52 Mantle - Authentic or Fake?

[ChrisNTx]

So I came across this and wondering if it is authentic or fake? It is the Type A Mantle
Wanted to get others thoughts who are more experienced than I

[Bestdj777]

If a 52 Topps Mantle has a bit of wear, I can usually venture a decent guess as to whether it is authentic. I am far from an expert when they are this clean, as I just do not know the intricacies. That said, I would not feel comfortable with this card. To me, it looks like it was just printed.

[sycks22]

Doesn't look good to me.

[Gr8Beldini]

Fake

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

I don't know much about 52T. How can you tell it's a fake from that pic alone.

[ALR-bishop]

The scan is not very helpful. Is this a card you have, or one someone is offering to you ?

If you have it, just get it graded or see if someone like Levi Bleam will take a look at it for you.

If someone is offering it to you, it makes no sense that the seller would not have a card that looked that good, if authentic, graded first

[itjclarke]

IMO looks a bit fishy, with red flags (ungraded, bad photos), but some big things like the black border alignment and Yankee logo look good. Would a chance to take it out of that top loader for a closer look/feel

[GregC]

A '52 Topps #311 that looks that good and has not found it's way into some TPG slab? I would be very skeptical. I know some people just love raw cards but if that is for sale, why leave a pile of money on the table?

[Volod]

Maybe just my failing eyesight, but does the card not have untypically wide borders, both front and back?

[pawpawdiv9]

wish it was on ascanner, plus the sleeve makes it hard. I say FAKE.
The black outlines dont look right. Plus what looks like water stains, cant tell if background is blue/green tinting.
As for the back, i was only aware the black stiching area was the only dark area, looks like the stats area is the same darkness.
Other than that, theres not much i really can see from those bad pics.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by pawpawdiv9

wish it was on ascanner, plus the sleeve makes it hard. I say FAKE.
The black outlines dont look right. Plus what looks like water stains, cant tell if background is blue/green tinting.
As for the back, i was only aware the black stiching area was the only dark area, looks like the stats area is the same darkness.
Other than that, theres not much i really can see from those bad pics.

I actually thought the black border looked pretty good (slightly misaligned at corners, etc).. But my only knowledge is based what I've read on line. Would be curious to know if there's something I'm not seeing. Agree, it's frustrating it's not a scan, or at least a pic outside of top loader.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by Volod

Maybe just my failing eyesight, but does the card not have untypically wide borders, both front and back?

That was the very first thing that raised a red flag for me. Then the back, which could be the angle of the camera but even then I don't think the back borders would be that much skewed (as compared to the front).

Fake. And a card like that?...all my cards are raw and I'm not even a raw v holder stickler...but if I were selling it I wouldn't shove it in a banged up scratched toploader. Also, and I can't really tell w/o a Luckey (hi Leon) quarter, but I don't think that loader is the proper size for a 52T, more like later 50's, and beyond, cards -- in other words, the top of the card would be sticking out the top of the toploader. for a Topps. And believe me, I have enough of them sticking out, which is my personal laziness, but not what I would do with a card like that, were it real.

[bobsbbcards]

Originally Posted by GregC

A '52 Topps #311 that looks that good and has not found it's way into some TPG slab?

I just had to chime in with a scan of the '52 Mantle that will be going to PSA for an entombment. It was actually pulled from a pack by a friend of mine (I've seen all of his '52s.....they all match this one). He is old (actually older than Al, if that's possible), and knew very little about the grading process. It's a nice card with all of its issues in the border area (4ish, but will go for more money if he sells).

To view the whole card at one time, right click on the image and choose "View Image".

[ALR-bishop]

Take it from another old guy, Bob, that is a nice card

[NateMack]

The border on the back has too large a gap on the top AND the bottom. All my 52's I looked at have small borders on the top and bottom if they are centered, and if they are not centered and have one larger border, then the opposite is very small or non existent.

I couldn't tell if it is real or fake without actually seeing the card in person, but I would be leery, very leery. Is this an online transaction? Do you live near each other to check it out in person? Is the asking price as high as it should be for such a nice card or is the seller "giving you a break" on the price? Nothing like the feel test. Also the 50s Topps cards have a pretty distinct smell.

Just my 2 cents...

[ChrisNTx]

Thanks for the info guys - it's from a very old man who wants nothing to do with grading and says he has had this for 20 plus years. Haven't seen in person yet but am going to try and get better pics out of top holder. He has all kinds of 50s and 60s cards from sets and is beginning to part with some of them. All the major fake things for type a seemed ok when i looked at scan (things lining up on back, pixel missing lower left corner, etc) just wanting others opinions

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by ChrisNTx

Thanks for the info guys - it's from a very old man who wants nothing to do with grading and says he has had this for 20 plus years. Haven't seen in person yet but am going to try and get better pics out of top holder. He has all kinds of 50s and 60s cards from sets and is beginning to part with some of them. All the major fake things for type a seemed ok when i looked at scan (things lining up on back, pixel missing lower left corner, etc) just wanting others opinions

I vote not to give up on it yet.. especially if you can see it in person. I agree with your comment on the black border on front, it matches mine (aligment, missing pixel, little dog ear) to a T... as does the name block. The Yankee logo and bat look good too.. and I can see no discernable difference in image/color (but of course taking out of holder, seeing in higher res and/or in person and/or with loupe would make it much easier to see flaws). I don't dispute anything anyone else says, nor do I think there are not major red flags, but I'd never turn my back on it, especially if you can meet in person. It's all good as long as you don't need to give him money before doing your due dilligence. Could very well be a fake, but could be an absolute gem too.

When I purchased mine, I'd talked to seller by phone 4-5 times, met him in person at LAX, had his personal/business contact info, and received the card still packaged in box from PSA.. I had even been able to track it's shipment from them to him (He signed for it about 1 hour before catching his flight to LAX).. and I had talked to PSA while card was there. You don't have those luxuries, but long short is to take every precaution you can. However my personal opinion is also not to exclude yourself from the opportunity yet. I am very happy I was willing to withhold early judgement based on seller's low feedback total/% and crap listing photos.

Adding- Regardless, good luck!!

[thenextlevel]

Card looks fake.

[bobsbbcards]

Here's what the back of one should look like (off eBay) next to the back of the one in question. It is clearly NOT real.

[itjclarke]

Ok, that one sold me.

If within reasonable driving distance, I'm still all for seeing it in person. If nothing else, will help to identify anything that might give it away (thickness, feel, visible pixels, etc).

[pawpawdiv9]

see ^ ..Thats why its important to have scans, it makes it so much easier. But in person is a must for a high price from a unknown source. Plus, also do the 'light test' to see if the paper stock is correct.
In my origina reply..I was thinking the black outline was too dark and thick, perhaps drawn in/touch up. as for the water stain remark..it may be 'washed' , maybe infers to why the reddish color on the back seemed off.
And with Bobs pic...yeah looks narrow from L-R for sure now.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Originally Posted by bobsbbcards

Here's what the back of one should look like (off eBay) next to the back of the one in question. It is clearly NOT real.

I still can't tell the difference. Can you educate me?

[bobsbbcards]

Originally Posted by I Only Smoke 4 the Cards

I still can't tell the difference. Can you educate me?

It's the size of the borders on the back. Look at how much empty space there is on the fake one.

[NateMack]

Originally Posted by bobsbbcards

It's the size of the borders on the back. Look at how much empty space there is on the fake one.

That is what I was saying as well. If you look at any of your 52 cards the back borders are pretty small. And the red box on the back has pretty small borders, on my stack of 52s at least...

[pawpawdiv9]

Here is a link: http://home.comcast.net/~52mantle/
It will help educate you folks on the #311 mantle.
Shows you the real ones (both variations A & B) and what to look for.
Also shows spotting countefiets ones and more stuff.
The link has been posted several times before and is very useful.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Originally Posted by pawpawdiv9

Here is a link: http://home.comcast.net/~52mantle/
It will help educate you folks on the #311 mantle.
Shows you the real ones (both variations A & B) and what to look for.
Also shows spotting countefiets ones and more stuff.
The link has been posted several times before and is very useful.

Thanks for sharing. I learned some things I didn't know.

[stlcardsfan]

This card just popped up on St. Louis Craigslist. Tried to just post the pic but couldn't. Possible Var A?

http://stlouis.craigslist.org/clt/4539455005.html

[pawpawdiv9]

Originally Posted by stlcardsfan

This card just popped up on St. Louis Craigslist. Tried to just post the pic but couldn't. Possible Var A?

http://stlouis.craigslist.org/clt/4539455005.html

Use the image URL and copy/paste to the link in the tool-bar
Also, from the front scan--yes its a Var A card..you can tell by the line is complete around the logo box
BTW-- the border lines dont look right as they are not equal thickness..plus its centered too well...Gotta be FAKE.

[stlcardsfan]

Yes, I thought the centering was a little too good as well. In reviewing the web page on this thread I didn't think there were too many giveaways it was a fake. It's not a bad one if in fact it is a fake.

[Bestdj777]

My opinion is that it is a fake. The wear doesn't look natural, the finish on the card looks too flat, and the stain on the back is bizarre.

[the 'stache]

The St. Louis Craigslist Mantle is a type A (easiest way to tell is to look at the Yankee logo. The type A Yankee logo has the black border on the bottom. The type B does not-the yellow box runs right into the white background of the name plate.

Finally, since it is a type A, it's 100% fake because if you look at the black border surrounding the card, the lower left hand corner should be missing a pixel. The card for sale is not missing the pixel. In fact, it appears if the horizontal black border extends beyond the left vertical border.

[stlcardsfan]

Thanks for the continued education guys. I hope to use it one day if the opportunity presents itself!