T206 Collecting

[Archive]

Posted By: T206Collector

Okay, so about a year ago, I completed the Monster (save Magie, Doyle, Wagner and Plank) with the purchase of Cy Young Bare Hand from Connecticut dealer Chet Woods (if you don't know him, you should, great dealer!). Anyway, it turns out that was just the beginning as my next goal is to have the entire collection graded, with an average SGC grade of 40. I'm about 200 away at the moment, but we purchased a house in September and have another child (our second) on the way in January and so, well, yes it is impossible for me to spend any real money on cards anymore. I have spent about $100 over the past three months -- after spending $500-$1000 a month for awhile there. Now I have taken to trading cards with rarer backs for upgrades of the others; as well as downgrading small portions of my collection to upgrade larger portions of others.

At this rate I'll never get there. But I have taken a lot of comfort in the recent posts about people just beginning their T206 journeys; though it has also made me a little jealous. I remember quite well my first two T206 cards, Matty White Cap/Bender Portrait, followed by a Chase White Cap Throwing, and a Moeller and a Myers batting. They joys of beginning the walk up the hill are really incomparable -- completion in some ways is anti-climactic. But I have found that even when you keep a set together, that there are so many ways to enjoy collecting within that set through upgrades, downgrades, etc. that the journey really never ends. And, of course, I don't get to take the cards with me to the grave -- they will be sold off eventually by an heir that doesn't understand them. But they're all mine, currently, and it is a sort of responsibility to make it the best that I can within my means at the time.

So, anyway, I happen to think that our Grand Old Board would be a pretty lonely place without T206 cards. Sure there are lots of collectors with varying interests, but I think it's stating the obvious to say that T206 is at the core of the pre-war baseball cards. There really should be more posts devoted to its intricacies (backs, factories, images, conditions, rarities, etc.).

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

I remember the first T206 I ever bought- Groom, Washington, about 1983. No rhyme or reason why, something just had to be the first. And congratulations on your growing family.

[Archive]

Posted By: MVSNYC

T206 (IMO) is the pinnacle, the sexiest, the most fun to collect...

I'll post about them all day long...what do you want to talk about? rare backs, errors, printing freaks, etc...I've seen it all, and love it all...

here's a question for discussion:

what is the highest graded Drum back that anyone has ever seen or owned? I own a clean looking PSA 1...my best friend owns a PSA 4...let's here some others...

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Lable me one of those envious of anyone able to complete the set in any condition, regardless of grades, slabbed or unslabbed. From my humble beginnings last week i'm 13 cards to the good, all portrait cards as thats my primary focus in the accomplishment

[Archive]

Posted By: MVSNYC

good work dave...last week you said you would only get a card a week...you now have 13 so far...glad to see the monster is treating you well?

keep it up...and keep an eye on those raw lots on eBay...a lot of bang for the buck!

[Archive]

Posted By: RayB

T206 - Warm story. I am climbing the hill for the first time with this set and I am a little over 40% complete (almost 60% on the HOF'ers) in lower grades (PSA 1,2,3 mostly) and it has been exhilirating in every way.
I've complete a few other sets (since sold for this effort)less vintage in nature and the finish line is definitely anti climactic.
So; I hope my T-206 quest tales me a reaally long time; certainly finances seem to dictate it will.
I do also notice a core anchor of posts regarding this set that drives this Board and I am thankful for it.
Best of luck on your SGC quest. Any T-206 quest is ever so noble.
RayB

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

The highest graded Drum I ever saw was a Griffith, batting. I am remembering a PSA-7 but could be wrong. Anyone know the card I am referring to?

[Archive]

Posted By: JimB

Barry,
I remember that card from a Mastro auction about six or seven years ago. I am still kicking myself for not going after it. I don't remember what it sold for, but I am sure it would seem like a relative bargain today.
JimB

[Archive]

Posted By: MVSNYC

would you guys say Drum is the tuffest to find in mid-high grade? (obviously it is a very tuff back to begin with, but when they are found, they are almost always in lower grade, i find)...what other rare backs would you say are also very tuff to find in higher grades? lenox i feel the same about...

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Jim- if my memory is as good as I think it is wasn't the negative reversed in the catalog so that it looked like he was batting right-handed? I do agree that in today's market that would sell for about the price of a new car.

[Archive]

Posted By: JimB

Barry,
Your memory is better than mine. I know still have the catalog around somewhere. I'll see if I can find it later..


MSVNYC,
It does seem to be very hard to find in decent shape. My only Drum (Magee) is a PSA 1. I remember seeing a PSA 4 Speaker many moons ago that I also regret not buying. That is probably the second nicest one I have seen.

Maybe we have gone over this before, but would anybody care to venture a guess as to how many total Drums there are out there?
JimB

[Archive]

Posted By: Mike Ernst

I'll never forget seeing my first T206--late Winter, 1972. An elderly farmer outside of Max, ND, had me sitting at his kitchen table and he poured out of an old cereal box 1100 T-206's, T-205's, a few T-202's, some T birds, fish, etc. And then he proceeded to tell me that he had gotten these as a kid in NYC, kept them all this time because he just hoped he'd find someone who wanted them, and when I responded with "I don't know how much they're worth, but I'm sure I can't afford to pay you what they are worth", said "I want to give these to you--I'm just glad I found someone who wants them." I finally forced $20 on him, took them home and then had to figure out what they were worth. Back then, maybe $500-550.

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe Drouillard

Hello Everyone,

Like Dave I'm relatively new and I think I'm being seduced by the monster. I've been collecting vintage for a couple of years, but only recently started collecting prewar. My first T-206 was a John McGraw (finger in the air)that I got in a mixed lot of cards. The card had some damage around the face so I sold it on ebay. I was surprized that it brought it 4X what I paid for the whole mixed lot. Ever since I started buying an occassional T-206 to add to my collection, whenever I can buy a naked common card with no creases or paper damage for under twenty-five bucks I gobble it up. I've learned about bat-ears and other signs of trimming. I even spend an hour every day lurking on 54 reading about prewar cards.

Sometimes I just lay all of T-206s out on the floor in their toploaders and admire all of the color. I have 25 T-206s at this point, but I'm expecting a John McGraw (glove at the hip) in the mail any day. Of course I spent a lot more for the HOFer. Unlike other vintage cards when I have a T-206 coming I keep running to the mailbox until it arives. Never did that before for a Goudey, or Playball. That's why I think I'm getting hooked. Wait a minute . . . I think I hear the post truck . . . false alarm . . .drat!

I'm even thinking about selling my other vintage cards to pursue the monster. Somebody stop me before its to late (insert smiley face)!

All kidding aside, the little 1-7/16" x 2-5/8" buggers are fun to collect.

Best wishes,

Joe

[Archive]

Posted By: Lee

what is the trimming diagnostic character bat ears? I don't know a whole lot of trimming ternminaology, so please don't tear me apart.

Lee

[Archive]

Posted By: fessgreg

I have to say that I'm into t206 HOF's so I'll never complete a set. But I admire anyone that tries to put together any set especially t206's with 500 some cards. Do you have to go to a lot of shows and ebay sales in order to do it or can you buy a bunch of cards at a time?

[Archive]

Posted By: Brian Weisner

Drum backs: Higher grade sold since 1998:

Clark Griffith batting PSA 7
Johnson Pitching EX raw
Speaker SGC 50
Lennox EX raw


Uzit, Red Hindu and Lenox are all tough in high grade, but nothing is tougher than Drum.



I would guess there are between 80-140 Drums in existence, but that's just a guess. I have 7 in my collection, with none higher than a 4.


Be well Brian

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

I'm on the 6 year plan for the set, much like college. And the reason for the 13 this week, is I bought one on ebay, and then did a trade for the other 12...

[Archive]

Posted By: Lee

I usually get most of my cards (t206) from board members (25%) or eBay (70%) or elsewhere (5%)

Lee

[Archive]

Posted By: T206Collector

"Bat ears" are what corners often look like on trimmed cards. The application of the scissors to the edge creates a sort of curve -- that is, most trimmed edges are not perfectly straight. As a result, you end up with corners that are pointier than they should be -- they look like bat ears.

With respect to purchasing to get the monster, there were two or three large lots that really got me going. I bought a lot of 100 cards on ebay for $500 a few years ago. The cards were in terrible shape, but it got me well on the way. After that, I would buy smaller lots of 10-20 cards whenever possible, and if I had a double, I would sell the lower condition double immediately. I often found that you could get a discount in bulk, so when I sold the lower condition double individually, it was like the lot I had just purchased was cheaper or even free (or even like someone paid me to buy the lot!). That doesn't happen so much anymore, I don't think, unless you buy a mega-ton of cards at a time.

Most of the cards I got on ebay, though to finish off a few holes here and there I found the local card show to be helpful. And, of course, this Board is quite a resource.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

a dealer in CT named Chet Woods...can you refer me to his website or do you have other contact info for him?
much appreciated
Jason

leinberj@georgetown.edu

[Archive]

Posted By: James Feagin

T206 Collector-

You always know where you can go if you need some more $$$ if you should part with a certain subset of cards you have

James

[Archive]

Posted By: david poses

i always wanted to collect t206 cards and started about 7 months ago, buying them up with a ferocity i never expected. it seems like sometime between june and september, the prices got ridiculous. i began to notice, based on the board and the stats of bidders i was bidding against, that a lot of people, just like me, were also starting to collect t206s and i developed a theory that this rush of novice collectors will drive the price of low-end cards through the roof, as everyone's price point was about the same. i had about 60 cards when i decided to cool it for a bit. ultimately, i put most of them on ebay and made back much more than i had spent on them. 1950 and 52 bowmans were cards i always loved, so i put the money i made on the t206 cards into bowmans and now have a nearly complete 52 set and 1/4 of a 50 set. the t206 cards i kept are all southern leaguers (persons, carlos smith, cranston, etc) and a few i couldn't part with (malarkey- love the name, dooin, jack white, cy young portrait, starr, abstein, becker).

pardon me if this comes off negative, but i started thinking that if everyone went into the monster with the same gusto as i, and everyone got discouraged when prices started getting ridiculous (a psa2 clymer selling for $67- what? why?!), and the notion of completing a t206 set seemed impossible, eventually, some of you/us would start selling to focus on a more realistic set to complete (the bowmans?). i also got the feeling that if anyone had spent a fortune on t206 cards for months and found themselves strapped for cash around the holidays, prices might fall a bit (at which point i might get back into the monster)

i came to this as a pure collector- have no intent of making a profit (that i profited from my sales is coincidence- obviously i won't reject free money, but i was only looking to recoup expenses) and just wanted nice cards to look at and keep for the kids, so when it stopped being fun and started being too much of a business (losing by 50cents to a sniper, prices too high to justify, etc), i leaned toward the bowmans partially also because they aren't too popular and i seldom pay more than $3.00 for a card. they are beautiful cards and they can be found in great shape for not a lot of money.

hopefully this won't make the 50's bowman market too hot for me, but i turned 50 or so t206 cards into 300+ bowmans and as much as i miss the t206 cards, i love getting more cards everyday and enjoy the thrill of knowing i will complete a set without having to mortgage my house for an eddie plank card. not sure if anybody cares, but i figured i'd throw my t206 story from the perspective of someone who got discouraged. this board has been incredibly useful and informative and even though i haven't bought a t206 in a while, i'm here everyday.

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

I know in a previous thread I had asked the question what do you think it would take money wise to just plain buy a complete T206 set, minus big four of course, in beater condition, psa 1's or sgc 10's. i believe the comment was anywhere between 18k and 25k or something to that effect. I'm wondering though if there is any record anyone can find of the actual last beater complete set that was auctioned off, either on ebay, or auction house or whatever.

[Archive]

Posted By: RayB

David,
Thanks for posting.
The T-206 set has taught me one thing. You need lots of patience. Entering this set with "ferosity" is often the new collectors ultimate downfall when it comes to this set.
Because of it's popularity and status among collectors of all means ther are definitely waves of pricing strength that might frustrate the budget conscious.
A few important things to note:
First, try to add cards one at a time in the beginning. There is so much product offered that you can let those go that get out of hand price wise.
(Keep in mind that "out of hand" is relative; although prices for T-206s sway back and forth, the trend is upward over time. The premium of today is the bargain of tomorrow, or at least time has showed this to be true.) If you take a deliberate approach, a year or two from now you will wake up to find that you have quite a few cards in the set without much effort at all. One card a week is 10% of the set in a year. Take smaller bites. T-206 set building is a journey and rarely a conquest. It's more of a collector's lifes calling.

Second - Don't calculate what it will take to buy all the cards now. Once you do that type of calculation, the enormity of it will make you destined to fail at this pursuit.

Third - Learn to appreciate and enjoy nice lower grade cards, perhaps with a flaw or two most collectors avoid. (Sometimes a little bit of paper loss, or a small mark or erasure will chase the majority of collectors from a particular card.) This is an opportunity. Many of these have great eye appeal.

Lastly - You seem like you were/are really attracted to the set. You've retained some cards, kept the embers hot, and visit here for your attachment fix. The enthusiasm for the set here is boundless. Feed off of that to get you through the low points and use it as a place to enjoy sharing the new acquisitions. Most of all; keep it about the fun. This is supposed to be fun.

Best of luck with whatever you choose to do. Congratulations also on that nice 52' set you've built.
The "Monster" is calling.
RayB

[Archive]

Posted By: MVSNYC

here's a big bit of advice...

Learn about the players & the history of the game...when you have that knowledge, you will appreciate the Monster 10-fold...

buy "The Glory of Their Times", by Lawrence Ritter...either on video or the book...it is magical, not only does it mention dozens of players from T206, but it actually is real accounts from the players themselves...you'll love it...