Any other baseball book collectors out there?

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Posted By: Max Weder

I haven't made a book posting in a while, but other than Jason, Barry [at least in spirit] and I, are there any other baseball book collectors lurking?

Max

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Posted By: joe

Hi Max, the only books I collect are Ty Cobb books. Don't have anything to trade though.

Joe

Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I'm not a collector, but more of an accumulator. I would guess I have close to 1,000 baseball books, but I don't go out of my way to look for valuable ones or anything like that. Garage sales, book sales and thrift stores when you can find them for anywhere from a dime to a dollar and I'll pick them up. The local library's book sale is coming up next week and I usually grab anywhere from 50-100 books at this sale at a $1 each.

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Posted By: ernest reyes

Hey There Max. I only have a few Baseball books. I especially like 19th century books with baseball themed covers.





http://dodgersblueheaven.blogspot.com/
http://imageevent.com/ernestreyes
http://mywantlist.blogspot.com/

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Posted By: Mike H

Max, I have some books, but they were purchased because of the covers or price. I don't enjoy reading the old fiction, but I like the look of some and use them in displays.

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Posted By: Mike

Collect some books. Not the old expensive ones. Like 1st editions with nice dust jackets. Looking for Putnams Orioles, Milwaukee Braves.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Max- I still have many of my rare books left (or I've repurchased them). My top 5 that I still have:

1) 1860 Base Ball Players Pocket Companion
2) 1868 Chadwick's Game of Baseball
3) 1834 Carver's Book of Sports
4) 1835 Babcock's Boys Book of Sports (1st edition)
5) 1859 NAABP League Constitution

But I have sold a lot of them over the years.

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Posted By: Jason Mishelow

Max I really think that until the booksellers come down to reasonable levels there are not going to be that many of us. It simply makes no sence for someone to start collecting books if they have to pay the current "market". As a result all of the books stay in the hands of the proffesional seller and no one gets to see how entertaning they can be. I started collecting books about 3 years ago and if I go to the major bookselling sites and do a search for the top 20 most epenseive book it is all the same books from the same sellers that were listed 3 years ago- the prices just make it so that the inventory does not move and that stiffles the hobby ( I think that you commented that some of the copies of Wards book have been sitting for 7 years from the same seller) I just don't get it- if something doesn't sell for years when do you start to think that maybe it isn't worth what you think it is. So there my rant as to the problem- I just don't have any idea how you fix it

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Posted By: barrysloate

Jason- I couldn't agree with you more. I think the rare book business is the biggest racket out there. It makes baseball card dealers look like choir boys. I've sold a number of better baseball books to book dealers at what I thought were fairly aggressive prices. Then at some future date I would check their websites and see the same volume marked up 500%. It's ludicrous, and you're right, the books sit for years unsold, and they don't seem to care.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I suppose you could always make an offer that seams reasonable. If a seller is going to let a book sit at the same price for 7 years then they aren't really a seller but a collector. And like Barry was saying about the markup on these books if a seller marked it up 500% then offer them about 40-50% so they are still making money. They may think about it at the very least, especially if it's been sitting unmoved in his inventory for 7 years.

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Posted By: Max Weder

Dan

I'm not sure even something like that works. My favorite story on this is for a rare baseball book in dust jacket (printed in the 1920s, and not Busting Em ) which I found on-line. The book was listed (5 or so years ago) for $1500. I have a nicer copy of the book, but without dust jacket. The price seemed high to me, as I thought a reasonable offer (maybe) was $750, given the rarity of the book.

I inquired from the dealer to see if I could get a scan of the dust jacket. This is before I would have made an offer. I not only couldn't get a scan, but the price went up to $2500. About a year later, he had re-raised the price to $7500, where the book sits today.

Oh well.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Max- it doesn't surprise in the least.

My favorite story is about five years ago I was reading the antiques paper and a NYC book dealer advertised an 1876 National League Constitution. That's a nice tough guide so I thought I would give him a call. When I asked him him his price he said "two hundred and fifty." Now I got pretty excited because I know that book is worth well over $250.

Of course you can guess the end of the story. He was asking $250,000! I told him that was a $1500 guide, what are you thinking? He made up some cockamamie story that it's the birth of the National League, etc, etc. I asked him if he would like to buy my entire baseball library. Of course he bought nothing.

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Posted By: Anonymous

I am new to this forum but glad to have found you folks. I have been a collector of baseball books for several years. Actually, I was inspired to get into books by Barry's great article in VCBC back in, I'm guessing 1995 or 1996. I picked up quite a few of the affordable early volumes including a decent "Play Ball" by Mike Kelly about 10 years ago. Have probably about 700 baseball books now and running out of room. My wife and I are talking about relocating to Cooperstown where we have a summer home. So maybe I'll go into the book business some day. You are right about antiquarian book dealers. They don't seem to care about actually selling books. At a show, one dealer actually told me that he liked to keep his good stuff for display and didn't care if it sold. He made his money selling large numbers of $10-15 books.

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Posted By: Tom Russo

Sorry, didn't mean to be anonymous, my mistake.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks for the compliments; to this day that is still my favorite article of the many I wrote over the years. A nice copy of the Kelly book is not easy to find- it was made on such poor quality paper that very few have survived. Come to think of it, I haven't seen one at auction for a number of years.

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Posted By: Max Weder

Tom

Nice to see another book collector join the forum. I think we've done a few ebay transactions over the years.

I agree with you on Barry's article; there certainly have been a shortage of articles on baseball books which provide us with illustrations of what the books look like. I'm (slowly) trying to scan my collection, as well as saving jpgs of books from auctions, even if I don't win the auction.

Books are unlike cards in that most card images are readily available from a number of sources, even if they are expensive. I don't think there is one spot on the web similar to the LOC website for cards or the baseball sheet music site. Some early books are readily available (Spink, Spalding) and the images are well known; others only show up rarely, and dust jackets are all but unknown (Busting Em dj , for example)

Max

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Posted By: Anonymous

Max,
A website would be a great idea. A lot of work for you though. I was hoping to get Barry to do an update. Suggested it to VCBC a couple of years ago. I really enjoyed that magazine. A while back,I successfully defended them in a libel suit brought by an alleged autograph expert here in New Jersey. By the way, I think I am bidding on one of your books right now.

Tom

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Posted By: Max Weder

Hi Tom

I've got 160 images loaded right now on my flickr site http://www.flickr.com/photos/baseballart/sets/72057594052372441/ but many more to scan.

Max

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Max, I'm curious as to whether or not you consider the Billy Sunday books as "Baseball" books? They do contain a chapter on his time in baseball and photos of him in uniform. I'm just wondering.

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Posted By: Max Weder

Dan

I have a few Billy Sunday books, but I don't go out of my way to buy them. Marginal baseball at best.

Max

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Posted By: Alan

Are there many books available on Moe Berg or Lipman Pike. I imagine they would be very expensive, but how many different titles are there out there ?

Alan

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Posted By: Max Weder

Alan

I haven't seen any on Lipman Pike, but there are a number of biographies of Moe Berg. The first was 1974 Moe Berg, Athlete Scholar Spy. It is readily available as a used book and is inexpensive. In reply, Moe Berg's sister wrote a book, which I believe is titled My Brother was Moe Berg, feeling the 1974 bio was not accurate. The sister's book is relatively hard to find and sells for $200 and up on ebay. It is really the only expensive bio.

There have been at least 4 subsequent biographies of Berg since, with the most in-depth being Dawidoff's book The Catcher was a spy.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Tom- I've occasionally thought about an update to the book article, but two things discourage it: I don't know how much more I could add, and the interest in rare baseball books is so low that I think maybe there are four people who would read it. As far as updating prices, sadly they may have been higher in 1995. Some stayed the same, a few have decreased, and I can't think of any that have gone up even a little.

And how much have vintage baseball cards increased since 1995? If I said tenfold, I might be conservative.

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Posted By: Jimmy Leiderman

"...but two things discourage it: I don't know how much more I could add, and the interest in rare baseball books is so low that I think maybe there are four people who would read it..."

Barry, If You Build It, They Will Come.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks Jimmy...but no sequel in the works for now.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Barry, I hate to go OT in the mem group but your boy Seinfeld is on 30 Rock tonight.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I know Dan, but the review of the show wasn't that favorable. I'll take a look anyway. Thanks.

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Posted By: Max Weder

The problem with the baseball book market is that it is very thinly traded--much more so than cards. This leads to wild fluctuations in prices even on rare items.

That said, the graphics of the baseball book dead ball era can produce as striking images as on baseball cards.

Here's a dj from a 1912 book, intro by Connie Mack



Babe as an author in 1920



and not to be outdone, Matty from 1925 edition (facsimilie dj)

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Posted By: Matt E.

Just bought this one on Ebay. I have to say it is my first real baseball book purchase that I would consider a collector type piece.

It is in poor condition but I knew I had to have it for some reason. Eagerly awaiting its arrival.

Anyone have or read this book?

Matt

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Posted By: Jason Mishelow

Matt you have a purchased a true classic. Despite the poor condition I think that you will like the item. The photes are great higlighted by a couple full page team shots including Joe Jackson with his minor legal squad. What I find best about this book however is that its is very well written. This is one of the first books to attack the Doubleday myth and give a more accurate reporting of the orgins of baseball

Nice Pick Up