NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post. Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on Ebay
Pre-WWII Cards
Post WWII Cards
Vintage Memorabilia
Babe Ruth Cards
Ty Cobb Cards
Lou Gehrig Cards
Mickey Mantle Cards
Goudey Cards
Bowman Cards
T205s on Ebay
Tobacco "T" Cards
Caramel "E" Cards
Vintage Baseball Postcards
Football Cards on Ebay
Exhibit Cards
Strip Cards
Baking Cards
Sporting News
Playball Cards on Ebay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-09-2019, 04:58 AM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 4,008
Default PSA 8 T206 Honus Wagner currently missing from Pop Report

Looks like after the discussion on Gary Moser's card alteration habits and being interviewed for the New York Times, Ken Kendrick has sent his T206 Wagner into PSA for Review. It is currently missing from the Pop Report.

For those that keep saying "nothing is ever going to happen," maybe stop saying that? It looks like PSA is taking this seriously.

Add: First posted this morning by Bruins1993 on blowout: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showth...1302161&page=2
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Wagner.JPG (56.6 KB, 838 views)
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.

Last edited by swarmee; 07-09-2019 at 04:59 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:04 AM
conor912's Avatar
conor912 conor912 is offline
C0nor D0na.hue
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,174
Default

It is my understanding that PSA has already reaffirmed the grade in the past. For them not to do so now would be admitting a level of incompetence that would rattle even the thirstiest of KoolAid drinkers. I would be absolutely shocked if they stripped the 8.
__________________
Items for sale or trade here UPDATED 3-16-18
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:37 AM
darwinbulldog's Avatar
darwinbulldog darwinbulldog is offline
Glenn
Glen.n Sch.ey-d
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 2,055
Default

More likely that somebody hacked the population report or that PSA is simply correcting a grading error?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:45 AM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
Default

When I sent in two cards years ago to be re-holdered they were removed from the pop report until the order was complete.

I am more inclined to think it is something like this.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:49 AM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 4,008
Default

Could be a reholder, but I believe it's already been reholdered a couple of times. Not sure why you would do that at this point.
I sincerely doubt hacking.
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:55 AM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
Could be a reholder, but I believe it's already been reholdered a couple of times. Not sure why you would do that at this point.
I sincerely doubt hacking.
https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...on-on-exhibit/

A quick Google search returned this from 2016 and it is in an older holder.

I will look and see if I can find any newer pics.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-09-2019, 06:04 AM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
Default

After looking at that Blowout thread there were 34 in the pop and the image you showed that is current shows 33.

It is either being reviewed or re-holdered as the AUTH number was 6 in both and the total is one lower.

https://www.psacard.com/cert/00000001/

It is showing not in database at the moment.

Last edited by Dpeck100; 07-09-2019 at 06:05 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-09-2019, 10:30 AM
Fuddjcal Fuddjcal is offline
Chuck Tapia
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,303
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
Could be a reholder, but I believe it's already been reholdered a couple of times. Not sure why you would do that at this point.
I sincerely doubt hacking.
just going to make a few slight changes by dipping in chemicals and re-trimming to possibly get a 9. Brent Mastro probably gave it to Moser and then will send it back in to PSA to be re-graded a 9 or a 10 coming soon to a PWCC auction near you.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-09-2019, 10:34 AM
darwinbulldog's Avatar
darwinbulldog darwinbulldog is offline
Glenn
Glen.n Sch.ey-d
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 2,055
Default

Where it will sell for...ONE MILLION DOLLARS! one hundred billion dollars.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-09-2019, 12:12 PM
samosa4u's Avatar
samosa4u samosa4u is offline
Ran-jodh Dh.ill0n
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Toronto
Posts: 467
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by conor912 View Post
I would be absolutely shocked if they stripped the 8.
This will never happen. Where will PSA get the money from to refund this card?

If PSA can just fix this Gary Moser mess, then I'll be happy.
__________________
Always looking to buy or trade for vintage hockey, soccer, boxing and non-sports.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-09-2019, 12:30 PM
bmwntux bmwntux is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 1
Default T206 Wagner

The first card PSA graded back in 1991 was the Gretzky T206 Wagner. This is the PSA 8 card discussed here. It is well known that the card was altered by Bill Mastro. He admitted under oath that he trimmed the card, and it was in fact cut from a sheet. In Michael O'Keeffe's book, "The Card", the story is laid out in full detail. Mr. Kendrick is well aware of the card's providence. It is curious that PSA removed the card from the pop report after all of these years. It seems an admission of complicity in the decades old scandal.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-09-2019, 12:40 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

I hope that's a spellcheck error.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-09-2019, 12:40 PM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 4,008
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by samosa4u View Post
This will never happen. Where will PSA get the money from to refund this card? .
May not need to, if Mr. Kendrick has already said the card is worth the same or more based on the notoriety of the alteration.
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-09-2019, 12:41 PM
frankbmd's Avatar
frankbmd frankbmd is offline
Fr@nk Burke++
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Between the 1st tee and the 19th hole
Posts: 5,795
Default

It may be lost in the process, whatever the process is, but not to worry, whatever happens is good for the hobby.
__________________
FRANK:BUR:KETT - RAUCOUS SPORTS CARD FORUM MEMBER BUT CLEARLY........

GOOD FOR THE HOBBY AND THE FORUM WITH A VAULT IN AN UNDISCLOSED LOCATION


518/1000 Monster Number

Over*760* successful B/S/T transactions completed in 2012-19.
Over 550 sales with satisfied Board members served.
Thank you all.



Now nearly PQ.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-09-2019, 02:37 PM
Stampsfan's Avatar
Stampsfan Stampsfan is offline
Bob Davies
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 776
Default

Maybe it will be in the next PWCC auction on eBay, and they are reholdering (sp?) it as we speak.

If so, it will certainly be worthy of attention.
__________________
Successful transactions on Net54 with greenmonster66; Peter_Spaeth; robw1959; Stetson_1883; boxcar18; Blackie
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 07-09-2019, 02:47 PM
Promethius88 Promethius88 is offline
Tim Hadley
Tim Ha.dley
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Springfield, IL
Posts: 359
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
May not need to, if Mr. Kendrick has already said the card is worth the same or more based on the notoriety of the alteration.
This....exactly. Due to the history, it is worth more and I don't believe the price guarantee would be exercised even if it's placed in an "Authentic Altered" holder. As long as the Gretzky pedigree is still on the label.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 07-09-2019, 02:51 PM
LOTSOS LOTSOS is offline
Kevin L@wrence
member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 10
Default

Not in house. Not in for review. System glitch.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 07-09-2019, 02:53 PM
LOTSOS LOTSOS is offline
Kevin L@wrence
member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 10
Default

https://forums.collectors.com/discus...removed#latest
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 07-09-2019, 03:02 PM
perezfan's Avatar
perezfan perezfan is online now
M@RK ST€!NBERG
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,273
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by samosa4u View Post
This will never happen. Where will PSA get the money from to refund this card?

If PSA can just fix this Gary Moser mess, then I'll be happy.
Then you’ll never be happy. PSA cannot possibly “fix” it. Those cards are everywhere now. It has spread like a virus into hundreds of our collections. For every one that’s been exposed on BO, figure that 8-10 others have not been (and will never be) identified.

This is hardly a new development, and is not limited to Moser. The only thing new is the use of the internet (and some sloppy trails left behind) which enabled the skilled detectives at BO to uncover the blatant alterations.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 07-09-2019, 03:15 PM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 4,008
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOTSOS View Post
Not in house. Not in for review. System glitch.
Thanks for getting the answer from the horse's mouth. There sure have been a lot of sudden backup errors, computer glitches, missing pictures, and lost info the past two months...

But since the card is currently off the pop report, why not take the opportunity to review it for Mr. Kendrick free of charge?
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 07-09-2019, 03:20 PM
benjulmag benjulmag is online now
CoreyRS.hanus
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 502
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Promethius88 View Post
This....exactly. Due to the history, it is worth more and I don't believe the price guarantee would be exercised even if it's placed in an "Authentic Altered" holder. As long as the Gretzky pedigree is still on the label.
You probably express the majority view, though until an actual sale takes place at such a level with the card re holdered as an "A", I will respectfully disagree. If though it turns out to be the case, I would think the price of certain vintage full-production-run uncut sheets will explode in value, not to mention the "A" Plank that came from the same sheet as the Wagner.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 07-09-2019, 05:10 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 7,518
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by benjulmag View Post
…….. not to mention the "A" Plank that came from the same sheet as the Wagner.
Hi Corey

Your last comment sparked an instant "flashback" in my mind to the Willow Grove Show (circa 1985). The scenario was....Bill Mastro shopping around his new-found T206 Wagner to
us dealers at the Show. I remember he wanted 30K for it (which was a lot $$$$$ for it back then). But upon my close observation, I don't recall if I passed on it because of the price,
or because of my suspicion that it appeared "trimmed".

It certainly was the Talk of the Show that weekend. Furthermore, a rumor was "floating" around that this Wagner was cut from a PIEDMONT sheet which included an Eddie Plank card.
The rumor regarding the Plank card eventually materialized when we found out that Charlie Conlon acquired this PIEDMONT Plank from Mastro.
And, it was eventually graded by PSA as an "A".

Nevertheless, a bunch of us dealers (including me) reflecting back to that weekend in the mid-1980's do have some regrets.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 07-09-2019, 07:14 PM
Bigdaddy's Avatar
Bigdaddy Bigdaddy is offline
+0m J()rd@N
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: VA
Posts: 707
Default

Assume it was resubmitted, looking for a 'bump'
__________________
Working Sets:
Baseball-
T206 SLers, Virginia League; 1957 Topps; 1964 Topps Giants auto'd; 1965 Topps; 1971 Topps; 1972 Topps
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 07-09-2019, 07:17 PM
Jobu's Avatar
Jobu Jobu is online now
Bry@n
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: WI
Posts: 2,396
Default

Any chance you have a scan of that Plank? I'd love to see it. Maybe you can also post your A Plank, I love seeing that one too!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tedzan View Post
Hi Corey

Your last comment sparked an instant "flashback" in my mind to the Willow Grove Show (circa 1985). The scenario was....Bill Mastro shopping around his new-found T206 Wagner to
us dealers at the Show. I remember he wanted 30K for it (which was a lot $$$$$ for it back then). But upon my close observation, I don't recall if I passed on it because of the price,
or because of my suspicion that it appeared "trimmed".

It certainly was the Talk of the Show that weekend. Furthermore, a rumor was "floating" around that this Wagner was cut from a PIEDMONT sheet which included an Eddie Plank card.
The rumor regarding the Plank card eventually materialized when we found out that Charlie Conlon acquired this PIEDMONT Plank from Mastro.
And, it was eventually graded by PSA as an "A".

Nevertheless, a bunch of us dealers (including me) reflecting back to that weekend in the mid-1980's do have some regrets.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 07-09-2019, 07:48 PM
Paul S Paul S is offline
P. Sp.ec.tor
member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Landlocked by High Toll Fees
Posts: 2,096
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I hope that's a spellcheck error.
Me too
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 07-09-2019, 08:12 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 7,518
Default

Deleted.

Last edited by tedzan; 07-14-2019 at 07:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 07-09-2019, 08:21 PM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 4,008
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul S View Post
Me too
Are you guys ragging a brand new poster on his use of "providence" instead of "provenance"? Could easily be a replaced word from swiping the cellphone keyboard. I know I do it every once in a wheel.
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 07-09-2019, 08:23 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
Are you guys ragging a brand new poster on his use of "providence" instead of "provenance"? Could easily be a replaced word from swiping the cellphone keyboard. I know I do it every once in a wheel.
I see what you did.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 07-09-2019, 08:27 PM
darwinbulldog's Avatar
darwinbulldog darwinbulldog is offline
Glenn
Glen.n Sch.ey-d
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 2,055
Default

C'mon, if there's one thing this world admires it's a pedant.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 07-10-2019, 03:55 AM
benjulmag benjulmag is online now
CoreyRS.hanus
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 502
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tedzan View Post
Hi Corey

Your last comment sparked an instant "flashback" in my mind to the Willow Grove Show (circa 1985). The scenario was....Bill Mastro shopping around his new-found T206 Wagner to
us dealers at the Show. I remember he wanted 30K for it (which was a lot $$$$$ for it back then). But upon my close observation, I don't recall if I passed on it because of the price,
or because of my suspicion that it appeared "trimmed".

It certainly was the Talk of the Show that weekend. Furthermore, a rumor was "floating" around that this Wagner was cut from a PIEDMONT sheet which included an Eddie Plank card.
The rumor regarding the Plank card eventually materialized when we found out that Charlie Conlon acquired this PIEDMONT Plank from Mastro.
And, it was eventually graded by PSA as an "A".

Nevertheless, a bunch of us dealers (including me) reflecting back to that weekend in the mid-1980's do have some regrets.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Ted,

I remember that show well. I also remember some people at the time speculating that the Wagner Mastro had was the oversized one (currently at the HOF) that was trimmed down to make it a Nr-Mt card.

Speaking of regrets, I certainly have some from that episode. Bob Sevchuck, the person who sold the cards to Mastro, first called me to tell me he had en route a Nr-Mt Wagner and would I be interested. I had just bought a '39 Playball set from Bob and at the time he and I did business together. I already by that time had acquired the Wagner I currently own, and between having to come up with another $25K (his price for the Wagner) coupled with my concern whether a Wagner in such condition might be a fake, I told Bob I needed some time to think about it. While I was taking that time, he sold the lot to Mastro.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 07-10-2019, 04:32 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Perhaps I've merely forgotten, but I would like to know the background story of why the Plank was correctly assigned an AUTH, and why the Wagner got an 8. Two cards cut from the same cloth (hey, that was a good one), but treated entirely differently.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:23 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
Perhaps I've merely forgotten, but I would like to know the background story of why the Plank was correctly assigned an AUTH, and why the Wagner got an 8. Two cards cut from the same cloth (hey, that was a good one), but treated entirely differently.
Because the Wagner was PSA's flagship card.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:32 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Because the Wagner was PSA's flagship card.
If so, not a criteria for grading a card. A card should be assessed by its merits; its importance is irrelevant.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:39 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
If so, not a criteria for grading a card. A card should be assessed by its merits; its importance is irrelevant.
It's hard to start a grading company by rejecting a card.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 07-10-2019, 06:40 AM
benjulmag benjulmag is online now
CoreyRS.hanus
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 502
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
Perhaps I've merely forgotten, but I would like to know the background story of why the Plank was correctly assigned an AUTH, and why the Wagner got an 8. Two cards cut from the same cloth (hey, that was a good one), but treated entirely differently.
You're searching for logic where there is none to be found.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:01 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by benjulmag View Post
You're searching for logic where there is none to be found.
Well it's due time that PSA starts applying logic to its fullest extent. A T206 Wagner is graded by the same standards as a T206 Nattress. No difference.

And enjoyed our time together yesterday.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:04 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
It's hard to start a grading company by rejecting a card.
Giving the Wagner an AUTH wouldn't be rejecting it. And they could have set the tone for their new grading business that we will strive to get this thing right. Never has a business started off on worse footing than grading that card an 8. Shameful.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:18 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
Giving the Wagner an AUTH wouldn't be rejecting it. And they could have set the tone for their new grading business that we will strive to get this thing right. Never has a business started off on worse footing than grading that card an 8. Shameful.
Unfortunately, their enormous success starting from that foundation speaks for itself.

I don't think AUTH came in until years later, could be wrong.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.

Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 07-10-2019 at 07:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:22 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Unfortunately, their enormous success starting from that foundation speaks for itself.

I don't think AUTH came in until years later, could be wrong.
You may be right about that. So back then a trimmed card couldn't be slabbed, it would have had to been rejected. Interesting dilemma.

Last edited by barrysloate; 07-10-2019 at 07:22 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:24 AM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 27,449
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
You may be right about that. So back then a trimmed card couldn't be slabbed, it would have had to been rejected. Interesting dilemma.
They should have started their grading at a grade of TRIMMED and then go from there. Wouldn't that have been the correct way to do it?
__________________
Leon Luckey

Last edited by Leon; 07-10-2019 at 07:24 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:25 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
They should have started their grading at a grade of TRIMMED and then go from there. Wouldn't that have been the correct way to do it?
In The Card, if I recall right, Bill Hughes said there was a consensus that they had to grade it given the context as the card being used to launch the business.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 07-10-2019, 07:54 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon View Post
They should have started their grading at a grade of TRIMMED and then go from there. Wouldn't that have been the correct way to do it?
Yes, that would have worked fine. Coins that are say in otherwise Fine condition, but have been cleaned, burnished, or whatever, are not given a numerical graded but are slabbed as "Fine Details".

Perhaps the Wagner could have been labeled "NR MT/MT Details."
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 07-10-2019, 08:21 AM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 7,518
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by benjulmag View Post
Ted,

I remember that show well. I also remember some people at the time speculating that the Wagner Mastro had was the oversized one (currently at the HOF) that was trimmed down to make it a Nr-Mt card.

Speaking of regrets, I certainly have some from that episode. Bob Sevchuck, the person who sold the cards to Mastro, first called me to tell me he had en route a Nr-Mt Wagner and would I be interested. I had just bought a '39 Playball set from Bob and at the time he and I did business together. I already by that time had acquired the Wagner I currently own, and between having to come up with another $25K (his price for the Wagner) coupled with my concern whether a Wagner in such condition might be a fake, I told Bob I needed some time to think about it. While I was taking that time, he sold the lot to Mastro.

Corey......this is quite a story.

Reminds me of regrets which still haunt me of an attractive girl I met in my youth, which I let get away

Bob Sevchuck used to come up with some great finds out there on Long Island (NY).

Actually, I find it very interesting that a good number of Wagner cards have emanated from the Long Island
area. Perhaps, it had something to do with American Lithographic Co. founder, Joseph P. Knapp, who had a
vacation home in nearby Bellport, Long Island (NY).

Hope to see you at the National.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 07-10-2019, 09:06 AM
Bpm0014's Avatar
Bpm0014 Bpm0014 is offline
Brendan Mullen
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 2,146
Default

It's hard to start a grading company by rejecting a card.

hahahahahaha
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 07-10-2019, 09:13 AM
1952boyntoncollector 1952boyntoncollector is offline
ja.ke liebe.rman
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: http://www.psacard.com/PSASetRegistry/alltimeset.aspx?s=175000&ac=1
Posts: 4,524
Default

I wonder if the PSA Auth population category is exploding in cards across the board..
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 07-10-2019, 10:31 AM
darwinbulldog's Avatar
darwinbulldog darwinbulldog is offline
Glenn
Glen.n Sch.ey-d
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 2,055
Default

And I wonder how many people have started buying up PSA A cards this summer, realizing the cards are frequently identical in condition to those that sell for 100x as much.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 07-10-2019, 12:21 PM
benjulmag benjulmag is online now
CoreyRS.hanus
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 502
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tedzan View Post
Corey......this is quite a story.

Reminds me of regrets which still haunt me of an attractive girl I met in my youth, which I let get away

Bob Sevchuck used to come up with some great finds out there on Long Island (NY).

Actually, I find it very interesting that a good number of Wagner cards have emanated from the Long Island
area. Perhaps, it had something to do with American Lithographic Co. founder, Joseph P. Knapp, who had a
vacation home in nearby Bellport, Long Island (NY).

Hope to see you at the National.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
I plan to be there Ted. I'll look forward to catching up with you.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 07-10-2019, 12:23 PM
drcy's Avatar
drcy drcy is offline
David Ru.dd Cycl.eback
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,531
Default

I think they should relabel the card (I would think it's obvious the card should be labeled accurately), but that it wouldn't be a financial issue for PSA as the card will likely retain it's value (though that's a question to be tested).

The card is unique, so 8 to AUTH valuation change (or lack thereof) on that exception-to-the-rule isn't a general test.

Last edited by drcy; 07-10-2019 at 12:45 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 07-10-2019, 12:26 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,541
Default

In my opinion most or all of the value now is in the card's notoriety. I don't think putting it in an AUTH flip would matter.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 07-10-2019, 12:56 PM
drcy's Avatar
drcy drcy is offline
David Ru.dd Cycl.eback
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,531
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
In my opinion most or all of the value now is in the card's notoriety. I don't think putting it in an AUTH flip would matter.
I actually think the card's value will go down in value with time. The notoriety and famous history is part of the mystique, but so was that it was the "highest grade Wagner."

Last edited by drcy; 07-10-2019 at 12:57 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Interesting T206 Heinie Wagner with missing team name marcdelpercio Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 18 07-15-2016 01:48 PM
1909-11 T206 Honus Wagner vs. 1911-16 Kotton Honus Wagner: Who Has More? Orioles1954 Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 39 08-29-2010 05:30 PM
Honus Wagner T206 swschultz Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 30 07-22-2010 08:22 PM
Honus Wagner T206 Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 1 11-07-2008 04:32 AM
T206 Honus Wagner PSA 9!!! Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 20 08-22-2007 08:18 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:50 PM.


ebay GSB