Bill Mastro's upcoming sentencing

[jmk59]

Originally Posted by poorlydrawncat

It's not a question of whether they want it back. Libraries have few resources and a lot of red tape to get through. Recovering a stolen item back isn't an easy process when you're a government-owned institution, you have a lot of bureaucracy to get through.

Only reason I take issue with it is because in the past libraries have had things stolen from them, and even when it's proven, the libraries haven't had the resources to formally request the return of the item. it's actually really sad.

True, probably. But IMO that still doesn't mean that Leon is somehow a jerk for wanting to know with some certainty that it's stolen, have a simple request for its return, and gosh maybe some time to think about it before he just tosses a mid-5-digit card in the mail.

Badgering him to commit RIGHT NOW right here in this forum to returning it forthwith, hang the proof of stolen and with no request, is really absurd. No one else would. Lord knows I certainly wouldn't.

[poorlydrawncat]

Originally Posted by jmk59

True, probably. But IMO that still doesn't mean that Leon is somehow a jerk for wanting to know with some certainty that it's stolen, have a simple request for its return, and gosh maybe some time to think about it before he just tosses a mid-5-digit card in the mail.

Badgering him to commit RIGHT NOW right here in this forum to returning it forthwith, hang the proof of stolen and with no request, is really absurd. No one else would. Lord knows I certainly wouldn't.

I wasn't asking him to commit to anything with the knowledge we have currently. I was asking him in the hypothetical situation where the NYPL confirms it's stolen but does not have the resources to formally ask for it back, whether or not he'd return it.

Honestly I think if this were about someone else, Leon would be chiming in right now saying he'd return the card if it was his and everyone else would do the same. But because it's Leon's card I think people are treating it differently, which is a bit unfair. Or maybe not, who knows really.

[japhi]

Originally Posted by jmk59

True, probably. But IMO that still doesn't mean that Leon is somehow a jerk for wanting to know with some certainty that it's stolen, have a simple request for its return, and gosh maybe some time to think about it before he just tosses a mid-5-digit card in the mail.

Badgering him to commit RIGHT NOW right here in this forum to returning it forthwith, hang the proof of stolen and with no request, is really absurd. No one else would. Lord knows I certainly wouldn't.

Amen, If this was my card I would do my due diligence as well. I don't know Leon but will assume 50K is a big number to him.

The grandstanding on this thread is a little over the top - one guy claims he would spend night and day trying to find the history of the card. My guess is that guy would sell the card private and wash his lands, like the large majority of folks on this board would do.

I also can't think of any other forum on the internet where the owner lets the members take runs at him, it's fascinating to watch.

[Jantz]

Originally Posted by japhi

The grandstanding on this thread is a little over the top - one guy claims he would spend night and day trying to find the history of the card. My guess is that guy would sell the card private and wash his lands, like the large majority of folks on this board would do.

If you have anymore guesses in the future Matt, will you at least try to make them educated guesses?

[GaryPassamonte]

This thread starts out questioning the sentence of a profligate lawbreaker and ends up berating an individual for not returning an item, not legally proven to be stolen, and finally to trust the same legal system to help him recoup his possible losses from who knows who. Yeah, sounds like a good idea. I would say this would be a time for caution, not haste.

[travrosty]

If it was Burdick's Wagner from the Met instead of this card, and otherwise the same circumstances, would we even be discussing loopholes on how to keep it?

[poorlydrawncat]

Originally Posted by travrosty

If it was Burdick's Wagner from the Met instead of this card, and otherwise the same circumstances, would we even be discussing loopholes on how to keep it?

Of course not, if it were anyone else the board would be crucifying them. Not that that's necessarily acceptable either, just pointing out the blatant double standard.

I mean looking for legal loopholes for ways Leon could keep the card? Seriously? The hypocrisy is pretty slimy.

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by poorlydrawncat

Of course not, if it were anyone else the board would be crucifying them. Not that that's acceptable either, just pointing out the blatant double standard.

I mean looking for legal loopholes for ways Leon could keep the card? Seriously? The hypocrisy is pretty slimy.

I agree, there wouldnt be any discussion on how someone could keep it, it would go back to the met, period, end of story. Working out some 'deal' is foreign to me as there is a nypl stamp on the back of the card.

[Exhibitman]

It is a conspiracy if I help him steal it. If I am presented with a situation like this and the client has a contested right to keep an item he purchased at a public auction in good faith I am not conspiring to do anything if I advise him of his rights and suggest that he put the alleged owner to the test in court.

Some other assumptions here about how the item came to Leon are just that: assumptions. Until the library and Leon sort it out, which is what's going to happen apparently since the item was pulled, all the vitriol is premature. Fun but potentially wrong.

As for "loopholes" that is such nonsense. It is either legal or not.

[jmk59]

I agree with Adam. When it's our interests that are making their way through the legal system, it's about our rights and testing contested positions in court. When it's someone else's interests making their way through the legal system, now it's seeking loopholes.

People go to court every day for trivial items. When it comes to 10's of thousands of dollars, those who think ownership should simply be surrendered are largely those who don't own the item.

It likely won't get to that, but if Leon (or NYPL, for that matter) end up using the legal system to sort out ownership, there's no wrong in that.

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by poorlydrawncat

Of course not, if it were anyone else the board would be crucifying them. Not that that's acceptable either, just pointing out the blatant double standard.

I mean looking for legal loopholes for ways Leon could keep the card? Seriously? The hypocrisy is pretty slimy.

I agree with this. Take this same set of circumstances and each and every comment made then replace Leon with....Dan McKee, Jeff Lichtman anyone for that matter including myself and that would be a good time to be in the pitchforks and torches business. Might even make a sale or two Leon himself.

[danmckee]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

I agree with this. Take this same set of circumstances and each and every comment made then replace Leon with....Dan McKee, Jeff Lichtman anyone for that matter including myself and that would be a good time to be in the pitchforks and torches business. Might even make a sale or two Leon himself.

You just sent a chill down my spine Wonka! Jeff is much tougher than me, let him take the brunt of it.