

I love the line, "...qualities from fair to superfine." Hate to know why some product was just considered "fair" quality. Talk about truth in advertising.
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  #4  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:02 PM
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Very cool. It looks like there may have been room for two more cards.
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  #5  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:14 PM
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Very neat discovery Erik!
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  #6  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:34 PM
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Nice Erik.

The flip side of the ad probably included Cobb and Jim Jeffries. (Adam Warshaw has the Jeffries on his site)

E95 set was probably issued in 1909 and continued into 1910.

Thanks for sharing the ad.

Rob

Last edited by caramelcard; 10-23-2014 at 05:39 PM.
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  #7  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:43 PM
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Excellent find Erik - where did you come across the ad?

I do not know much about E95 - the writing "Cobb Detroit Amer." isn't typically found on E95, right? Are there any other known examples with writing like that?

Thanks.
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  #8  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:43 PM
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Just an honest question. How do you justify the difference in format?


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  #9  
Old 10-23-2014, 05:49 PM
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I owned a blank-back version of this card. We always suspected that it was from a candy box.

Last edited by Runscott; 11-30-2014 at 01:06 PM.
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  #10  
Old 10-23-2014, 06:06 PM
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Very interesting topic and not my area of familiarization, but I have to agree with Jon. Yes very similar advertisement, but off a bit. Can't assume card was from advertisement. Bill.
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  #11  
Old 10-23-2014, 06:32 PM
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Far out! Here's mine:

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  #12  
Old 10-23-2014, 06:33 PM
ErikV ErikV is offline
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Default Re: Default Amazing E95 Discovery

This advertisement was located in the May 1910 issue of the periodical
"Confectioners Journal." Many of Philadelphia Caramel's ads were published in
this particular periodical.

I think a reasonable difference in format could have been that with the larger
name and team atop an ad would have made these properties more visible from
further away rather than having a small printed name and team at the bottom of
the picture that no one would be able to see. Just my opinion.

As far as dating the E95 set, I believe the key is Cy Morgan shown as a
Philadelphia Athletic on his E95 card. He was traded from Boston to Philly on
June 5, 1909. As mentioned in a previous post about how common E cards are,
many will agree the E95 set is a very easy and common set to collect. This
suggests to me that a large number of these cards were printed and distributed.
That in mind, Philadelphia Caramel issued the E95 set no earlier than mid-to-late
Summer 1909. Would a set like this have lasted thru the end of a baseball season,
all winter, all spring and into the following baseball season? Personally I believe it
fits better that a new promotion, which would have taken time to print,
package and distribute would have been better served being issued at the start
of the new baseball season, 1910.

Most collectors will say the E95 was issued in 1909 because that's what we've
always been told, but I think my theory fits as well as any I've heard yet.

ErikV
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  #13  
Old 10-23-2014, 09:24 PM
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Very cool find!!!!
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  #14  
Old 10-23-2014, 09:28 PM
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Default Amazing E95 Discovery

This is very interesting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I have counted the stitches on a baseball more than once.[/b]

My PM box might be full.

Email:
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Want list:
Prewar Pirates items
1909 Pirates
BF2 Wagner
Cracker Jack Wagner and Clarke


Love the hobby.

Last edited by Jcfowler6; 10-23-2014 at 09:29 PM.
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  #15  
Old 10-23-2014, 10:14 PM
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Great detective work! That ad in some slightly altered format certainly made up the back of your card. And it looks like that Jeffries could have been on the same sheet.

Last edited by GasHouseGang; 10-23-2014 at 10:15 PM.
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  #16  
Old 10-23-2014, 10:36 PM
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The two backs side by side:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg E95-#2.jpg (67.4 KB, 1235 views)
File Type: jpg E95-AD-#2.jpg (77.8 KB, 1231 views)
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  #17  
Old 10-23-2014, 10:36 PM
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nice work...i've always coveted that cobb...i'd love to have one!
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  #18  
Old 10-24-2014, 12:52 AM
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Very cool thread, love the detective work
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  #19  
Old 10-24-2014, 02:00 AM
Rickyy Rickyy is offline
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Great detective work. Nice cards too...always liked this series...

Ricky Y
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  #20  
Old 11-05-2014, 11:23 AM
ErikV ErikV is offline
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Default Re: Amazing E95 Discovery

In following up from my original post from October 23rd, I found this note
this morning. It was from the May 1910 issue of Confectioners Journal.
I believe this discovery now provides a definitive issue date to both the E95
and E79 series issued by the Philadelphia Caramel Company.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg notice.jpg (20.1 KB, 1166 views)
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  #21  
Old 11-05-2014, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikV View Post
In following up from my original post from October 23rd, I found this note
this morning. It was from the May 1910 issue of Confectioners Journal.
I believe this discovery now provides a definitive issue date to both the E95
and E79 series issued by the Philadelphia Caramel Company.
Nice work Erik!!
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  #22  
Old 11-05-2014, 11:51 AM
ErikV ErikV is offline
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Default Re: Re: Amazing E95 Discovery

Someone just got ahold of me and asked if this notice is not referring to a
new(er) set as in the E96/E80 release. There is validity to this question. I'll
continue to investigate. At this point I'm pretty determined to find the answer.

ErikV
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  #23  
Old 11-05-2014, 11:56 AM
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Default Why couldn't they be more precise in their wording?

I was just about to ask the same question. By the way the statement is worded, it definitely could be construed to indicate a new (another) series of boxer and baseball cards were being issued, which to me would indicate the E96 set (I am not too familiar with the vintage boxing issues).

Brian
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  #24  
Old 11-08-2014, 12:27 AM
shammus shammus is offline
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Well, that's a strong theory for that particular Cobb and a solid find by Erik. But we haven't solved everything yet! What I'll bring to the table here is proof that there is in fact two different hand-cut e95 esque Cobbs with the script writing at the top. Here is the 2nd version - it actually has a blank back and if you look close at the borders, you can tell it was cut off of something red. Candy box perhaps?

If memory serves when I did my research before, there were two blank backed "Script Cobbs" and 1-2 ad-backed variants that were known.

photo 2.JPG

Last edited by shammus; 11-08-2014 at 12:29 AM.
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  #25  
Old 11-08-2014, 01:10 AM
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What you have is a companion piece to mine:



The red is a border.

The boxing set with this pose is E79
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Last edited by Exhibitman; 11-08-2014 at 01:12 AM.
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