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Ebay Authentication - It Gets Personal
A few weeks back, I bought a nice raw '49 Bowman Spahn from Greg Morris. So far, so good. Today I received an email from Greg saying the card was rejected by PSA as non-authentic with no reason given. I despise PSA and don't ever want them anywhere near my cards. What I don't know is the next step? Presumably, the card is returned to Greg who will examine it and then determine what the problem is, if any, which I doubt since they are excellent graders and see if I still want the card or a refund of my $537 purchase price. Has anybody had a similar experience? Greg did offer a $20 credit off my next purchase. Whoopee!
This Ebay program is an abomination. |
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I thought Greg put “set break” in his listings and bypassed the eBay authentication program? Surprised by this…..
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Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk |
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Perhaps you can contact him outside of Ebay, he does have a website, and request if they determine that everything is fine with the card, you can complete the transaction outside of Ebay.
Brian |
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PSA only looks at the graded cards. CSG is in charge of the raw cards.
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Yet another story in support of why I don't have or want graded cards. I don't care for someone else's opinion of my cards. I don't care for the plastic slabs. And I don't give a hoot about how much more valuable they are, they aren't for sale.
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
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If it's the one I think, that's a really nice card.
I have a feeling it's because he listed as NR-MINT and they are looking at it with CSG modern grading eyes. It does have some corner wear (slight!) and because it wasn't 91' Stadium Club NR MINT (because no one sends 49' Bowman to CSG) they dinged it. He probably shouldn't have used NR Mint alone in the designation. Not defending the action, just guessing the cause.
__________________
- Justin D. Player collecting - Lance Parrish, Jim Davenport, John Norlander. Successful B/S/T with - Highstep74, Northviewcats, pencil1974, T2069bk, tjenkins, wilkiebaby11, baez578, Bocabirdman, maddux31, Leon, Just-Collect, bigfish, quinnsryche...and a whole bunch more, I stopped keeping track, lol. |
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All I know is I bought the card raw from Greg off their Ebay platform. Then it went through the authenticity drill and today I received an Email saying that PSA had rejected it for authenticity with nothing more than Greg apologizing and offering a $10 credit on my next purchase There was no mention of CSG and besides I wanted the card raw, not graded. Nor was there any mention of 'what happens next'. I have already emailed back to Greg asking for instructions.
I feel helpless here and somewhat victimized by this clusterf*%^k of an Ebay program I didn't want in the first place. Now I have neither the card nor my $500+ purchase price. |
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Spahn
I've done business with Greg for a long time...whatever is happening; he will make it right.
I'm assuming there is a strict process in place via EBay>CSG/PSA>back to seller>refund to buyer. Lots of parties involved but the authentication is there to protect the buyer. Probably just needs a little time to cycle through.
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Always looking for PSA Graded 1952 Topps: 1-80 PSA 7 81-310 PSA 8 311-407 PSA 6 |
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Looks like this is the card, using the sold listings?
If so, I understand for rejecting, because it is not NR-MT as the title claims. Bottom right corner especially. If they rejected it for authenticity as OP is saying, then I have a lot of questions for CSG. This is why I don't want the program. My eyes work and I know what I'm buying, please don't tell me I can't have what I want and buy. |
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I am confused, a raw card would not have gone to PSA.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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I'm just wondering if there's something wrong with the top border of the card. It looks like it may be slightly bowed (convex).
Steve
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Successful BST deals with eliotdeutsch, gonzo, jimivintage, Leon, lharris3600, markf31, Mrc32, sb1, seablaster, shammus, veloce. Current Wantlist: 1909 Obak Howard (Los Angeles) (no frame on back) 1910 E90-2 Gibson, Hyatt, Maddox |
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I rarely buy on ebay, but I do check it fairly regularly. If one of the bigger shops or a seller I have dealt with privately has a card listed that I like, I just deal with them off the ebay platform; you can usually get a better deal as well and not pay sales tax. Anyway, Greg has a website and phone number. Just call and world something out, keep Ebay out of it |
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I've noticed Greg Morris putting NR-MT on some listings that would likely grade 4.5-5 if sent for grading and wondered if they have some exemption that allows this. If any other seller lists a raw VGEX-EX card as NR-MT, it isn't going to pass the ebay auth process.
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ThatT206Life.com |
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eBay sucks. Officially.
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He is more likely to grade a NM card as VG VG/EX. Also, he’s been at this for 10 years he can’t give a card a single grade? Big difference between Ex and Ex Mt.
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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I get why they might flag it for the grade, since it isn't NRMT like Morris listed it, but I would think a reasonable program would give the buyer a choice, not force cancel it. I've arranged a lot of deals I used to do on eBay to be off eBay after this program, because I fear exactly this. I know that a card is often lower grade than the seller claims, or I fear they won't recognize what it even is and will cancel the transaction. I just want the card I, of my own free will, chose to enter into a contract to buy. It makes no sense a grading company I do not care about has to sign off that I am allowed to do this. I hope but doubt eBay ends up killing this garbage. |
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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I just reread Greg's email. All he states is 'that the card has been rejected by the Ebay protection program". By who? Why? What now? I suspect you guys are right and Greg overgraded the card and it was then deemed unworthy of nrmt, by I suppose PSA.
All I know is that I am sitting here fuming, out $537 and no Spahny to comfort me.. A pox on the Ebay protection program. |
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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I think it's automatic.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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( h @ $ e A n + l e y |
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If you look on the back of the card, the corners are even worse. Top right corner of the back looks like it might have some paper loss. CSG almost certainly rejected this one because of it being listed as NR-MINT. Also, GregMorris has been having some grading issues as of late. I buy a ton of cards from them every week, and over the past couple weeks I've gotten numerous cards with creases or wrinkles that were not disclosed, as well as some 1986 Fleer basketball cards that were clearly trimmed and even one that was recolored (and not difficult to find with the card in hand). Something is going on at GM, because I never used to get stuff like this from them. I also noticed they put out an advertisement on social media that they are looking to hire a grader... So hopefully things turn back around for them in the near future.
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If it's not perfectly centered, I probably don't want it. Last edited by Snowman; 11-10-2022 at 09:48 PM. |
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Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk |
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I buy a fair amount from Morris. I have a 65 Jim Otto sitting here he described as VG-VG/EX but looks NRMT in hand and I can’t find what’s wrong. I’ve also gotten a few that are wildly over graded, which is why I use the scans and ignore what sellers state to me is the condition. Morris delivers what I buy, scans well, and has good combined shipping. Amid all the cards he sells for double what they cost from other sellers, a fair number of the weekly listings go for regularp prices, and with combined shipping stack pretty well for large orders. |
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If it's not perfectly centered, I probably don't want it. |
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Last edited by Jim65; 11-11-2022 at 06:27 AM. |
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Gentleman. the collective wisdom of the board has assisted in getting this mess sorted out. This morning I received an Email from Greg saying, referencing the Board's exchange on the matter(there you go), I have been refunded the full purchase price for my Spahn.
In my mind, 2 issues remain: 1. The work flows involved when a raw card is rejected for authenticity. I still don't know who deemed it unworthy of a nrmt grade. If Ebay really believes in this thing they must clarify exactly how it works. 2. I have normally had no problem with GM grading until this frustrating matter. If more of there cards are being rejected because of Greg's grading, then they have a real problem. Thanks to all the board members who chimed in on this; it certainly spurred Greg into action. John |
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GM Cards
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__________________
Always looking for PSA Graded 1952 Topps: 1-80 PSA 7 81-310 PSA 8 311-407 PSA 6 |
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1) If an item is rejected, the refund process is automatic. The seller doesn't have to do anything, and you don't have to do anything as the buyer. It's always nice when the seller contacts you to chat about it, but in terms of getting your cash back, the seller has no control over that process. So there was really never any risk that you would be SOL. Either you get the goods or you get a refund, period, full stop. It might take a couple of days until it all gets sorted, but hopefully the seemingly interminable waiting doesn't constitute a terrible inconvenience. 2) In one case, I had the authenticator contact me to alert me to their findings, and ask me how I want to proceed. In that situation involving a slabbed item, the slab had come apart. The authenticator sent me pictures so that I could take a look and decide for myself. I had the option to proceed and accept the item, or I could choose to reject it for a full refund. That may have been a unique situation, but I'm more than a little intrigued that the authenticator didn't give you the option of proceeding in spite of their findings.
__________________
Trying to wrap up my master mays set, with just a few left: 1968 American Oil left side 1971 Bazooka numbered complete panel |
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Just when I thought things were sorting themselves out after GM's email saying that a refund was issued 10/25, I checked my P/P account, from which I originally paid for the card, and there was no credit shown.
I just send a WTF to Greg asking where the supposed refund was sent. I fear this incident may have spoiled me from buying from GM in the future if any purchase may be rejected by some dickhead at CSG. And I don't know if they rejected it because of authenticity or CSG didn't agree with GM about the grade. Card buying is supposed to be fun, right? |
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__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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__________________
Trying to wrap up my master mays set, with just a few left: 1968 American Oil left side 1971 Bazooka numbered complete panel |
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Because they are interfering in a transaction between two parties who want to do the deal, I think. Their assessment is correct, but no one involved in the deal cares what they think, but their deal is nixed because an unwanted third party arbitrarily says they can't do the deal. I wouldn't phrase it that way, but I see the sentiment.
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__________________
Trying to wrap up my master mays set, with just a few left: 1968 American Oil left side 1971 Bazooka numbered complete panel |
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Maybe EBay should allow an 'opt out' of the EA when you check out.
Basically buying the card as-is. I'd certainly do that as I am fine with what I buy raw.
__________________
Always looking for PSA Graded 1952 Topps: 1-80 PSA 7 81-310 PSA 8 311-407 PSA 6 |
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Here is a link that explains the process: https://pages.ebay.com/authenticity-...-tradingcards/ |
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The auction ended on October 16th, correct? If so, the card should have been in CSG's hands within a few days after payment and they would have made their "assessment" a couple weeks ago. Seems off that it's only going through the authentication process now.
And as others have said, if a card is rejected by the authentication program, refunds are automatic and implemented immediately at the time of rejection. Does the tracking actually show that Greg Morris sent it? You would have gotten emails directly from eBay about the authentication process. And as a seller, I am 100% in favor of the program for many reasons. As a buyer, I believe that you should have the option to opt out of the program, but if you do so, you lose any buyer protection - meaning no refunds for any reason and no support from eBay on the purchase. |
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If EBay didn't refund you and you never received an email from Ebay saying the card failed, I'd question whether it really was sent to Authentication at all. |
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