1888 R & S Artistic mini-find

[Runscott]

Found these in an antique store, seemingly glued to white cardboard - they turned out to be hinged and the hinges came right off.

All but two are pretty much mint - as fragile as they are, does it make sense to get them slabbed?

[drc]

I've been surprised at what good prices they can receive when slabbed. I had a few when they were obscure periphery items, but they later got a hike in prices when slabbed and put in the big auctions . . . My guess is they aren't hard to find in high grade though. I don't know how PSA or SGC grades them, but my experience is, unlike Old Judges and Allen & Ginters, they are often found in higher condition

I always thought they were neat items-- even though they are small and the players anonymous. Nice detailed graphics.

[Leon]

Neat find. Not sure if I would grade them or not. Could go either way.

[iggyman]

Just like David, I've seen them do surprisingly well in a few of the major auctions. Both in raw form and graded. I've sold a few graded ones on eBay a few years back and the hammer prices were a little bit disappointing. The ones you have look real nice, I would keep them raw and send them to one of the major auctions (if you were selling them).

I have eight of the ten cards in the set which all came out of a scrapbook. Good luck.

Lovely Day...

[Runscott]

Thanks for the suggestions. Are the other 'R & S Artistic' embossed items worth anything? This place had 10-15 sheets of them, but I bought the only sports ones.

[drc]

They probably have little value in comparison. Non-sport is usually worth a very small fraction of their baseball counterparts.

Though it would be interesting if they are from the same set/issue as the baseball players. If that is the case, then there there would be people who would want to collect the complete set. Lots of set and 'master set' collectors out there.

[Joe Hunter]

These are actually pretty tough in grades 8-9. Not too difficult in 5-7. If you don't believe they will grade higher than 4, I wouldn't bother with grading. They were initially made to be glued in scrapbooks, so many are found with glue stains. You also need to look very closely for minor paper loss on the front. I sent one in for grading that I thought was a sure 7, but came back a 2 due to some tiny paper loss. Because of their very colorful, glossy finishes, they have great eye appeal. From the scans, yours look very nice. Personally, I like this set.

[aquarius31]

I'd caution about trying to get these slabbed. I submitted 2 of these diecuts to SGC a few months back. One of them was in exceptional condition but while SGC was encapsulating it the head came off one of them! They informed me that it had to do with the vibrations while it was being encapsulated. So yeah these things are very fragile and there is some risk with getting them graded. FWIW the other diecut was not damaged during encapsulation.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by aquarius31

I'd caution about trying to get these slabbed. I submitted 2 of these diecuts to SGC a few months back. One of them was in exceptional condition but while SGC was encapsulating it the head came off one of them! They informed me that it had to do with the vibrations while it was being encapsulated. So yeah these things are very fragile and there is some risk with getting them graded. FWIW the other diecut was not damaged during encapsulation.

Thanks for the warning - I would love to hear the recording of their explaining that to you.

[aquarius31]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Thanks for the warning - I would love to hear the recording of their explaining that to you.

Hi Scott, they were actually very apologetic and in all fairness, they sent me back the card (slabbed authentic) and provided me a credit for the insured amount of the diecut. You can see where part of his head came off right under his nose (sorry for the crappy scan). Best of luck whatever you decide to do.

[deebro041]

George, in the photos Scott provided looks like he has 2 Brooklyn's. Maybe you could swing a deal!

[drc]

A great thing about die cuts like this is that they're hard for someone to trim.

For those who have never seen one in person before, they're straight foreword to authenticate as they are embossed and the fronts are very glossy. Plus, I've never heard of anyone making reprints.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by drc

A great thing about die cuts like this is that they're hard for someone to trim.

For those who have never seen one in person before, they're straight foreword to authenticate as they are embossed and the fronts are very glossy. Plus, I've never heard of anyone making reprints.

David, I had never seen these before and they were so new-looking that I thought they were modern. What gave it away was that some of the other die cuts still had the connecting pieces attached.

[drc]

For whatever reason embossed scraps from back then tend to be glossy. Something to do with manufacture. Perhaps they added a varnish so the shape was kept. Flat scraps and trade cards tend to matte.

I've never seen forgers attempt to duplicate embossment. Too much work and detail. They either leave out the embossment or forge cards that aren't embossed.

And the R & S are the double whammy of embossed and die cut. So much easier to forge those flat rectangular 1952 Topps Mantles.

[danmckee]

hinged? did u soak them? roll creases? come on, spill ur poison

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by danmckee

hinged? did u soak them? roll creases? come on, spill ur poison

Dan, I figured out quickly they were just pieces of white paper-tape, forming a hinge. On the first one, I cut the cardboard away from it, then gently scraped off the part of the 'hinge' remaining on the die-cut.

For the second one, I left it attached to the cardboard, but gently pushed the die cut upward until the hinge 'rolled' off. It worked perfectly, so I did that for the rest of them.

I have found that these 'hinges', if left attached to paper for a long period of time, end up forming a bond that removes part of the paper on the host object, or leaves a sticky mess. Luckily, these had not formed a strong attachment to the die-cuts.

[smallstocks]

I found one of these in a collection I bought a few years back. Just wondering if these were ever reprinted and if mine might not be an original.

[drcy]

I am unaware of them being reprinted. They should have glossy fronts and be slightly embossed.