“Collector grade”

[Snapolit1]

I’m tired of the term “collector grade”. Not even sure what it means in this day and age. Obviously code for lesser condition. “Hey you, poor guy in the corner with the beer can shoes on … here’s one for you!!” But if it’s lesser condition but a rare card, is it still collector grade? Does anyone care? Some people collect cards in Ex condition and some collect lower condition ones, and many of us collect all over the place. Aren’t we all collectors? Always strikes me like an unnecessary term altogether.

[RCMcKenzie]

Isn't it just a sales term? If I consigned this card, I'd rather the auction house call it "collector grade" than "total beater".

[G1911]

I like to see “total beater” in an auction. It tells me I just might be able to win the card/partial remnant of a card.

[mrreality68]

I agree it is just a way to sell it or market it better.

Just like everything on eBay seems to be Set Breakers trying to imply it is ultra important to get it now because you may never again get the chance and your set will never be complete.

Sometimes you see multiple set breakers of the same card at same time for sale on eBay

[Frankish]

Originally Posted by G1911

I like to see “total beater” in an auction. It tells me I just might be able to win the card/partial remnant of a card.

Glad I'm not the only one!

[Exhibitman]

It is a niche marketing tool for AHs and sellers. Wasn't there a dealer who called himself "Mr. VG" as a tongue in cheek jab at Rosen?

Doesn't have a lot of explanatory value in this market where beaters of Ruth go for four figures. To me mostly what it means is the seller signaling "don't try to get this thing slabbed".

[Al C.risafulli]

I use the term.

I use it for two reasons:

1) Typically I use it to describe a card that's NOT a total beater. I use it to describe a card that's lower grade but still has eye appeal - maybe something an investor might avoid, but something that a collector will love. I like the idea that someone that's a "true" collector is looking carefully at what the card looks like, and not the number on the flip, and so a 2 or a 3 that looks nice, or a 2 or a 3 that's so rare that the grade doesn't matter, is something that would appeal to a collector.

2) I have to describe the card, sometimes between 500 and 800 cards in an auction, and its sometimes hard not to use the same expressions again and again - there are only so many ways to describe cards. My consignors depend on me to describe their cards accurately, and at the same time, I like to avoid terms like "low grade" or "off condition" because they're gauche and because they sound negative. I try and keep the hyperbole to a minimum and instead accurately describe the cards, but at some point you can't sound insulting, so there are some euphemisms that creep in. "Collector grade" is one of them. Another one I use is "Well worn." Or "Well-loved."

-Al

[Luke]

What Al just said makes a ton of sense and is something I never considered. When I am listing my cards for sale, I don't mind using the term low grade, or very very poor, etc because they are my cards and I'm using a fixed price listing so there's no risk of the card selling way too cheap. But if I were listing other people's cards, I would want to show more respect and reverence for their card in the terminology I use. Just to make sure none of my customers felt like I was underselling or disrespecting their card. So viewed through that lens, it makes total sense why some of these marketing terms are used.

[Frankish]

I always just assumed it came up in response to "investment grade" as a description, and I kind of like that. The way Al uses it makes perfect sense to me and in fact teases out some of the distinctions I make when I'm looking for cards to purchase.

Like most descriptors, though, I can see how it is easy to overuse and even misuse.

[Carter08]

Don’t like the term or at least don’t understand it. Is an e93 PSA 2 Christy Mathewson not also an investment? For the price I sure hope it is at least in part.

[mintacular]

I don't like the term either, implies the little guy collector can't afford quality condition cards. I don't like "investment" grade either. Just estimate the condition and provide scans, all the fluff words do nothing for people I don't believe. Well loved is not going to make me see a card that looks like it was run of by a dump truck any differently

[Exhibitman]

I know some dealers will put "OBC" into the title or description to denote a card with major damage.

I don't mind either phrase, They both are good 'jargon' to describe in a shorthand way who might be interested in the card.

[CobbSpikedMe]

Everyone knows true collectors collect low grade cards. That way we can get more cards for the same amount of money. If you're buying really expensive high grade cards then you're investing your money whether you want to think so or not.



.

[Carter08]

Agree - I live in the 2.5. Jealous of others that were smart enough to do this longer and have higher grades. I don’t think I’ve ever had a 7 of anything. Have a 53 Bowman Spahn as an 8oc though! Sigh.

[Eric72]

The term "collector grade" doesn't bother me in the slightest. So long as it scales based on the issue, and the seller is being somewhat realistic, it actually makes quite a bit of sense. For example:

T206 raw cards in fair condition
Early 1950s Topps in good plus
1970s Topps in VG-EX

Those are just off-the-cuff examples. Basically, "collector grade" means somewhere between mid-grade and "ouch...if that card could talk."

[ullmandds]

I know what kind of collector I am...I will never own an sgc 96 cj cobb or JJ...I collect lower grade cards...and I'm fine with it.

I do not mind the term collectors grade in the least. What I can't stand is overuse of words such as penultimate and verbose listings talking about the depicted players career or how smart I'd be to buy this card.

[Eric72]

My unscientific translation guide:

"Blazer" - get that thing graded!

"Nice" - sell it to someone who thinks they know more than you. They'll pay to get it graded

"Mid-grade" - stick it in a binder and enjoy the damn thing

"Collector grade" - Don't be afraid to handle it raw. OK to leave out loose on your desk overnight...unless, of course, you have a cat.

"Well-loved" - if you squint, it looks fine. Don't worry, it will look better as you get older and your eyesight begins getting worse

"Beater" - still more or less complete. Its road map of flaws probably tells a vaguely interesting story

"Ouch" or "Ooof" - at least it's still a card...kind of

[bmattioli]

I love Low Graded cards but what the Hell is a Beer can shoe??

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by Eric72

My unscientific translation guide:

"Blazer" - get that thing graded!

"Nice" - sell it to someone who thinks they know more than you. They'll pay to get it graded

"Mid-grade" - stick it in a binder and enjoy the damn thing

"Collector grade" - Don't be afraid to handle it raw. OK to leave out loose on your desk overnight...unless, of course, you have a cat.

"Well-loved" - if you squint, it looks fine. Don't worry, it will look better as you get older and your eyesight begins getting worse

"Beater" - still more or less complete. Its road map of flaws probably tells a vaguely interesting story

"Ouch" or "Ooof" - at least it's still a card...kind of

I hear you on these but collector grade is used by auction houses on already graded cards.

[MikeGarcia]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I’m tired of the term “collector grade”. Not even sure what it means in this day and age. Obviously code for lesser condition. “Hey you, poor guy in the corner with the beer can shoes on … here’s one for you!!” But if it’s lesser condition but a rare card, is it still collector grade? Does anyone care? Some people collect cards in Ex condition and some collect lower condition ones, and many of us collect all over the place. Aren’t we all collectors? Always strikes me like an unnecessary term altogether.

All over the place is fine.....

..

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by Al C.risafulli

I use the term.

I use it for two reasons:

1) Typically I use it to describe a card that's NOT a total beater. I use it to describe a card that's lower grade but still has eye appeal - maybe something an investor might avoid, but something that a collector will love. I like the idea that someone that's a "true" collector is looking carefully at what the card looks like, and not the number on the flip, and so a 2 or a 3 that looks nice, or a 2 or a 3 that's so rare that the grade doesn't matter, is something that would appeal to a collector.

2) I have to describe the card, sometimes between 500 and 800 cards in an auction, and its sometimes hard not to use the same expressions again and again - there are only so many ways to describe cards. My consignors depend on me to describe their cards accurately, and at the same time, I like to avoid terms like "low grade" or "off condition" because they're gauche and because they sound negative. I try and keep the hyperbole to a minimum and instead accurately describe the cards, but at some point you can't sound insulting, so there are some euphemisms that creep in. "Collector grade" is one of them. Another one I use is "Well worn." Or "Well-loved."

-Al

As a longtime consignor to Al's auctions, I love his descriptions: reasonably brief, accurate and not over the top touting the cards. And he has a nice flowing literary style. You owe me, Al.

[e6phillips]

Nice one!

You Know Me Al!

Only on this site can someone make a pun about a baseball book that's 100 years old and people will get it!

I understand why people don't like the term "collector's grade" since it often doesn't mean anything but when used correctly, to me it signals that the card is one that I would have liked when I was a kid and didn't care about corner wear, wrinkles or even creases as long as they weren't over an important part of the picture. . . my sons and I still like those cards.

[RedlegsFan]

People that use the term ‘collector grade’ are ones that don’t have time to debate whether a card is good or good+ or whatever. It is actually quite simple. 90% of collectors can not afford a $15,000 card from the 1960’s just because it is in a psa 9 or 10 holder, (hence ‘investor grade’) whereas that same 90% of collectors CAN afford that SAME card if it is unslabbed or ‘raw’ with a few creases for $15 shipped.

So yes, there is a clear distinction between ‘collector’ and ‘investor’ grades. A true ‘collector’ would have fewer reservations breaking out that psa 1.5 1961 topps mantle and sticking it in a binder or even a pocket. The ‘investor’ may tell himself he’s collecting, but would take that same 61 mantle in ‘investor’ grade and start looking for a safe or fire proof lock box to put it in.

Many things about our hobby and market are annoying, perhaps yes, but it is because we are all so different… but at least i didnt sell my car to buy a psa 10 of some Pokemon card!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by RedlegsFan

People that use the term ‘collector grade’ are ones that don’t have time to debate whether a card is good or good+ or whatever. It is actually quite simple. 90% of collectors can not afford a $15,000 card from the 1960’s just because it is in a psa 9 or 10 holder, (hence ‘investor grade’) whereas that same 90% of collectors CAN afford that SAME card if it is unslabbed or ‘raw’ with a few creases for $15 shipped.

So yes, there is a clear distinction between ‘collector’ and ‘investor’ grades. A true ‘collector’ would have fewer reservations breaking out that psa 1.5 1961 topps mantle and sticking it in a binder or even a pocket. The ‘investor’ may tell himself he’s collecting, but would take that same 61 mantle in ‘investor’ grade and start looking for a safe or fire proof lock box to put it in.

Many things about our hobby and market are annoying, perhaps yes, but it is because we are all so different… but at least i didnt sell my car to buy a psa 10 of some Pokemon card!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Out of curiosity, what’s the cutoff in terms of psa graded cards for that one?

[conor912]

Of all the ways we’re marketed to today, this one pisses me off the least.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by conor912

Of all the ways we’re marketed to today, this one pisses me off the least.

Ha yeah, I need to opt out of receiving paper bibles of cards I can’t afford. Might save a tree or two.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by RedlegsFan

People that use the term ‘collector grade’ are ones that don’t have time to debate whether a card is good or good+ or whatever. It is actually quite simple. 90% of collectors can not afford a $15,000 card from the 1960’s just because it is in a psa 9 or 10 holder, (hence ‘investor grade’) whereas that same 90% of collectors CAN afford that SAME card if it is unslabbed or ‘raw’ with a few creases for $15 shipped.

So yes, there is a clear distinction between ‘collector’ and ‘investor’ grades. A true ‘collector’ would have fewer reservations breaking out that psa 1.5 1961 topps mantle and sticking it in a binder or even a pocket. The ‘investor’ may tell himself he’s collecting, but would take that same 61 mantle in ‘investor’ grade and start looking for a safe or fire proof lock box to put it in.

Many things about our hobby and market are annoying, perhaps yes, but it is because we are all so different… but at least i didnt sell my car to buy a psa 10 of some Pokemon card!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good points

[ALBB]

Love collector grade/ low grade stuff !

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by RedlegsFan

People that use the term ‘collector grade’ are ones that don’t have time to debate whether a card is good or good+ or whatever. It is actually quite simple. 90% of collectors can not afford a $15,000 card from the 1960’s just because it is in a psa 9 or 10 holder, (hence ‘investor grade’) whereas that same 90% of collectors CAN afford that SAME card if it is unslabbed or ‘raw’ with a few creases for $15 shipped.

So yes, there is a clear distinction between ‘collector’ and ‘investor’ grades. A true ‘collector’ would have fewer reservations breaking out that psa 1.5 1961 topps mantle and sticking it in a binder or even a pocket. The ‘investor’ may tell himself he’s collecting, but would take that same 61 mantle in ‘investor’ grade and start looking for a safe or fire proof lock box to put it in.

Many things about our hobby and market are annoying, perhaps yes, but it is because we are all so different… but at least i didnt sell my car to buy a psa 10 of some Pokemon card!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

agreed!

[BCauley]

I usually just chalk it up to a low-mid grade card, don't really care one way or the other though technically any card could be "collector grade." If someone collects only the lowest grade or the highest grade, they're still collecting it.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

“Hey you, poor guy in the corner with the beer can shoes on … here’s one for you!!”

What kind of freak feet would beer cans fit? Does the sippin' hole double as extra wiggle room for the big toe? I really need to see Cinderella remade with light to these beer can shoes of which you speak.

[Tao_Moko]

I'm on the side of being ok with "Collector's Grade". I guess I'm just not insulted by someone telling me they have a lower cost option for an otherwise, higher value card. I don't think "beater" when I see something marketed as collector grade. Speaking of beaters............picked this up for ~$60.

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by Al C.risafulli

I use the term.

I use it to describe a card that's lower grade but still has eye appeal - maybe something an investor might avoid, but something that a collector will love.

-Al

This

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by obcbobd

This

I guess then describing a Babe Ruth card as "collectors grade" because its a PSA 1.5 that will sell for $20,000 doesn't make a ton of sense, which was my original point.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I guess then describing a Babe Ruth card as "collectors grade" because its a PSA 1.5 that will sell for $20,000 doesn't make a ton of sense, which was my original point.

It is just collector grade to a person in a different income bracket. They like Babe Ruth but can't afford the PSA 6 so they settle for the collector grade PSA 1.5 Ruth.

[rhettyeakley]

Originally Posted by Al C.risafulli

I use the term.

I use it for two reasons:

1) Typically I use it to describe a card that's NOT a total beater. I use it to describe a card that's lower grade but still has eye appeal - maybe something an investor might avoid, but something that a collector will love. I like the idea that someone that's a "true" collector is looking carefully at what the card looks like, and not the number on the flip, and so a 2 or a 3 that looks nice, or a 2 or a 3 that's so rare that the grade doesn't matter, is something that would appeal to a collector.

2) I have to describe the card, sometimes between 500 and 800 cards in an auction, and its sometimes hard not to use the same expressions again and again - there are only so many ways to describe cards. My consignors depend on me to describe their cards accurately, and at the same time, I like to avoid terms like "low grade" or "off condition" because they're gauche and because they sound negative. I try and keep the hyperbole to a minimum and instead accurately describe the cards, but at some point you can't sound insulting, so there are some euphemisms that creep in. "Collector grade" is one of them. Another one I use is "Well worn." Or "Well-loved."

-Al

I agree with Al’s assessment.

I use the term all the time in my listings. I have always thought of “collector’s grade” to refer to a card that is presentable but not overly abused. A card that would look good in what some refer to as “binder sets” or a set that is in a binder to be flipped through without fear or ruining a high dollar card that may be in there. To me “collector grade” cards typically fall into the 2-5 range with a clean front and typically a clean back (back being less important.)

[D. Bergin]

Perhaps related (perhaps not), I often use the term "reading copy only", when selling a lower grade publication or book.

Basically it means, it's complete enough to read or get the information you want out of it...but it's not going to look pretty displayed up on your shelf.

[Foo3112]

Collector grade (Investor Grade) is so dumb. Even a Cracker Jack Shoeless Joe in a low grade is a still collector grade (as most cant afford even in a PSA 1). The term 'collector grade' is just a selling tactic used by auction houses and those trying to pump out as much as they can from bidders who are fighting over the said item. FOMO.

Collect what you like.

[brianp-beme]

The nice thing about being a beater collector is that, if so desired, the lofty heights of collector grade are sometimes within reach.

Brian (this T216 of Evers does not quite qualify as collector grade)

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It is just collector grade to a person in a different income bracket. They like Babe Ruth but can't afford the PSA 6 so they settle for the collector grade PSA 1.5 Ruth.

Let's hop in the wayback machine. Here's a description to remember!

This one absolutely earned it's "A" grade. Between a back that is severely damaged due to album residue and paper loss and a recolored front, it's authentic, and that's about it.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Let's hop in the wayback machine. Here's a description to remember!

This one absolutely earned it's "A" grade. Between a back that is severely damaged due to album residue and paper loss and a recolored front, it's authentic, and that's about it.

LOL, those are the cards I like. I have a T210 in my collection now that would make that one seem mint.

It is one of the best most honest descriptions I have seen in a AH listing. To make sense for everyone that was a description Scott used for a card I consigned to him.

[ValKehl]

When it comes to WaJo cards, this one represents "collector grade" to me:

[edjs]

Originally Posted by brianp-beme

The nice thing about being a beater collector is that, if so desired, the lofty heights of collector grade are sometimes within reach.

Brian (this T216 of Evers does not quite qualify as collector grade)

I was writing to Steve about a card he was getting from me, and I said it was not a beater, but a survivor. He liked that term.

[edjs]

Originally Posted by BillyCox3

What kind of freak feet would beer cans fit? Does the sippin' hole double as extra wiggle room for the big toe? I really need to see Cinderella remade with light to these beer can shoes of which you speak.

Best I can come up with.

[jcmtiger]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

Isn't it just a sales term? If I consigned this card, I'd rather the auction house call it "collector grade" than "total beater".

I don’t think that will happen

[brianp-beme]

Originally Posted by edjs

I was writing to Steve about a card he was getting from me, and I said it was not a beater, but a survivor. He liked that term.

That is a great term for them. Another one I like is "used card"...so much so that I ended up making that my Ebay ID back in the day when I sold cards on that sadly disintegrating site.

Brian

[RCMcKenzie]

Originally Posted by jcmtiger

I don’t think that will happen

It's fun to see that other folks have a different definition of 'collector grade' than I have. If you don't collect T215, then you want no part of the Huggins. I think it's a great card from my collection, and it's worth very little money.

I showed this Babe Ruth to my brother, and I thought he was going to say, "Wow, that's a Babe Ruth." and he said, "Wow, that card's in bad shape, I like the Goudey's."

[RCMcKenzie]

To Steve's original point, if you're selling a PSA 3.5 1975 Topps George Brett, and calling it "collector grade", it's insulting and patronizing.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

I know some dealers will put "OBC" into the title or description to denote a card with major damage.

OBC???


Obvious Beater Card?

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by RCMcKenzie

It's fun to see that other folks have a different definition of 'collector grade' than I have. If you don't collect T215, then you want no part of the Huggins. I think it's a great card from my collection, and it's worth very little money.

I showed this Babe Ruth to my brother, and I thought he was going to say, "Wow, that's a Babe Ruth." and he said, "Wow, that card's in bad shape, I like the Goudey's."

Ha yeah it’s in bad shape. And it could pay my mortgage for a year!