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  #1  
Old 05-29-2013, 10:54 PM
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N.ate A.dams
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Default Hunt Auction Pickups

I didn't win this, ... but --- $6,500+ after BP??? Really?

I know it's upside down, and on the front, but, when I returned home and went to see what it sold for, I had to bat my eyes a few times to make sure I read the number correctly.

http://www.huntauctions.com/phone/im...11&lot_num=437

Anyone pick something up they needed? I tend to despise Hunt Auctions for multiple reasons:

1. Organization
2. Awful scans
3. Poorly described/inaccurate conditions
4. Many times they do not provide back scans -- which is important for people collecting various backs...especially for T206s


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  #2  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:09 PM
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Nate

I agree 100%. They could do a better job for their consignors.

When they had the Drum find it took 3 emails and a phone call to get back scans.

They get some really good consignments though.

The brown Lenox Lajoie
The Drums
The Red Suns in 2010
The consignment that had all the packs of cigarettes along with the cards.
The Cracker Jacks being talked about in a current thread and so on.

I am sure they are aware but it appears they are happy the way things are turning out. Not sure if anyone from Hunt reads the forum.

The t206 errors have come into their own over the past year or so. REA and Hunt are proof of that.

I am sure Johnny's collection has more than doubled in value in the past 6 months...
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  #3  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:10 PM
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Default I'd rather be brainless

No one with a Brain would spend this much for one crummy card.

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  #4  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by cfc1909 View Post
Nate

I am sure Johnny's collection has more than doubled in value in the past 6 months...

Ain't that the truth!

Johnny: time to sell?

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  #5  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:19 PM
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I don't understand that end price. It doesn't compute.
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  #6  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:42 PM
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I was the underbidder and it was a deal at the final price. It has quite the secret.
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  #7  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:44 PM
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I think the price had more to do with the back. Someone got a really great card, congrats!


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  #8  
Old 05-29-2013, 11:46 PM
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I guess I just outed the secret.
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  #9  
Old 05-30-2013, 12:45 AM
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Default well.....

If I had 10 k to dump, it would've been on that card, card sold for an absolute bargain imho!!! winner is extremely lucky....


ship immediately to sgc....(the one tpg that deserves to slab this card, no offense other graders, they are the ones to deserve to slab, as overprint piedmont front/multi strike piedy back....i'm sure will get similar designation...card is a big card and winner is extremely lucky....I am sorry Chris......my heart sank for you....

these types of scrap are like finding a diamond in sand.....the hunt is half the fun, but the disappointment can be painful at times...


whoed have thunk it??? 100 + year old chase cards....HA HA! I love these cards ...


put that card in Goodwin and i'm sure it would hit 10+ k easy...easy...right now




.......Nate, thanks man!!! my cards are worth more than cash to me right now, but a wagner may persuade me....you have become a true force in dealing T206...(.I love the flag btw)






Brian and the haters....you will see, these are like small pieces of art, true alternative T206,


one man's trash is another man's treasure, one man gathers what another man spills.......

THESE CARDS have only started , and will not stop...so might as well accept and move on....and, send me your email, I will take any off your hands

Jim...

your insight on this set and the market , is truly ahead of our time, and your understanding of these rarities is beyond many collectors scope


Congrats to the winner of the Brain card....may I have on weekends

and all other winners....
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  #10  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:07 AM
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Wowsers! I saw that there was a WST on the front... But never would have guessed that was on the back. Honestly how can the AH not mention that in the listing or show back scans. At least the ghost that I picked up in a lot a while back was listed as a 'print anomaly.'
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  #11  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:19 AM
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Crappy Scan and Crappy Description......
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  #12  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:51 AM
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Default I consigned to hunt in the past

And I never would again. For some of the above mentioned reasons. I personally believe they cater to their buyer friends more than their consignors. At least that was my experience. Not mentioning a back like that in this market is truly pathetic.
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  #13  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:41 AM
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COOL card.

I guess I have to start analyzing Hunt's crappy website, instead of their equally crappy Auction Catalogs.
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  #14  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by glynparson View Post
And I never would again. For some of the above mentioned reasons. I personally believe they cater to their buyer friends more than their consignors. At least that was my experience. Not mentioning a back like that in this market is truly pathetic.
I have never consigned a card, but after reading the description and not seeing an image of that back, I would be furious if I had consigned this card. How does a card like that sneak through? I feel sorry for the card's previous owner, who just lost out on a healthy chunk of change.
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  #15  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:06 AM
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I don't understand that end price. It doesn't compute.
Agreed. A lot of people state these nutty scrap prices are bargains, but apparently only a few people are willing to pay for them. Who are these people?
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  #16  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:19 AM
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My take is that the consigner didn't know the significance of the card and probably never will.
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  #17  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:20 AM
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Agreed. A lot of people state these nutty scrap prices are bargains, but apparently only a few people are willing to pay for them. Who are these people?

In the last few years I've seen a few enthusiastic collectors not only buying these, but constantly hyping them in this forum. Most of the time, when one of these goes for an astronomical price, it ends up in the pick-up thread, or underbid with the usual suspects discussing what a deal it was (Hi Chris!)

In my opinion, these guys are a good percentage of the people willing to pay the price they are going for these days, and if those guys stopped buying, the price goes back to where it was a few years ago... 1500-2000

I'm sure this how the price of anything in the hobby rises, the difference being the amount of transparency in this case.
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  #18  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:23 AM
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My take is that the consigner didn't know the significance of the card and probably never will.
Steve- when he gets his consignor check he'll realize it.
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  #19  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:34 AM
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Steve- when he gets his consignor check he'll realize it.
Good point Michael.
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  #20  
Old 05-30-2013, 10:41 AM
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The reason this is a deal to me, not necessarily for investment or future resale, but simply just to own it.

One that goes into the permanent collection.

It's scrap from the start of printing that back. It has 3-5 regular overprints and one upside down 4 corner back. Plus the kicker, for me, an upside down four corner OP on the front. A true gem.

It's a "financial" deal considering the recent sales of similar type scraps....but not a bargain considering how it was listed.

$7500 was the next bid with BP and that was over my limit. This one hurt more then any other I've missed.
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  #21  
Old 05-30-2013, 11:19 AM
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I ditto what MAtt said!!!!
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  #22  
Old 05-30-2013, 11:49 AM
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Default America baby !!

The freedom to express ones opinion. God Bless America !!

So did anyone here win anything else ??
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  #23  
Old 05-30-2013, 12:10 PM
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How does hyping cards as a "deal" we are the underbidder on help us? We are our own enemies by bidding against each other and continually raising these prices.

There are less and less of these out there and feeding our collecting need is getting tougher...so you save up, sell some other hot items and try your best.

We simply love these like everyone else who is a collector and some of us are passionate about sharing why we pick these up....a bit defensive maybe, part of the passion I think...I don't see a hidden agenda from the few of us on here to pump and dump our favorite items.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:19 PM
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In this day and age...with price guides being outdated and archaic...the way prices of cards in general increase is by them getting bid up...and for this to happen there must be 2 bidders! The dynamic of pricing is sooooo different today than it was back in the day.

IT's harder than ever to really place a fixed price on a card.
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by ullmandds View Post
In this day and age...with price guides being outdated and archaic...the way prices of cards in general increase is by them getting bid up...and for this to happen there must be 2 bidders! The dynamic of pricing is sooooo different today than it was back in the day.

IT's harder than ever to really place a fixed price on a card.
Agreed. I like it better this way because you have to determine in your own mind what something is worth. You can use comparisons from auction sales, etc. but really it's left to what it's worth to you. I love it. You either want it for that price or you don't. To me it's somewhat freeing. And people can stop looking to a book for their answers.

To show how much it has changed, we were at a card show a couple weeks ago and Patrick had some cards that he had gotten long ago that were still in the old toploaders. the sticker had 2 prices and was divided in half. It was printed "Book Price" and under that "Our Price". How the times have changed.
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  #26  
Old 05-30-2013, 12:49 PM
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Default Well said

Well said, Chris. Supply and demand. Basic rules of business.
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  #27  
Old 05-30-2013, 01:07 PM
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My take is that the consigner didn't know the significance of the card and probably never will.
I think you are correct on this one Steve.

The consignor most likely did not realize what they had because I am sure they looked at the lot once it was up for bidding. They are probably extremely happy with the price not realizing todays error market.

Still enough collectors saw this lot or the hammer would not have been 6k. Still could have brought more with large front and back scans.
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  #28  
Old 05-30-2013, 01:17 PM
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Still could have brought more with large front and back scans.
Really, better scans and you would have bid more?

Still hearing how the price realized was right (or low), but I only know one board member who pays these prices for scraps, and he doesn't always do it. While I'm certain that hyping these as good deals is not part of any hidden agenda, I do believe that whoever the 2-3 people are who actually are putting their money behind such claims, are unintentionally getting others on the board to begin 'believing' that these are the new market prices. Apparently they are only the new market prices for a few people. Thousands for this stuff? C'mon.
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  #29  
Old 05-30-2013, 01:25 PM
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Default Agree

I would agree with Jim. The mainline collectors going after set, sure these are not in your wheelhouse. To Johnny's point, a lot of T206 collectors want to broaden their collecting to the scrap and oddball items and of course the rare backs. With a proper back scan and a proper front scan, the card could easily of sold for much more. 2 anomalies on one card, seen together rarely ( I say that because I don't know if their have been more but don't want to be pointed out as a bs'er). Brain is also a fairly popular single as well. Very cool card !!
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Old 05-30-2013, 01:34 PM
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I would agree with Jim. The mainline collectors going after set, sure these are not in your wheelhouse. To Johnny's point, a lot of T206 collectors want to broaden their collecting to the scrap and oddball items and of course the rare backs. With a proper back scan and a proper front scan, the card could easily of sold for much more. 2 anomalies on one card, seen together rarely ( I say that because I don't know if their have been more but don't want to be pointed out as a bs'er). Brain is also a fairly popular single as well. Very cool card !!
So YOU are the board member bidding in the thousands for these?

Other than Chris and the person I alluded to earlier, I'm still not seeing the demand reflected by these prices. My guess is that if these two bidders alone lost interest, the market for such items could begin looking quite different. Others here are marveling at the prices and agreeing with them, but not bidding. Would love to hear from others in this pool of bidders that has established the 'new market value'.
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  #31  
Old 05-30-2013, 01:48 PM
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When I first saw the card, the fact that it was upside down made me wonder what was on the back, and if there were multiple strikes like I've seen on others. I simply assumed that no auction house would fail to mention something like that, and remembered recently that they at least wrote "Printing anomaly" for a ghost image, which was referenced by Erick. There is literally no excuse other than complete ineptitude for not mentioning this. If you become interested in T206s, even if you're are just being introduced to the hobby, you know within about 3 weeks that T206s with errors such as that are worth thousands of dollars. So, I surmise that a back scan was provided once asked for, or buyers close to the area personally viewed the cards.

Great for the buyer, and a sizeable difference of potential income for the consignor. I wouldn't consign a single thing to Hunt Auctions, even if I got the BP as well.


On another note, WHAT A CARD!

Last edited by npa589; 05-30-2013 at 01:50 PM.
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  #32  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:07 PM
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Great for the buyer, and a sizeable difference of potential income for the consignor. I wouldn't consign a single thing to Hunt Auctions, even if I got the BP as well.
I have never discussed consignments with Hunt, but the fact that they don't give lots the best exposure is no secret. So I doubt that any consignor is surprised by what they get. My guess is that the benefit of consigning with Hunt is that you send them a pile of stuff and they put it up in a single lot, and you are rid of it - not all auction houses will do this. I've seen some very 'messy' lots in Hunt (and won some of them) - they almost end up being surprise 'grab-bag' lots in some cases.
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  #33  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:07 PM
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This is an interesting card, no doubt. But my rule of thumb on these printing "errors" is that if it happened in another set -- say 1930s Goudey or 1950s Topps -- would anyone care?

If the answer is "no", then why does the fact that it happened in T206 matter?

I'll just keep shaking my head as people pursue these, and "nodgrass" and "Murr'y" with more vigor than a true factory error like Magie.

Obviously, collect what interests you, but I just don't understand how the interest here rises beyond a nominal premium.
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  #34  
Old 05-30-2013, 04:33 PM
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Default Stand by my remarks

Small supply with some high dollar demand. I don't get why someone buys a Tesla or a 7 series BMW instead of a Camry or an Accord...same principle I guess in the long run. It's all about what you like. Brown Lenox, Brown Old Mill, Overstrike back... Makes sense to me.
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Old 05-30-2013, 04:34 PM
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I will gladly pay $2,500+ for ANY signed T206 card that is not already in my collection
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collect what interests you, but I just don't understand how the interest here rises beyond a nominal premium.
Me neither
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  #36  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:16 PM
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Me neither
Bring about $10,000 to the National and I'll give you a great deal on two T206 error cards.
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  #37  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:20 PM
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Really, better scans and you would have bid more?

Still hearing how the price realized was right (or low), but I only know one board member who pays these prices for scraps, and he doesn't always do it. While I'm certain that hyping these as good deals is not part of any hidden agenda, I do believe that whoever the 2-3 people are who actually are putting their money behind such claims, are unintentionally getting others on the board to begin 'believing' that these are the new market prices. Apparently they are only the new market prices for a few people. Thousands for this stuff? C'mon.
This sold at Goodwin for 7600.

http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...entoryid=22901

I think the one sold at Hunts is much nicer and should have a higher premium attached.

No offense Wonka.
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  #38  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:26 PM
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"Obviously, collect what interests you, but I just don't understand how the interest here rises beyond a nominal premium."

I feel the same way. Beyond bragging rights on Net 54, I see no intrinsic value to these anomalies, and doubt (but what do I know) they will retain their extreme valuations over time.
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  #39  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:33 PM
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This sold at Goodwin for 7600.

http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...entoryid=22901

I think the one sold at Hunts is much nicer and should have a higher premium attached.

No offense Wonka.
But do two people feel that way? Is the winner from the Goodwin auction still in the market for these or do they have their type? Is the underbidder still interested? It is easy for all of us to talk about the worth of these or Baltimore Ruths or Picassos, but how many out there are really going to bid that card above $7600?
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  #40  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:46 PM
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Me neither
lolol
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  #41  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:47 PM
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To me, it seems T-206 white borders are the most collected of pre-war cards. If the Wagner, Plank, Doyle, & Magie are out of your range, the one-of-a-kind "rarities" are the next best thing. They're not for me, but I can understand the wild prices & I'm not surprised by them.
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  #42  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:48 PM
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I think there are more people after these freaks than just a handful. Look at all of the T206 collectors who are going after back runs for specific players. For all we know, they want to add a freak to their back run also. There are a lot of T206 collectors who a lot of dough burning through their pockets, as we can see from sales of rare back commons.

Some of the freaks in T206 like the one that just sold in Hunt, I've never seen outside of low quality 1920s strip cards and the T206 set. Has anyone ever seen a 1933 Goudey like this with multiple stamps like that? I think that's one of the things that makes the price go up. There are a small, but decent supply of these so multiple collectors think that it's possible for them to own one. If there were just one known, people would probably just write it off. However, because there is a small supply, it's possible to put this on your checklist.

Frankly, I think that these are pretty cool looking also. I'd like to own one also, but probably wouldn't pay more than 1-2K for one. I'm sure there are other collectors like me, but that sets a floor for the prices for these cards, where the really enthusiastic collectors can drive them to sky high levels.
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  #43  
Old 05-30-2013, 05:55 PM
wonkaticket wonkaticket is offline
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The card was neat no doubt.

Perhaps Hunt should spend more time putting up a website and images vs. worrying about strong arming dealers to not display at other local card shows.

These are cool and I pick them up when I can if the price I feel is fair. I don’t feel these are "blue chip" by any means and more a very neat but thinly traded novelty item. They do give a really cool insight into the production and printing process of the cards we love and that makes them special.

For me I would say I don’t think it went super cheap. In fact had I seen this card I could see myself bidding so perhaps some money was left on the table? But who knows. However no amazing deal was had but that’s just my 2 cents.

I also think it’s just a matter of time before we see this card again for sale, so a second chance will be had.

Cheers,

John

Last edited by wonkaticket; 05-30-2013 at 05:56 PM.
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  #44  
Old 05-30-2013, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianp-beme View Post
No one with a Brain would spend this much for one crummy card.

Brian

+1. No offense to the winning bidder but, really??? Some guy at the factory reports to work drunk one day and ruins a sheet of cards by running them back and forth in the press and 100 years later it goes for $6500?
Oh well, to each his own....
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  #45  
Old 05-30-2013, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by tbob View Post
+1. No offense to the winning bidder but, really??? Some guy at the factory reports to work drunk one day and ruins a sheet of cards by running them back and forth in the press and 100 years later it goes for $6500?
Oh well, to each his own....
I've heard that these sheets were perhaps used to calibrate the press, so the printer used it again and again to do so. When the back was too covered he flipped it over and used the other side. Then someone rescued them for the printer's floor, and over 100 years later here they are.

If this is in fact the case, these cards are extremely unique to the set, and a huge part of the sets history. JMO
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  #46  
Old 05-30-2013, 06:52 PM
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$7500 was the next bid with BP and that was over my limit. This one hurt more then any other I've missed.

Being relatively new to AH bidding, the one aspect that sucks is the large bid increment you are forced to make once an item gets up in price.

Factoring in the BP makes it even more costly to place that one higher bid. I realize this is the way the game is played, but it would be easier to stay within budget and still win some cards if the bid increments were smaller (eg. $100 increments up to $10K). Maybe I'm in the minority with this thinking.
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  #47  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CW View Post
Being relatively new to AH bidding, the one aspect that sucks is the large bid increment you are forced to make once an item gets up in price.

Factoring in the BP makes it even more costly to place that one higher bid. I realize this is the way the game is played, but it would be easier to stay within budget and still win some cards if the bid increments were smaller (eg. $100 increments up to $10K). Maybe I'm in the minority with this thinking.
At the same time, you are less likely to get outbid if you lock up a strong bid level.
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  #48  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by T206Collector View Post
This is an interesting card, no doubt. But my rule of thumb on these printing "errors" is that if it happened in another set -- say 1930s Goudey or 1950s Topps -- would anyone care?

If the answer is "no", then why does the fact that it happened in T206 matter?
T206Collector- your philosophy doesn't hold water at all, IMO. you can't compare T206 to other sets. same question back at ya, can you compare signed T206's to signed 1950's Topps? no way. T206 is a special animal...you should know this.
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  #49  
Old 05-30-2013, 08:04 PM
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I would pay $45 for that card.
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  #50  
Old 05-30-2013, 08:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
At the same time, you are less likely to get outbid if you lock up a strong bid level.
Peter, this is so true. Just learned it first hand. I had one bid left to make last night and it wound up occupying a critical slot. I think that in large part helped me out.
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