Small crease on Ryan PSA 6

[silvor]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

Ben, the ebay seller "does not accept returns", but it obviously could not hurt to ask. In the case a seller does not accept returns, ebay will be less likely to require the seller to accept a return unless the seller essentially lied about something in the listing.

Not true at all. You can return it no matter.

Ask for a return from the seller. If he says no, go to ebay and ask for a return. Your case is better if you say you didn't know about the crease.

[pokerplyr80]

Most people would assume a psa 6 would not have a crease. If the seller didn't mention it in their description just return it and list not as described as the reason.

[Mountaineer1999]

The crease is just to the left of the 1 in 1968.. gonna try to upload a snapshot

[Mountaineer1999]

There is no way I would have bid on this card if I could have seen the crease. I will contact seller but I am not optimistic.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

There is no way I would have bid on this card if I could have seen the crease. I will contact seller but I am not optimistic.

It certainly could not hurt to ask the seller/ebay if returning is an option based on the crease, as anything is possible. With a graded card and the seller's return policy, your optimism is realistic. If have no luck with a return through the seller or ebay and you paid with Paypal, you may have better luck filing a NAD/return case through paypal.

[swarmee]

Or you could submit it to PSA as a review with a MinGrade of AUTH and tell them you expect a downgrade and to be reimbursed for the difference in values between the new grade of the card and what you paid.
Otherwise, the Item Not As Described is correct. If you try to return it or message the seller saying you don't want it anymore, you will get stonewalled.

[swarmee]

*double post*

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

There is no way I would have bid on this card if I could have seen the crease. I will contact seller but I am not optimistic.

Even though the seller provided a large picture there is no way
you could have seen the crease.

Ryan Donnies Pic.jpg

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by Pat R

Even though the seller provided a large picture there is no way
you could have seen the crease.

Attachment 331425

That crease is obvious enough in the OP's post, outside of picture manipulation, I'm not sure how that doesn't show up in scan from listing??

[rats60]

When a seller sells a card with a crease and doesn't mention it, the card is not as described. Major defects should always be described no matter if the card is in a holder or not. If the crease wasn't there in the sellers photo and is there now, then it must have been damaged during shipment. Either way, that is why you should always pay with a credit card as they will stand behind you if EBay and Paypal won't.

[KCRfan1]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

There is no way I would have bid on this card if I could have seen the crease. I will contact seller but I am not optimistic.

You would not have seen the crease because it isn't in the image posted by the seller.....

I would be shocked if the seller accepted a return. It's PWCC, buyer beware.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

You would not have seen the crease because it isn't in the image posted by the seller.....

I would be shocked if the seller accepted a return. It's PWCC, buyer beware.

I am all for hating on PWCC and the complete BS Betsy has posted on here but this was NOT a PWCC listing.

A PWCC listing pops up but you need to click on the "view original item" link to see the real listing.

[KCRfan1]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I am all for hating on PWCC and the complete BS Betsy has posted on here but this was NOT a PWCC listing.

A PWCC listing pops up but you need to click on the "view original item" link to see the real listing.

Correct Ben, and my mistake.

I will stand by my assessment that the crease is not present in the image. When I enlarge the image of the back of the card, I do not see the crease.

I'm not sure that means anything though, as my eyesight seems to be failing me by misidentifying the seller.

[swarmee]

Looks like it would grade a 2.5 currently IMO with that crease/heavy surface wrinkle.

[chalupacollects]

Angle of sellers photo and flash could make crease disappear. Even though seller does not accept returns ebay is very buyer friendly, Contact seller first and if they say sorry, no returns go to ebay as NAD..ebay can force the return... If that fails hit Paypal if you paid that way...

[savedfrommyspokes]

If the seller is not agreeable to a return, ebay maybe less likely to support a NAD claim as under item specifics the seller used the following to describe the item: "Condition: Very Good: An item that is used but still in very good condition. "

When ebay reviews NAD claims, especially involving items where the seller does not accept returns, they do review what the seller stated as the condition to be in the item specifics area.

While PSA appears to have botched the grading on this card, the seller calling this card VG in the item specifics area is spot on.

[56Horsehide]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

The crease is just to the left of the 1 in 1968.. gonna try to upload a snapshot

Is it possible the ebay scan of the reverse is a different card? It not only does not show the crease, it does not show the "black" spots in front of the "R" in Rookie.

[Mountaineer1999]

Originally Posted by 56Horsehide

Is it possible the ebay scan of the reverse is a different card? It not only does not show the crease, it does not show the "black

" spots in front of the "R" in Rookie.

It's the same card.

[Mountaineer1999]

Update:
EBay sided with me on this claim and the card was put back in the mail today using EBays shipping label. The way I read it, I will be credited when package indicates delivered.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by silvor

Not true at all. You can return it no matter.

Ask for a return from the seller. If he says no, go to ebay and ask for a return. Your case is better if you say you didn't know about the crease.

As a buyer, not my experience at all. When a seller specifies "Seller does not accept returns", it means that unless the item is grossly mis-described OR is the wrong item altogether, your return is not likely going to be accepted by the seller or approved by ebay. In most cases, sellers specifies "Seller does not accept returns" for a reason, and ebay will support them in most cases.

Sure, the buyer in this case can try to find a reason that this card does not match the sellers description ("1968 topps rookie of nolan ryan. Graded PSA 6" )and maybe get ebay to approve the return if the seller does not, but with a graded card like this a return approved by ebay is not likely.

In this case, the information provided by the seller in the listing concerning the card and his return policy make it hard to argue a "not as described" claim with ebay...ebay will likely view this as buyer's remorse, especially if the seller calls and speaks to a human at ebay.

Recently, I received several grossly overstated raw lots of cards and had to make multiple phone calls to a live human at ebay as well as provide a series of images supporting my claim that the seller overstated the condition of what they sold to me. Eventually, ebay approved the returns, but my returns were for grossly mis-described items, not an item that there is a question about if the item was mis-described in it's listing by the seller or not.

Perhaps you have had much easier experiences returning items to sellers with "Seller does not accept returns" stated in their listing, but this is not my experience. I obviously pay more attention to this detail when buying.

However, it absolutely does not hurt to try.

[silvor]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

As a buyer, not my experience at all. When a seller specifies "Seller does not accept returns", it means that unless the item is grossly mis-described OR is the wrong item altogether, your return is not likely going to be accepted by the seller or approved by ebay. In most cases, sellers specifies "Seller does not accept returns" for a reason, and ebay will support them in most cases.

Sure, the buyer in this case can try to find a reason that this card does not match the sellers description ("1968 topps rookie of nolan ryan. Graded PSA 6" )and maybe get ebay to approve the return if the seller does not, but with a graded card like this a return approved by ebay is not likely.

In this case, the information provided by the seller in the listing concerning the card and his return policy make it hard to argue a "not as described" claim with ebay...ebay will likely view this as buyer's remorse, especially if the seller calls and speaks to a human at ebay.

Recently, I received several grossly overstated raw lots of cards and had to make multiple phone calls to a live human at ebay as well as provide a series of images supporting my claim that the seller overstated the condition of what they sold to me. Eventually, ebay approved the returns, but my returns were for grossly mis-described items, not an item that there is a question about if the item was mis-described in it's listing by the seller or not.

Perhaps you have had much easier experiences returning items to sellers with "Seller does not accept returns" stated in their listing, but this is not my experience. I obviously pay more attention to this detail when buying.

However, it absolutely does not hurt to try.

I bought a T206 PSA 4 that looked centered in the photos. He didn't say it was centered. I requested a return from the seller, he said "no, you got a PSA 4 and I delivered on that."

I opened a case with ebay and they ruled in my favor.

Maybe I'm lucky.

[Mountaineer1999]

Thanks for all the input. The crease was there when mailed I'm sure. No way this crease was created during shipping. I can hold the card different ways and the crease disappears and it is easy to hide in pictures.

I have contacted the seller and he said no refund as it is a PSA 6.

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

Thanks for all the input. The crease was there when mailed I'm sure. No way this crease was created during shipping. I can hold the card different ways and the crease disappears and it is easy to hide in pictures.

I have contacted the seller and he said no refund as it is a PSA 6.

It is a bit ambiguous at best from someone with no vested interest. As others suggested I would next pursue it with Ebay, then Paypal, then PSA (presuming a card with a crease does not fall under their PSA 6 definition). I also understand that many sellers don't accept returns on graded cards - It just doesn't seem right that you get stuck with this one.

[pokerplyr80]

Remember you have 3 options fo file not as described claims. Ebay, paypal, and your credit card company. I have never had to go past the first two in a similar situation.

[AGuinness]

I'm in the middle of dealing with a seller who initially wasn't going to ship the item because it didn't reach the price they wanted. I posted it here and in a later note to the seller, I explained how I was discussing the issue on a collecting board and that the seller should have noticed a big increase in views on the item (and when it was relisted). Then I noted how the negative feedback and bad rep would be far worse than missing out on $40 (we'll see how successful this was tomorrow, when the card - or an empty package -arrives). Perhaps your seller might respond to this kind of motivation, as he/she doesn't have a heck of a lot of feedback...

[Mountaineer1999]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

Remember you have 3 options fo file not as described claims. Ebay, paypal, and your credit card company. I have never had to go past the first two in a similar situation.

I have notified the seller I will pursue a refund through EBAY, PAYPAL and/or credit card if we cannot come to an agreement. More to follow...

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer1999

Thanks for all the input. The crease was there when mailed I'm sure. No way this crease was created during shipping. I can hold the card different ways and the crease disappears and it is easy to hide in pictures.

I have contacted the seller and he said no refund as it is a PSA 6.

I would leave negative feedback and file with Ebay. Buyers need to be aware of the seller's deceptive sales practices. Follow up with Paypal and your credit card company if necessary to get your money back. Don't get stuck with a creased card because the seller hid the fact that it was creased from you.

[Mountaineer1999]

Thanks again for all the advice guys. I was wondering would PSA grade it a 6 if the defect was in the card stock even before printing? Looking closer it appears to me to be slightly raised/ pressed. I guess I'm trying to figure out how it got a 6 in the first place, is it possible they actually missed seeing it, that is hard to fathom.