Buying all #332 Tony Bartirome 1952 Topps cards + his Gold Canary + Griffey + Tiger

[7nohitter]

Originally Posted by Leon

Anyone that is sane can't get inside this guy's head. He sent one hail mary threatening email and then in the same email asked me to do him a favor and post a 5 paragraph post that he was doing when he got axed. The guy is definitely, and I mean definitely, unbalanced. I see him being back in prison in no time if he continues the way he is. Very, very unstable. (and I am not just saying this for effect)

Thanks Leon. There's no arguing with crazy!
How, or is, the hurricane affecting TX?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Leon

Anyone that is sane can't get inside this guy's head. He sent one hail mary threatening email and then in the same email asked me to do him a favor and post a 5 paragraph post that he was doing when he got axed. The guy is definitely, and I mean definitely, unbalanced. I see him being back in prison in no time if he continues the way he is. Very, very unstable. (and I am not just saying this for effect)

either way....like I said previously..the fact he is overpaying now...due to his age and the fact he just starting paying these prices, I really doubted he would continue for long..

even Ponzi schemes..the initial 'investors' make money....its the later people holding the bag......If you plan on buying the heritage baritrome for $1500 good luck to you...

[jason.1969]

I would be careful dealing with him. I saw one of his many scams was selling on ebay but never sending the merchandise. Here, I suppose nobody will send him a card without PayPal first, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's more interested in the names and addresses of high end collectors.

[Jantz]

1952 Topps Tony Bartirome cards aren't the only items he is hoarding.

Here are a few others.

1986 Fireball Island board games
Western Digital external hard drives (along with various other brands of hard drives)

Hundreds of them!

Sprinkled in with cell phones, probably for changing the multitude of phone numbers he has had, along with buying 1989 Griffey rookies (notice the thread title).

His last confirmed Ebay username was awesomegreatness.

Now he has a new Ebay account. He "advertised" that point by posting here about buying all the Bartirome cards that he has. The new Ebay account that is buying the Bartirome cards is also bidding on cell phones, golf cards (this ties into the Tiger Woods cards he sold years ago & the Tiger reference in this thread's title) and paper money. If you watched any of the videos posted in the links, he has a sweet tooth for paper money & uncirculated bills.

Ironically he pays people when he buys and has had almost perfect Ebay feedback in the past.

I'm not sure if there is a scam in buying/hoarding the Bartiromes, but his buying habits show a pattern for buying the same item over and over again, whether it be a certain 1952 Topps cards, digital hard drives or a board game manufactured in 1986.

[ALR-bishop]

Wonder if he would want my Sonar Sub Hunt game

[PolarBear]

[sac_bunt]

Originally Posted by Leon

I took moderator privileges and moved this to the front page from the BST. It's an interesting discussion...

Great thread!..so many story lines... thanks Leon for creating more visibility to this thread.

[jason.1969]

BTW, I just heard directly from a definitive source that Cole is neither related to Tony Bartirome nor is Tony's real name Bartiromo.

[egri]

Originally Posted by jason.1969

He claimed Tony changed his name to give announcers an easier job. Not only is that a pretty bizarre tale but it doesn't seem to check out anywhere but in the OP.

+1. I have a signed Bartirome for my project (signed well after his playing career ended) and it very clearly ends in an e, not an o.

[1880nonsports]

top ten - don't want it to end.................

[ksabet]

Two things:

1. I really think this guy and Adrian are buddies

2. I know Leon won't but I would love to read the 5-paragraph post he was about to attach.

[RCMcKenzie]

What I took away from this thread is that 1952 Topps short prints have a population of around 1000 each. I had no idea they were that scarce. i may need to put together a low-grade 52 Topps set now. What else am I doing?

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by ksabet

Two things:

1. I really think this guy and Adrian are buddies

2. I know Leon won't but I would love to read the 5-paragraph post he was about to attach.

1. My thinking exactly.

2. Same here. This thread has been more entertaining than the Sunday Night Football game that just ended.

[Bpm0014]

I wonder where he got the money to buy tens of thousands of dollars worth of baseball cards??

[7nohitter]

Originally Posted by Bpm0014

I wonder where he got the money to buy tens of thousands of dollars worth of baseball cards??

Probably from a previous scam!

[Bruinsfan94]

Anyone have any ideas what kind of angle this could have been? Doesn't make any sense to me. From all his past behavior and internet craziness I guess it has to be bad, but what kind profit could be made from buying a common at such premiums?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Bruinsfan94

Anyone have any ideas what kind of angle this could have been? Doesn't make any sense to me. From all his past behavior and internet craziness I guess it has to be bad, but what kind profit could be made from buying a common at such premiums?

like you said its internet craziness......and he just started.....how many people you know started an expensive set only to quit before halfway.....I been saying all along need to wait a year or so of constant buying...one month of buying that we know of..(he can say what he wants in the past before then but we have no proof of that and this guy screams proof)

he never would of even halfway completed the task.... ONE psa 8 common? .a long way to go.....he said he would wait for the set breaks.....wake me up in 10 years..

[Bruinsfan94]

"like you said its internet craziness......and he just started.....how many people you know started an expensive set only to quit before halfway.....I been saying all along need to wait a year or so of constant buying...one month of buying that we know of..(he can say what he wants in the past before then but we have no proof of that and this guy screams proof)

he never would of even halfway completed the task.... ONE psa 8 common? .a long way to go.....he said he would wait for the set breaks.....wake me up in 10 years."

I completely agree. Just wondering, in his mind, how this was going to end up with profit or good. Everything he said was a lie. It would take years for him to really effect the market since there are tons in collections around the country. Granted, according the articles posted, he did get in big trouble, he must have been fairly smart as a teenager to do something like that. If only he used that knowledge for some good...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by ksabet

Two things:

1. I really think this guy and Adrian are buddies

2. I know Leon won't but I would love to read the 5-paragraph post he was about to attach.

Never underestimate the powers of persuasion. Here is his last email to me.

Here ya go....





I'm really busy right now, but your story will be compiled and published on the front page & when it does I will activate the multiple stealth accounts I have on net54 to spam the hell out of your boards to spread the word about the exclusive story of Leon Luckey. Don't think I have forgotten or given up. A month may go by, but when I have a weekend to finalize the finishing touches on the organization of the article, it will go live, & you will never get that removed.

Do me a favor and post this reply to my thread in the meantime, as I was unable to post it when you banned me during the writing of this reply:

Originally Posted by the 'stache

This thread is surreal, but also fascinating. I feel bubbles in my head, like I've had too much champagne.

I'm curious as to why you want the 10 2011 Topps Lineage Gold Canary cards of his? Should you acquire all of them, how do you determine which family members get these?

Why if you're also hoarding the '53 cards do you only want PSA 7 +? That seems, to me anyway, to reinforce the notion that you are hoarding these cards for future profit. The '52 Topps cards are from the first full set Topps ever did, and are from the high series. They are innately valuable, condition not withstanding. But the '53s don't have the same demand. However, collectors pursing the 1953 Topps registry will want high grade examples of the card. Can you comment on that?

I just know that I want all 10 of the 2011 Topps Lineage Gold Canary since they are rare & limited & only 10 in existence. The fact Topps would choose to re-honor my family member with a reissue, in all it's gold diamond features & glory, is extra special. I do realize part of Tony's inclusion in the Gold Canary set is because he is still alive, & could sign the cards for Topps.

I have never even looked at a PSA registry, or even heard that word "registry" before a month ago. I don't know what 1953 Topps registry even means actually. I just don't wish to be like Mr Wallach collector buying $1 cards every day. I don't want to buy $1-$10 1953 Topps Bartirome's. I just want to have the rarest ones from 1953 - so that is PSA 7 and up. I arbitrarily chose that number to go with. I wouldn't know what to do with stacks of $1-$10 cards.

And yes, I want ALL 1952 Topps #332 because "they are innately valuable, condition not withstanding." To me they are prized possessions, & part of an amazing, historical story.

The comment that said I could liquidate 1953 Topps Bartirome easier then 1952 Topps Bartirome, how do you figure? There are a 100 listings for 1953 Topps Bartirome. If I bought them all up at the listed prices, & wanted to liquidate, even if I list them all for half the prices, 90% of the 100 listings would just sit there. I was under the assumption barely anyone is buying a 1953 Topps Bartirome because there are far less set collectors. It has no story, no legend, no allure. There are 0 listings for 1952 Topps Bartirome. Even before I jumped into the market, there would only be 1-2 at any given time. Please elaborate why you think I could liquidate 1953 Topps Bartirome easier then 1952 Topps Bartirome.....

Due to the advice of some PM's, I am going underground now except to post an updated picture of all the cards before the end of the year on this thread. Perhaps I will ignore the #332 going on HA next month. I will not pay $1,500 again. Perhaps there was manipulation in after hours bidding or bidders trying to win it to then sell it to me. The winner of this:

http://i1027.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4azjlobu.jpg

is willing to sell it to me for $300, but he has also been significantly bidding me up for the past handful of #332 auctions because he has been needing a Bartirome. I simply forgot to bid that evening, & lost out on it. Now, I would normally pay the $300 and get it, but this group conversation has convinced me to stop encouraging the higher prices. If I buy it, he will go back to bidding against me on all future ones until I slip up & he wins again. If I don't buy it, he is done & out of the market & I don't have to deal with him indefinitely. I will stop this madness for a few listings, & disappear, so hopefully people stop risking their high bids thinking I will buy from them. I can pass on a #332 & buy it the next time it hits the market.

Thanks guys! I'll reply to this thread with a few pics of.
the collection before the end of the year!


.

[autograf]

Well......get ready for multiple stealth account activation........I still can't believe this douchecanoe can buy these 1952T's and doesn't have enough to pay for his $1800 rent/month. Definitely a candidate for Mensa...........

[Bruinsfan94]

At this point, I'm just confused. If you are going to lie, why pick a player who is still alive and then go tell everyone on a board that has 1000's of people who have been around baseball their whole life. Not that hard to find someone who could figure that out. I honestly think this guy just likes to be shady for the sake of being shady.

[jason.1969]

Let's put aside the history of fraud and felony, along with the false story of being a relative. Instead, let's just assume for a minute that someone really did want to corner the market on a card for profit. What would be the best formula?

1. Go with a classic set that will always have collectors
2. Choose a card there are the fewest of (i.e., high number, non-DP)
3. Choose a common since stars will cost too much.
4. Don't tell everyone what you're doing.

So our guy here succeeded with 3 out of 4. But let's imagine he went 4 for 4 and kept it up for another 15 years...

I'll assume he ends up with 600 of the card, at an avg purchase price of $300. That's $180K in all. I'll also assume there are 300 other surviving copies out there, scattered across various collectors holding 1-2 cards each.

Now there are two paths forward.

1. Call attention to the scarcity of the card and hope the market responds by doubling its valuation. If so, Cole could see a good profit on his first N sales, but at some point these sales would serve to erode the scarcity. So basically a fail.

2. In a high profile event, destroy all but perhaps the 10 highest grade copies of the card. Now the scarcity is permanent, and Cole holds perhaps 10 of the 15 highest grade copies. Because there are still 300 or so other copies out there, I still don't see enough scarcity to recoup the investment, but I would at least see immortality in the Hobby Lore and perhaps a handful of high-adrenalin sales in the $20K range.

Anyone see vastly different scenarios or outcomes?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by autograf

Well......get ready for multiple stealth account activation........I still can't believe this douchecanoe can buy these 1952T's and doesn't have enough to pay for his $1800 rent/month. Definitely a candidate for Mensa...........

I appreciate the fact that he is going to ruin me but first could I do him a favor? I figured what the heck, why not?

[7nohitter]

Are 'stealth accounts' a persistent problem on this board?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by 7nohitter

Are 'stealth accounts' a persistent problem on this board?

They are stealth so I don't know.... LMAO....not as far as I can tell but like I always say, I am sure some roaches crawl in under the door. And as long as they stay in the dark they won't get stomped on. I can't imagine being on a forum where I am not allowed or wanted. There has to be better things to do with my time. But I guess as evidenced by this thread one can never tell.

[egri]

Originally Posted by jason.1969

Let's put aside the history of fraud and felony, along with the false story of being a relative. Instead, let's just assume for a minute that someone really did want to corner the market on a card for profit. What would be the best formula?

1. Go with a classic set that will always have collectors
2. Choose a card there are the fewest of (i.e., high number, non-DP)
3. Choose a common since stars will cost too much.
4. Don't tell everyone what you're doing.

So our guy here succeeded with 3 out of 4. But let's imagine he went 4 for 4 and kept it up for another 15 years...

I'll assume he ends up with 600 of the card, at an avg purchase price of $300. That's $180K in all. I'll also assume there are 300 other surviving copies out there, scattered across various collectors holding 1-2 cards each.

Now there are two paths forward.

1. Call attention to the scarcity of the card and hope the market responds by doubling its valuation. If so, Cole could see a good profit on his first N sales, but at some point these sales would serve to erode the scarcity. So basically a fail.

2. In a high profile event, destroy all but perhaps the 10 highest grade copies of the card. Now the scarcity is permanent, and Cole holds perhaps 10 of the 15 highest grade copies. Because there are still 300 or so other copies out there, I still don't see enough scarcity to recoup the investment, but I would at least see immortality in the Hobby Lore and perhaps a handful of high-adrenalin sales in the $20K range.

Anyone see vastly different scenarios or outcomes?

He's off his rocker, plain and simple.

I think the thing to remember is that for him to go ahead with his plan, it only has to make sense to him. I could never justify spending that kind of money on cards while struggling to make rent, but I'm not the one trying to corner the market here. My frontal lobes haven't even fully developed yet, and I can tell that's a bad idea. I could understand if he was buying a few for immediate family, but this amount of spending just doesn't make sense.

[ALR-bishop]

Based on sage PM advice he has gone underground...or been grounded

[tschock]

Originally Posted by Leon

I'm really busy right now, but your story will be compiled and published on the front page & when it does I will activate the multiple stealth accounts I have on net54 to spam the hell out of your boards to spread the word about the exclusive story of Leon Luckey. Don't think I have forgotten or given up. A month may go by, but when I have a weekend to finalize the finishing touches on the organization of the article, it will go live, & you will never get that removed.

Do me a favor and post this reply to my thread in the meantime, as I was unable to post it when you banned me during the writing of this.

Sooooooooo... he has the ability to have multiple stealth accounts and will be able to post something on the front page that you won't be able to remove, but is "unable to post" because he was banned?

One world class hacker there.

[PolarBear]

Originally Posted by jason.1969

Now there are two paths forward.

1. Call attention to the scarcity of the card and hope the market responds by doubling its valuation. If so, Cole could see a good profit on his first N sales, but at some point these sales would serve to erode the scarcity. So basically a fail.

2. In a high profile event, destroy all but perhaps the 10 highest grade copies of the card. Now the scarcity is permanent, and Cole holds perhaps 10 of the 15 highest grade copies. Because there are still 300 or so other copies out there, I still don't see enough scarcity to recoup the investment, but I would at least see immortality in the Hobby Lore and perhaps a handful of high-adrenalin sales in the $20K range.

Anyone see vastly different scenarios or outcomes?

In the coin hobby, you run across specific hoarders now and then. It never, ever, works out for them financially. They may sell the first few at high prices but the market is what it is. They can never sustain it and ultimately lose because the high market prices were caused by the high prices they paid to hoard them and is not something they are ever able to fully recover when selling.

[deucetwins]

Will we be able to use our stealth accounts to submit multiple answers to Leon's monthly contests in order to increase our chances of winning?

[iowadoc77]

DOUCHECANOE!!!!!!!
Still laughing to tears over this.
Well said autograf!

[egri]

Originally Posted by deucetwins

Will we be able to use our stealth accounts to submit multiple answers to Leon's monthly contests in order to increase our chances of winning?

Wait, you don't already do that?

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by 7nohitter

Are 'stealth accounts' a persistent problem on this board?

Yes, and if you create one and Leon finds out you will be put on double secret probation. There is a little-known codicil in the N54 Constitution that gives the moderator unlimited power to preserve order in times of message board emergencies.

[btcarfagno]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Yes, and if you create one and Leon finds out you will be put on double secret probation. There is a little-known codicil in the N54 Constitution that gives the moderator unlimited power to preserve order in times of message board emergencies.

I want to make an amusing statement regarding the Germans bombing Pearl Harbor but can't quite figure out a way to fit it in.

So there.

Tom C

[iowadoc77]

Originally Posted by btcarfagno

I want to make an amusing statement regarding the Germans bombing Pearl Harbor but can't quite figure out a way to fit it in.

So there.

Tom C

[SMPEP]

Don't stop him. He's on a roll.

[the 'stache]

Just...wow. Just when you thought this couldn't get any weirder....

Remember the day, everybody, where the phrase "stealth account" entered into the Net 54 lexicon.

[Jantz]

Originally Posted by the 'stache

Just...wow. Just when you thought this couldn't get any weirder....

Remember the day, everybody, where the phrase "stealth account" entered into the Net 54 lexicon.

Bill

You forgot douchecanoe & codicil

[ksabet]

Leon will probably shake his head in disgust but these are my favorite posts.

I think we should have a "douchecanoe" Hall of Fame

I nominate Bruce Marshall Barkman, Adrian and this guy!!!

[7nohitter]

Originally Posted by ksabet

Leon will probably shake his head in disgust but these are my favorite posts.

I think we should have a "douchecanoe" Hall of Fame

I nominate Bruce Marshall Barkman, Adrian and this guy!!!

So these guys would be like the class of '36?

[jason.1969]

I believe I have figured out the scam, thankfully thwarted early by Leon.

Naturally, all of us wondered the same thing, "Why Bartirome?" as opposed to Hall of Famers or other notable cards from the set like Pafko. Well, here is the key...recall that this collector said several times that he is very young.

We know today that a great number of N54 members, perhaps even a majority, have seen the great stars of the 1950s play in person or at least met many of them at shows. However, think about kids who are just today developing a love for the game and its associated cardboard treasures. Will any of these kids even know--not by name but by face--the great Hank Aaron from Joe Pepitone, or Bob Feller from Johnny Antonelli?

So imagine now that in 30 years, with most of us dead or in homes (sorry!), that a fellow takes out his stash of 500 Bartiromes, does a little state-of-the-art card doctoring (which is really, really good in 2045), and makes just a few small modifications. And presto!!!

Sure, you'd be able to tell the difference, but think of the kids today who never saw or met the guy!

Tony Mantle.jpg

[Sean]

Originally Posted by ksabet

Leon will probably shake his head in disgust but these are my favorite posts.

I think we should have a "douchecanoe" Hall of Fame

I nominate Bruce Marshall Barkman, Adrian and this guy!!!

And let's not forget Andrew and his Wagner.

[deucetwins]

For the douchecanoe HOF, some will definitely need to be picked by the Veteran's committee. (That damn Archive!)

I would also include ice cream scoops.

Could someone please post the thread links to/for all of the inaugural candidates? I realize with Adrian, there might be too many. (Post 1 today).

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by deucetwins

Could someone please post the thread links to/for all of the inaugural candidates?

The Andrew / Nun's Wagner Trilogy:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=163782

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=163800

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=163818

Enjoy...

Best regards,

Eric

[wolf441]

So, I've ignored this thread because I have no interest in 1952 Topps (no offense to anyone who does, it's just not my thing). I finally decided to see why it hadn't run it's course by now.

LEON, you need to have some sort of "THIS IS CRAZY SH*T" icon that you can stick to threads so that we know when to break out the bags of popcorn!

[tschock]

Originally Posted by wolf441

LEON, you need to have some sort of "THIS IS CRAZY SH*T" icon that you can stick to threads so that we know when to break out the bags of popcorn!

Maybe...

[whaler]

Originally Posted by bcornell

No, I can vouch for that doctor, too. He just likes giant mitts . I mean the guy who wants to buy every T212 (Obak) Miller (link). For all I know, he's still making set collectors pay for that card because he runs them up. He's a jerk and I'm positive that is a fact, not just my opinion.

Bill

Okay, I'll bite - why is it a fact that I am a jerk? I am quite certain we have never met, and I do not even recall ever having a conversation with you. Is it the fact that the cards of my great-grandfather are worth more to me than they are to some other people? I have been outbid on cards and not once did I think that the winning buyer was a jerk. I have never understood how some people feel they are entitled to a card to fill a hole in their set, at the price they want to pay, just because they want it. Feel free to disagree with what/how I collect, but I fail to see the need for name calling; that says more about you than it does me. I have done several transaction with board members here and I doubt anyone who has actually dealt with me would consider me a jerk.

[Sean]

And the Crazy continues....

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by whaler

I doubt anyone who has actually dealt with me would consider me a jerk.

No, that would just be every collector trying to complete a T212 Obak set who learns that you will run them up over a single card. Let me explain it again: You're not a collector, you're a hoarder who has no appreciation for the hobby.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by whaler

Is it the fact that the cards of my great-grandfather are worth more to me than they are to some other people?

No. But why have more than a couple cards?

I've been thinking about this. Hoarding cards is certainly not illegal, I don't even think it's unethical. But the more I consider this the more I agree with Bill, this is a complete "jerk" move.

Very similar to being first in line at a wedding buffet and taking all the shrimp. While that's certainly desirable, we don't do it because it's a "jerk" move.