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  #1  
Old 03-16-2018, 06:23 AM
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Rick McQuillan
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Default Germany Schaefer T213's

I have been looking for a T213-2 Germany Schaefer, Washington card for a while, and yesterday I received it. I was curious about this card so I did a little research, which resulted in a few things that I found that are interesting to me.

Even though Schaefer was playing for Washington in 1910 and had been playing baseball for several years, he is not included in the T213-1 set.

He was playing for Washington in 1914, which is shown on one of the T213-2 cards.

He was a player/manager in New York for one season, in 1916, where he only played in one game. This is shown on another T213-2 card.

He played in Newark in 1915, which isn't shown on a card, and his third T213-2 card has a K.C. Fed designation, but I can't find any records of him playing for KC.

He played his last game in Cleveland in April of 1918, and he died in May of 1919, but he is shown in the 1919 T213-3 set in his Washington uniform with his name spelled as "Schaeffer".

I would love to go back in time and talk to the people who produced the Coupon sets and talk about the reasons for the decisions on the way the cards were produced.

Thanks for looking. Rick
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Image.jpg (77.0 KB, 253 views)
File Type: jpg Image (2).jpg (78.1 KB, 251 views)
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Old 03-16-2018, 07:50 AM
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pete ullman
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Default

Interesting why they removedthe W from his uniform for the New York variation but not the KC?
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Old 03-16-2018, 11:29 AM
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Default W

Quote:
Originally Posted by ullmandds View Post
Interesting why they removedthe W from his uniform for the New York variation but not the KC?
Yes, that was my thought too.
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Old 03-16-2018, 12:10 PM
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Default NJ vs KC

My guess is that the KC card was issued second (after Washington) while he was actually playing for Newark in the Federal League. Someone just got the teams wrong. When he went to New York, they redid the image and finally removed the “W”
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Old 03-17-2018, 02:33 AM
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Todd Schultz
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Default Good question

Yes, it would seem logical that the t213-2 versions of Germany were issued as Washington 1914, Newark 1915 and New York 1916.

According to Lew Lipset's book, the t213-3s that contained no team designations were retired players, coaches, etc. Schaeffer (sic) was no longer active in 1919, so this would explain why that card has no team designation. It also suggests re-use of something other than the 1916 card, since that issue had no W emblem on the uniform.

The 1915 t213-2 is really interesting. Schaefer did not sign with anyone until around the 7th of March, so it seems the cards would not have been issued by then. In fact, there was some question about the Newark team itself, which wasn't even named until about that time and which still had its park under construction (it was a transplant for the Indianapolis Feds from 1914). A March 6 article in the Sporting Life referred to reports from Kansas City that doubted whether Newark would have a team. One wonders if those same reports had Schaefer landing in their town, and if so, that is what prompted Coupon to caption him there. Anyway, Schaefer signed with Newark.


Now at the end of April, for about a week or so, there was rumor and even a report of a multi-team trade that would have sent Germany Schaefer from Newark to Kansas City. That deal fell through, but it makes it curious as to whether that is when the t213-2s might have been printed. That is another possible explanation. From 4/24/1915:

from 5/1/1915:

In any event, it does not appear that placing Schaefer on the KC Packers was a simple or random mistake.
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Last edited by nolemmings; 03-17-2018 at 02:34 AM.
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Old 03-17-2018, 07:13 AM
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Default Thanks

Thanks, Todd. Good info.
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Old 03-19-2018, 08:42 AM
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Default

FWIW, here are pics of Germany's T213-3 (which I no longer own) and T214 (1915) cards.

I can't figure out how to enlarge the pics of the T213-3. Leon, please help if you can.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg T213-3 Coupon - Schaefer - front-2.jpg (8.5 KB, 103 views)
File Type: jpg T213-3 Coupon - Schaefer - back.jpg (6.0 KB, 102 views)
File Type: jpg T214 Schaefer - front.jpg (46.6 KB, 101 views)
File Type: jpg T214 Schaefer - back.jpg (51.2 KB, 101 views)
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Seeking very scarce/rare cards for my Sam Rice master collection, e.g., E210 York Caramel Type 2 (upgrade), 1931 W502, W504 (upgrade), W572 sepia, W573, W575-1 E. S. Rice version, 1922 Haffner's Bread, 1922 Keating Candy, 1922 Witmor Candy Type 2 (vertical back), 1926 Sports Co. of Am. with ad & blank backs. Also T216 Kotton "NGO" card of Hugh Jennings. Also 1917 Merchants Bakery & Weil Baking cards of WaJo.
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Old 03-19-2018, 09:40 AM
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Default Kotton

I see that Kotton Tobacco shows 2 cards for Schaefer. One is Washington and the other is Newark. So, People's Tobacco got it right somehow.
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:34 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ValKehl View Post
FWIW, here are pics of Germany's T213-3 (which I no longer own) and T214 (1915) cards.

I can't figure out how to enlarge the pics of the T213-3. Leon, please help if you can.
I think this is the one you posted Val, Nice T213-3.

Schaefer T213-3.jpg Schaefer T213-3 Back.jpg

Last edited by Pat R; 03-19-2018 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 03-19-2018, 01:12 PM
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Default Schaefer

Quote:
Originally Posted by buymycards View Post
I see that Kotton Tobacco shows 2 cards for Schaefer. One is Washington and the other is Newark. So, People's Tobacco got it right somehow.
Interestingly, the Kottons use the Schaefer's horizontal image (from the E101 and E92 series), not the image from T213s (and T206s).
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:45 PM
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Default More muddled than before

I need to modify my earlier comments about how KC got onto Schaefer’s t213-2 card. It seems that the Kansas City Federal League team from 1914 was actually sold to buyers who planned on moving it to Newark. Kansas City fought the move in court, and the team ended up staying put. Instead, the Indianapolis team was sold and moved to Newark, apparently out of concern that upcoming legislation in Indiana was going to prohibit Sunday baseball.

According to the Sporting Life, March 6 edition, Schaefer was signed by LEAGUE President Gilmore as a coach of the Newark team–but the Newark team referenced was the Kansas City team about to be moved, which ended up never happening. Nonetheless, when the Indianapolis team moved to Newark, Schaefer was part of that team, having never actually played for the KC team. I do not know how the League President signing Schaefer affected his rights, but it seems the card manufacturer may have thought that Schaefer was staying in KC once the move had been blocked in the courts. So, while we know the printing of 1915 Coupon could not have occurred before March 6, it may have been very close to that time. Then again, maybe that trade rumor at the end of April is why Coupon chose to caption Schaefer with KC. Got it ?

Just as strange is that the following two reports were on the very same page of the TSL on March 6, and two pages later was the Shanks story in my last post– all from beat writers in different cities. As confusing as it is now, how must it have been to those trying to figure out what was going on back then. Maybe the Fed League historians of this forum will chime in on what looks like a chaotic situation.
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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President.

Last edited by nolemmings; 03-19-2018 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 03-19-2018, 08:00 PM
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Default To maybe wrap this up (check last line of story):

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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President.
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Old 03-20-2018, 03:02 AM
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Default Wow

Wow! That is some serious research!
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