Fishy Super Bowl?...

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Posted By: joe brennan

Let me start off saying I am not a fan of either team. Bills fan, but thats another story.
1) The line before either team was set was the AFC Champion -10..Vegas line.
2) Every time Seattle had a big play, holding penalty.
3) 3rd quarter score 14-10. Seattle down to the Pittsburgh 1 yard line. But wait..phantom holding penalty, barely touched on by Madden. Very next play..Alexander sweep..Obvious horse collar on the play..No call and no comment from the booth. Next play interception...game over...Spread 11 points..Boy vegas is smart..

Not saying anything about fix or rigged but man that's pretty fishy on the national stage.

Big money on this game.....Outcome was right on script and I'm not complaining as I went with the city that is not wrong too often. Las Vegas baby!!!

A scared man can't gamble and a jealous man can't work.


no worries Joe....just don't care to see my name in lights so much (leon)

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Posted By: Henry Eshelman

Saw that porter tackle and liked it. Didnt think horse collars were illegal. Are they? cause i dont remember a penalty being called when TO broke his leg.

Thanks, Henry Eshelman

Website:www.freewebs.com/vintagebaseball

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Posted By: Anonymous

I was thinking the same thing, very badly officiated. The TO broken leg is what caused the horse collar to become a rule. I'm not exactly sure of the rule though. I don't know if you're allowed to grab the jersey or the shoulder pads but I think one you are allowed to grab and the other you aren't.

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Posted By: joe brennan

The rule was changed because of the tackle on TO...You would think with 8 of the best officials calling the game, one would be looking at the guy with the ball!!!!!!!! LOL

A scared man can't gamble and a jealous man can't work.

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Posted By: Cobby33

If I believed in "fixed games," this would be one of them. My 'Hawks were consistently screwed. Oh well...There's always next year!

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Posted By: Joe_G.

It was the tackle Roy Williams made on TO that prompted the League to make horse collar tackles illegal. In the game tonight, it wasn't clear whether it was a horse collar tackle or more just grabbing the jersey (which is legal). I will agree however, that Seattle couldn't catch a break.

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Posted By: joe brennan

Clearly on the replay it was a horse collar cause I looked for it because I thought I saw it the first time. Funny how the replay was never showed again. I'm not suggesting fix, cause that's impossible, just funny how Vegas seems to be right most of the time, no matter what it takes.

A scared man can't gamble and a jealous man can't work.


edited to add not in the sentence "I'm not suggesting fix"..Sorry about the typo

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Posted By: Glen V

If there was a fix, Seattle was in on it - they were dropping balls left and right.

.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

I had no dog in this hunt but thought Seattle was the better team. I'm not a big conspiracy theorist; I just think Pittsburgh (or should I say Pittsburg no "h"--this being the vintage baseball card board) caught a lot of breaks. Goes to show that if you have to win a single game (as opposed to four out of seven in the case in our beloved baseball) you have to be so dominant that you can put more points on the board despite bad bounces and poor officiating. Teams that can win DESPITE bad luck and bad calls are the true champions.

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Posted By: Anonymous

My opinion:

Bull.

Steeler fan and Pittsburgh native who, believe it not, still lives in Pittsburgh.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

Who won the MVP anyway? I didn't see any stellar performance on either side of the ball.

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Posted By: Zach Smith

Hines Ward won it... and a 2007 Escalade... like he needs it.

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Posted By: Rhys

Seattle outplayed Pitt in every way possible and to lose a game like that is tough. Say what you want either way, but when the outcome of a game like this is decided by the men officiating it more than they guys playing in it, then something is seriously wrong! Not only that, but that had to be the MOST UNWATCHABLE Super Bowl ever. The Stones look older than the Mummy of Ramses I, and I spent more time watching commercials than Football.

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Posted By: Cobby33

Being a die-hard Seattle fan (living in the SF Bay Area and only being in Seattle twice), Seattle lost that game. By the same token, Pittsburgh didn't win it and as I said earlier, "we" got screwed by the officals.
I know, "waaaaaaaah," but no game (especially a SB) is without controversy. Makes you think that the refs want to be a part of the outcome. Who knows. There's always next year.

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Posted By: jay behrens

You can complain all you want about the refs keeping the Seahawks out of the endzone, but the Seahawks didn't do their part in keeping the Steelers out of the endzone. I didn't see the refs making blocks for Pitt so they couls score and don't recall any pass interference penalties that set up the ball near the endzone for Pitt. Seattle's kicker also didn't help their cause by missing a few FGs.

I could have cared less who won the game, I was mainly watching the coomercials and playing QB1 on NTN. This is a game where you guessed what the play was going to be and competed against other people around the coutnry. I ended up 33rd in the country. Not sure if I won anything, but they showed the top 50 scores and you usually are a prize winner if you see your name on the leader board.

The commercials were deffinately not up to par. The only ones that really stuck out were the Ameriprise "Don't Judge too Quickly" ads and the streaking sheep. The Dove ad was a nice change of pace. Not often you see an ad with a truely relevent social message during this event.

Jay

I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Hal Lewis

The offensive pass interference call on my former Gator Darrell Jackson was BULLCRAP.

Seattle needed that TD... and the call was terrible.

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Posted By: whycough

An old friend of mine used to say about the refs in games like this, "They bet the game." Some overseas bank account got fat last night--not to be touched for years.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Face it. Even if Jackson wasn't called for pass interference, in which he pushed off, the final score would have only been four points closer. Add two missed field goals and the Seahawks would have still come up a point short. Seattle's problem was in not scoring a touchdown off a long drive. Their only touchdown came of a spectacular 70+ yard interception (Super Bowl record in length) followed by a 20+ yard drive.

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Posted By: John Spencer

I thought the best team on the field were the Rolling Stones at halftime.

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Posted By: Jim Feagin

The "holding call" on the Seahawks when Stevens caught the ball at the 2 was one of the worst calls I have seen in the postseason. Only a true Pittsburgh homer could say that Jackson "pushed off". In reality, it was more like he "pinkied off". Seattle had 11 points taken off the board. However, Seattle's clock management was also atrocious. Those missed FG's were hardly easy, and can anyone say "two minute drill"?

Jim

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Posted By: Hal Lewis

I would be big money that the Steeler who was "held" on that play was OFFSIDES... but the refs ignored it.

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Posted By: Rhys

Jay
Actually Seattle did do their part to keep Pitt out of the endzone. The other blown call was the third and goal in which Seattle DID stone Big Ben and keep him out of the endzone.

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Posted By: PC

I agree that the officiating was poor last night, but that was not the determining factor in the game. (On that front, IMO, the interference call in the end zone was legit ... it may not have been a real "push" but giving the defender a stiff-arm will still bring the flag.)

Seattle lost because their receivers dropped too many catchable balls. Hasselbeck was literally hitting Seahawk receivers in the face and they couldn't hold on to the ball. The missed field goals didn't help either.

On the Pittsburgh side, the best pass of the night by Pittsburgh was from Randle El. Roethlisberger was (under-)throwing it up for grabs, but the Steeler receivers were making plays.

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Posted By: Tim Newcomb

--My hopes died with Carolina's--

but I was amazed at how one-sided the officiating seemed. I'm glad others saw it too. I'm no conspiracy theorist either-- it just seemed like the refs were itching to call anything they could against Seattle, and they did it at all the worst times.

Sure, one (ridiculous) flag was picked up in the first half, and the Hasselbeck "fumble" was reversed in the booth, but the initial calls on the field were ALL going Pitt's way. The two most damaging--Jackson's "pushoff" and the 2nd half holding call--were both awful. And what was that Personal Foul call against Hasselbeck when he made the tackle?? Meanwhile, the flagrant horse collar of Alexander goes unnoticed??

However, I can't bleed too much for Seattle because they were unbelievably bad late in each half-- (was Hasselbeck audibling ineptly or were those really Mike Holmgren's playcalls??). Playing that badly at crunch time, they didn't deserve to win. I just wish they had been given a fair chance by the refs.

Congrats to all the Steeler rooters-- that's a really great franchise!

Tim

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Posted By: Chris Mc

Let me chime in and say that I am not a fan of either team. I watched the game and clearly Seattle outplayed the Steelers. There are games that the outplayed team does win and this was the case last night.
It was not a well officiated game. The touchdown that was called a push off was not only a bad call, (and you can say that it would not have made a difference in the outcome) but when you take away momentum it can most directly have an outcome on the final score. The replay on Bens' touchdown was horse hockey, he got stuffed! There were some great plays and a few new records that should not go unmentioned but let me finish by saying I don't watch boxing anymore and if I see any more games like this I will be down to just watching baseball.

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Posted By: Joe Jones

It reminded me of the officiating in the UofM bowl game this year. But that is part of the game I guess. Its kind of like card grading. The refs are human and make mistakes.

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Posted By: tbob

with no dog in the hunt but Roethlisberger STILL hasn't scored on that fourth down play!!!! That was huge, no one has even mentioned it. Unfortunately the referee who reviewed the call is the Judge Alioto of refs.

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Posted By: Jason

Quit chirping about how Seattle stopped Ben. He CLEARLY broke the plain of the goal line. There should not have been any confusion. As for as the game goes....both teams played bad. Seattle lost it for themselves and the Steelers played under par. Goes to show you how good the Steelers really are even when they play a bad game.

Jason

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Posted By: warshawlaw

Slow, dull, badly played. Madden & Michaels should have just said "these guys suck" and left it at that. Great argument against structuring a league to create parity. When you root for a commercial break and take a leak during the game, you know it sucks. The best parts were the Fed Ex and Ameriquest ads.

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Posted By: Jeff

I think about 25% of people outside of Pittsburgh and Seattle think that was a TD.

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Posted By: jay behrens

In order to overturn a call on the field there has to be conclusive evidence. Because of the blurry picture, there wasn't convincing proof either way, so the call stood. Looked to me like the right call was made. The ball just has to break the plane of the front of the line, not the back and it certainly appeared to meet that criteria.

Jay

I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Cat

When the Stevens reception down at the 2 yard line was called back, it just looked like something wasn't right. It's one thing to blow a call or miss a call, but when you call something that you do not see, because it does not exist, it makes one wonder. Madden says after reviewing slow motion following that play: "I didn't see any holding there." Then when that referee jumped in the pile of players on the ground with a few minutes left...that's the product McMahan had in mind when he started the XFL, but he could just never get there.



Edited to correct typos unless otherwise noted.

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Posted By: Todd Schultz

I disagree completely that the ball broke the plane. The replay angle was very good but not perfect, and even from that I believe it showed it short. The way I saw it, the tip of the ball looked to be hovering right about directly above the line (maybe and at most), but the angle was skewed just enough that when the ball came down and touched short, you could tell it had basically dropped straight down and had never crossed.

The thing that irked me the most was the linejudge who called it. He ran in about eight or nine steps, and you could tell he was going to mark it. Then boom, he signals TD. That was not a second effort play or one where he needed to get closer to see the ball. He had a clear shot from standing by the pylon, and Ben was down before he started running in. Why not signal TD immediately if that's what you saw. Again, I swear he was ready to have that ball spotted and then changed his mind. One of many horrible calls in that game, IMO.

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Posted By: Zach Smith

At least Seattle made it to their first Super Bowl. I'm from LA and have to back the Saints... still waiting on that miracle. They don't even have their own stadium anymore! (Thanks alot Katrina...)

Who Dat?!

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Posted By: ChuckkieB

First and foremost, I am not a fan of either team (J-E-T-S all the way),so I have no axe to grind either way. That being said, all this talk that the Seahawks somehow "outplayed" the Steelers is crazy. Seattle dropped at least a half dozen passes, misssed two field goals, gave up a 75 yard TD run, a 40+ TD pass off of a trick play, and last but not least, they turned the ball over at the most crucial point of the game. These are not exactly highlights of a well played game in my opinion. The Steelers had a few big plays and did what they had to do to gut out a very ugly, but deserved win.

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Posted By: DJ

Seattle certainly outplayed Pittsburgh on all levels. You take away that trick play (-7), the Hawks' actually tackled Parker (-7) and if Seattle had made two field goals (+6), it's a different ball game that doesn't include the fact that Seahawks should have scored on that Darrell Jackson play (+7) and the wide receivers were horrible. Jerramy Stevens alone dropped a few easy passes in the red zone. Seattle simply had a wretched game that was made worse by the refs who luckily missed that Stevens fumble.

Pittsburgh had one of the worst first quarters I have ever seen and Big Ben had the lowest QB rating in history. I don't follow either team and looked simply too be entertained by a good game which I was not. At least the Fed-Ex commercial entertained me for thirty second. Nothing funnier than kicking a dinosaur.

IMO...

DJ

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Posted By: Jason

re: Jeff's post.


That would conclude then about 75% of the people living outside those 2 cities must be blind.


Luckily I fall into that 25% range.

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Posted By: David Vargha

Nothing funnier than kicking a dinosaur.

Except being crushed by one.

The refereeing was HORRIBLE. I'm almost always of the opinion that the refs don't have much bearing on the game. However, this game was a disgrace for the zebras.

DavidVargha@hotmail.com

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Posted By: Anonymous

Well, what the heck. I am running scans of cards for auctions and I read where Jackson "pinkied" off the Steelers defensive back. I have to admit that's the first time I've ever seen a receiver use five pinkies on the same play.

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Posted By: Pennsylvania Ted

Obviously, I am biased....but 50% of winning a single
championship game is LUCK. However, you have to admit,
the Reverse Pass play by Pittsburg which resulted in a
Touchdown was "cool". This play made the difference be-
teen the Steelers and the Seahawks.

Yes, I will admit that early call that favored Pitt was very
questionable; but, look guys the final score was 21 - 10.
So, had that Pitt's 7 pt score been taken back, Pitt still
would have won.

And....Bob M....keep your "politics" off this Forum.

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Posted By: Chris

What a bunch of whiners. If Ben wouldn't have thrown that pick(which I believe was caused by the ref), this would have been a blowout. Seattle played better? Obviously not, otherwise they would have stopped the 75 yard run and an option TD pass(did I mention Wards big 3rd down catch too). Sometimes all it takes is one play to win a game, and Seattle couldn't stop multiple big plays. The Steelers beat the 4 best teams in football. Don't hate, congratulate!

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Games over...

That was a pretty good game over all. Good plays on both sides of the ball. The score's in the book regardless of how bad people feel the officiating was.

Games over... wait til next year....

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Posted By: tbob

Jason- Ben Roethlesberger was on tv Monday night and admitted he never scored on that play.
Hey Ted- Who died and made you moderator? Manners please and don't bark at me...

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Posted By: joe brennan

What a bunch of whiners. If Ben wouldn't have thrown that pick(which I believe was caused by the ref), this would have been a blowout. Seattle played better? Obviously not, otherwise they would have stopped the 75 yard run and an option TD pass(did I mention Wards big 3rd down catch too). Sometimes all it takes is one play to win a game, and Seattle couldn't stop multiple big plays. The Steelers beat the 4 best teams in football. Don't hate, congratulate!


You must have watched a different game. Pittsburgh lost in every offensive category, the turn over category and Big Ben had a QB rating of 20. Man what an impressive preformance from the best team in the NFL. The officals took the momentum from Seattle, so hats off to the best team in the NFL, The Zebras.

A scared man can't gamble and a jealous man can't work.

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Posted By: Anson

That game could very easily have been Seahawks 17 Steelers 14. No pass interference call on Jackson and the Roethlisberger play called down and you would be there. Statistically, the Seahawks did outplay the Steelers in almost every offensive category. Does that always win games? No

In baseball, you occasionally see a team amass 15 hits to the opposition's 4 and still lose the game. That's the way it goes. But, I don't like it when officials decide games, especially big ones.

Steeler fans will defend the win to the grave, Seahawk fans will keep chanting "fix", but I think the game was a letdown to all football fans. I don't believe the two best teams were in the Superbowl.

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Posted By: jay behrens

I hate football and have no rooting interest in either team, but the refs were not the ones that decided this game. Seattle could stop the big play or create one themselves. Seattle looked good the first quarter and then seemed to go away from that game plan that worked so well early. The big plays by Pitt are what killed Seattle, not the refs. Missing the 2 FGs sure didn't help Seattle either. Their plenty of blame to go around on the Seattle team without going to the refs.

Jay

I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Joe Jones

good points!

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Posted By: Todd Schultz

Pittsburgh: 75 yard run
Seattle: 75 yard interception return

Pittsburgh: Long touchdown pass
Seattle: Medium touchdown pass---OOPS, guess not--lame penalty on Seattle

Pittsburgh: long pass to 2 yard line
Seattle: long pass to 2 yard line---OOPS, guess not--lamer penalty on Seattle

Pittsburgh: QB run for TD---OOPS, never got in.

What else ya got on how Pittsburgh deserves to win because of big plays and Seattle doesn't because it made no such plays?

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Posted By: Eric Eichelkraut

I'm a life long Steelers fan born and raised outside Chicago..and I was very pleased that Pitt won their 5th Superbowl. Concerning the game, I was less than pleased with the Steelers play. I watch about 75% of the Steelers regular season games, and every minute of their playoff run. My wife and I actually attended our first Steelers game down in Indy during the second week of the playoffs..a game where I had about 4 heart attacks! ; ) Like all other sports, football will always have highly controversial calls and games. When our teams are affected, it's easy to blame the refs, or spout off that "the fix is in". I've never done either, but then again, I'm a life long athlete who understands that my teammates and I ALONE determine whether we win or lose.

At the Pitt/Indy playoff game that we attended, I think most remember some of the terrible calls the officials made. The overturned Polamalu interception late in the game was the worst call I've ever seen a ref make, especially since it was reviewed. It turned the tide of the game, but the best team won. This wasn't the first time a call has really hurt, and it won't be the last. The list goes on and on for bad calls, and every team has an equal footing on the history of bad calls that have hurt them. But to make excuses that bad calls determined the outcome of a game is rediculous. No one who plays sports believes that crap, a team always decides it's outcome. Seattle may have gotten the short end of the stick on a call or two, but they also got away with a good 3-4 holding penalties that extended scoring drives. I do agree that the offensive interference call that pulled back the Seattle touchdown early in the game was wrong. On the same token, I think the ref had a great look at the ball in Ben's hands durin the rushing TD. Did he get in?..I don't know for sure, and I'm not sure the ref saw it inconclusively either, but the play was a "within in inch or two" call, and a tough call to make. Even if Ben didn't get in that play, it's still the Steelers ball..and I believe they probably go for 7 since the ball is placed on the 1 to 2 inch mark.

I keep reading here that the Seahawks outplayed the Steelers in every facet of the game. I'll go on the recond right now as saying that this was the worst played game the Steelers had all season long. The Seahawks had something to do with that, and simple execution had alot to do with that. I've seen Ben in nearly every Pitt game he's played, and he looked nervous as hell on the field, all game long. I think Seattle did a great job of exploiting the short pass game against the Steelers secondary. Hasselback easily outplayed Ben. And the Seattle offense was more consistent throughout the game. But big plays win big games, and between Willy's 75 yd run and the trick play TD to Hines..no, I'm sorry, Seattle did not outplay the Steelers. Unless you want to lie to yourself and believe that those two plays didn't happen. A few people above have put it well, the scoreboard dictates who's winning, not the stat sheet. A defense can give up tons of yardage, but not let the other team score. On the same token, an offense might only have 3-4 great possessions a game, and score 21 points. Pitt's D is infamous for letting an opponent march down field freely, only to snuff them out when they get in or near the red zone. Pitt's D did this routinely Sunday night. Their explosive offensive plays also clearly showed major flaws in the Seattle D.

I give Seattle a lot of credit, they played the Steelers to the hilt. Despite the 11 point win, it felt like a narrow victory to me. I'm not going to sit here and gloat about the Steelers, I don't do that. I would further hope that other fans don't gloat either, or say that the only reason the Steelers won was because the refs made it that way. Cheers,

E.

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Posted By: Cy

Here is what I saw.

Did Roethlisberger get in? Not on the ground. But he sure looked like he could have broken the plane in the air. It was close enough that there shouldn't be a discussion on this play. It could have gone either either way. The problem was the ref was indecisive, not that he didn't score.

Have push-offs like the play in the end-zone been called routinely? Absolutely. They aren't called every time. But they are called quite enough times that it is lame to say it was that bad a call. The receiver clearly extended his arm. The ref reached for his flag immediately.

Did the offensive tackle hold? Nope. Not at all.

Did Hasselback commit a penalty on the tackle? Nope. But if you remember, Hines Ward got past the defender on the next series. All he had to do was run an extra 15 yeards.

So basically the Seahawks got hosed on two plays. Did anyone remember the fumble that the refs called an incomplete pass? Did anyone think he (was it Stevens?) didn't have possession and it should have been the Steelers ball. That could have been a big play too, in the Steelers favor.

My point is the first two calls could have gone either way and do, game in and game out. So the Seahawks got one more bad call than the Steelers. Is that enough to strip the Steelers of the title?

My thoughts.

Cy