rarest backs

[Bliggity]

How about the T209-2 B.A. Thompson back? I think it fits your criteria, although it's a bit different in that Thompson is the only card in the set with that back, and Thompson can only be found with that back.

Not my card.




ETA: Looks like there are actually four different versions of the Thompson back: (A) no factory number; (B) stamped factory number; (C) printed factory number; (D) black border. Each one may be unique, or close to it. (Courtesy of t209-contentnea.com)

[Al C.risafulli]

I have seen some fake Henry Johnson backs but that green one looks real. I don't think I have seen that variety before. We will have to get Al C's take on it.

I'd consider the purple Henry Johnsons pretty rare, and the green ones REALLY rare. I own a couple and have never seen any others, and Val, yours is AMAZING. I'm confident in their authenticity, and the fact that there's a WaJo out there is incredible to me.

-Al

[ValKehl]

Al & Leon, thanks for your input and kind words. I picked up this green (actually, I like to call it turquoise, which is one of my favorite colors) HAJ WaJo roughly 20 years ago, before TPG became big time and before WaJo cards became as expensive as they are today. I'm confident this card is legit, but I'd hesitate to buy it today if it wasn't already graded.
Val

Originally Posted by Al C.risafulli

I'd consider the purple Henry Johnsons pretty rare, and the green ones REALLY rare. I own a couple and have never seen any others, and Val, yours is AMAZING. I'm confident in their authenticity, and the fact that there's a WaJo out there is incredible to me.

-Al

[MMarvelli]

the early '20's was a good time for cards...



D-Gassler's Bread Hornsby, Rogers (F+B).jpg

D-Haffner's Bread Holke, Walter (F+B).jpg

E-Gertenrich Judge, Joe (F+B cropped).jpg

E-Henry A Johnson Milan, Clyde (F+B).jpg

E-Henry A Johnson Morton, Guy (F+B cropped).jpg

E-Keating Candy Miller, Otto (F+B).jpg

E-Service Candy Co O'Neill, Steve (F+B cropped).jpg

E-Witmor Candy-1 Gleason, Kid (F+B).jpg

Unc-Leader Theatre Groh, Heine (F+B).jpg

[darwinbulldog]

For those who haven't read through from the beginning of the thread, what I have been trying to compile here is a list of exceptionally rare backs on ACC-cataloged issues. There have to be fewer than 50 total examples of the type (so a T215 Pirate, for example, is too common) and the total number, whatever it may be, has to comprise less than 1% of the total population of the set (so an E107 with the "Breisch, Williams" stamp is too common).

Here, then, is the updated list with changes in bold. I continue to seek input on this.

D310 Aldon Candy, Pacific Coast Biscuit Co. stamp
E92 Croft’s (red)
E94 Your Out, Close's Oppie Dildock, Three Strikes, Pennant Winners, A Base Hit!, Your Safe! If..., Your Safe! Have..., Home Run!, Oh You Fan!
E98 Old Put
E101 D355*
E121 Kings, Gertenrich
E135 Merchant's
M101-4 Haserot's, Mall Theater, Everybody's type 1, Everybody's type 2, Everybody's type 3, Everybody's type 4
R316 Douglas Park, Morton, Rialto, Community
S74-1 Helmar
T205 Hindu, Drum
T206 Old Mill (brown), Lenox (brown), Cobb**
T207 Red Cross
T209-2 B.E. Thompson
T213-3 Factory 8 overprint
W461 Playland
W502/F50 Greiner's
W514 Hendler's, Barker, Mother's, Robinson
W515 Fleer, Jersey
W516-1-1 Sandow
W517 Piercy's
W551 Wool's
W554 Lucky Yo-Yo, Lukcy Deal, 40 Winners, Bonemery
W573/E120 Cafe du Monde, Cream Nut, Kings, Leader Theatre
W575-1 Johnson, Henry Johnson green, Henry Johnson and Howard P Bo***, Haffner's, Clark's, Gassler's, Leader Theatre, Queen City, Shotwell, Service Candy, Witmor horizontal, Witmor vertical


*The Niagara Baking back is certainly rare enough to qualify, but Burdick classified it as its own set; so you could say of these cards either that 100% of D355s have the same back ad or that < 1% of E101s are found with the Niagara stamp.
**The T206 Ty Cobb back is included in the list only because Burdick called it a T206. The card would not otherwise be considered a T206, but then again, nothing would, now would it?
*** This:

[Bigb13]

How about the E97 Blank backs?

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

How about the E97 Blank backs?

they're not that rare

[Bigb13]

There's only one Austin that's not rare?

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

There's only one Austin that's not rare?

if one is looking for an e97 blank back for a type...it is not hard to find one. If one is looking for a particular player...that can be a challenge.

There are no e97 blanks banks that are anywhere near unique.

[Bigb13]

The proofs are not rare? With only one showing in PSA?

[ullmandds]

think what u want...you have a history of overvaluing your cards.

they are not proofs and they are not that rare.

[darwinbulldog]

a) I don't know if there are fewer than 50 of them, but
b) I don't think they actually are E97s, and
c) I'm excluding all blank backs from the list anyway.

[Bigb13]

I don't over value my cards in the first place I was asking because I only see one on the PSA population report. Why do you have a hardon for me?

[ullmandds]

check sgc as more people use sgc for vintage than psa

[Bigb13]

Only one there also check for yourself

[ullmandds]

honestly I really dont care...all I know is over the years I have seen a handful of partial sets of e97 b/w's sold as well as many singles. They are tough...no doubt. but there are way more than 1-2 examples of each.

[Bigb13]

Maybe raw but not on the reports. I did not want t get into a pissing match with anyone just wanted to ask the question.

[x2drich2000]

Have to agree with Pete on the E97, difficult but not rare, especially compared to others on the list. In order for it to make this list I would expect to see an example, regardless of player, to come up for sale 2-3 times a year at most (not counting the same card being sold more than once). If I counted correctly there are at least 15 of the e97s on ebay right now and I know a board member has sold a few more earlier this year.

DJ

[Bigb13]

Hi DJ you show me 15 E97 Blank back proofs because I don't see them

[brianp-beme]

I think the E121 Gertenrich cards are borderline for inclusion on this because of a large individual listing of about 30(?) on ebay about 15 years ago, each with some paper loss on the back. I imagine there were enough other examples before this find to possibly exclude it from the list. Possibly Rhett would be a good source for all the E121 backs currently on/not on your list.

Brian

[x2drich2000]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

Hi DJ you show me 15 E97 Blank back proofs because I don't see them

Ask and you shall receive...http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw...proof&_sacat=0

Plus 2 on ebay that recently sold (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from...p2045573.m1684)

Plus 2 more in the recent REA (http://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/...tledescription)

Another listed in h& S (http://www.hugginsandscott.com/cgi-b...l?itemid=95142)

And 2 more in clean sweep (http://www.cleansweepauctions.com/listview.cgi - search for e97s)

So I count over 20 now that are either currently for sale or recently sold in the past couple months and I've barely started looking.

DJ

[Bigb13]

Talking about number 1 Austin, 1 SGC and 1 PSA that's only two cards that's not rare? What is your definition of rare then?

[ullmandds]

i believe there are 3 listed sgc sales on vcp of austin

[Bigb13]

There population report shows one

[x2drich2000]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

Talking about number 1 Austin, 1 SGC and 1 PSA that's only two cards that's not rare? What is your definition of rare then?

The point of this thread is not to find a particular player with a specific back, but rather to list rare backs regardless of who the player is on the front.

and just to get a little more back on topic. Here are my 2 red crofts

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

Thank you.

A T215 Pirate is almost as common as a T215 Red Cross, isn't it? That's why I left them off.

T213-3 overprint might be a good addition, depending on whether the comparison set is T213 altogether or just T213-3, but my inclination would be to use T213-3 since it was issued so much later, as opposed to just being a different style printed in the same year.

It absolutely is NOT !

Just ask anyone on this forum if they have a BB subject with a PIRATE back ?

You may be quite surprised how few responses you get.











TED Z
.

[ullmandds]

there can't be more than 100-120 t215 pirates known...eh ted?

[Sean]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

there can't be more than 100-120 t215 pirates known...eh ted?

And 96 of them are in Richard Masson's collection. Which leaves 15 - 20 for everyone else.

[oldjudge]

Only three 1886 Hancock Clothing backs (or fronts) known, one each of Tomney, Buckley and Crothers.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Sean

And 96 of them are in Richard Masson's collection. Which leaves 15 - 20 for everyone else.

exactly

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Only three 1886 Hancock Clothing backs (or fronts) known, one each of Tomney, Buckley and Crothers.

those are rare alright!

[ValKehl]

Hancock Clothing cards don't meet the OP's criterion of being ACC cataloged.

There are several American Caramel back types for the E121/80 set. I would guess that at least one of them might qualify. Rhett, what say you?
Val

[oldjudge]

Burdick never knew about the Hancock Clothing cards--too rare for even him.