Biggest Jerks in the HOF

[ooo-ribay]

I'm hoping my favorite jerk, Barry Bonds, gets in....he deserves it, steroids and all....an incredible talent.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay

I'm hoping my favorite jerk, Barry Bonds, gets in....he deserves it, steroids and all....an incredible talent.

Agreed. He may be a jerk, but he would be in good company.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay

I'm hoping my favorite jerk, Barry Bonds, gets in....he deserves it, steroids and all....an incredible talent.

I agree. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Nice Guys. People have found ways to cheat for years, I don't like it but it's part of the game.

[packs]

Not in the same way he did it. The guy was motivated by jealousy and insecurity. He should never be elected to the HOF. His legacy is manufactured.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Originally Posted by packs

Not in the same way he did it. The guy was motivated by jealousy and insecurity. He should never be elected to the HOF. His legacy is manufactured.

It is interesting to hear your point of view. I know a number of people who hold it against Bonds that he was a great player without the PEDs. Personally, I view all PED users the same. They are cheats - but it was part of the game back then.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by packs

Not in the same way he did it. The guy was motivated by jealousy and insecurity. He should never be elected to the HOF. His legacy is manufactured.

Other PED users will get in or may already be in. The difference is that they didn't have a Federal Agent with a hard-on for them and/or a newspaper bankrolling a couple of investigative reporters for years. I've heard it estimated the Feds spent $50M going after Bonds. Bud Selig allowed Bonds' legacy to develop as it did.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by packs

Not in the same way he did it. The guy was motivated by jealousy and insecurity. He should never be elected to the HOF. His legacy is manufactured.

So because Bonds modified his body instead of the baseball like Gaylord Perry, Bonds is worse?

Edited to add: I am not saying cheating is ok, but to call what Bonds (and McGwire, Canseco, Sosa... and probably 50% of players through the 90s) worse is ridiculous.

[packs]

The motivation is worse and that is what makes Bonds (and players like him) different in my opinion. Same goes for Roger Clemens. They weren't motivated by trying to win (like Perry). They cheated to obtain stats that they never would have reached otherwise. Whether that be to make more money or manufacture a legacy, it doesn't matter. Gaylord Perry throwing spit balls was about giving his team a chance to win the game. I highly doubt he was out there throwing spitters thinking he had to make it to 300 wins.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by packs

The motivation is worse and that is what makes Bonds (and players like him) different in my opinion. Same goes for Roger Clemens. They weren't motivated by trying to win (like Perry). They cheated to obtain stats that they never would have reached otherwise. Whether that be to make more money or manufacture a legacy, it doesn't matter. Gaylord Perry throwing spit balls was about giving his team a chance to win the game. I highly doubt he was out there throwing spitters thinking he had to make it to 300 wins.

...you doubt it based on what? Also how is it worse than Mickey Mantle's use of steroids?

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by packs

The motivation is worse and that is what makes Bonds (and players like him) different in my opinion. Same goes for Roger Clemens. They weren't motivated by trying to win (like Perry). They cheated to obtain stats that they never would have reached otherwise. Whether that be to make more money or manufacture a legacy, it doesn't matter. Gaylord Perry throwing spit balls was about giving his team a chance to win the game. I highly doubt he was out there throwing spitters thinking he had to make it to 300 wins.

So, cheating is ok as long as you do it for the team?

[packs]

I never said anything was ok. All I said was the motivations were different and to me one is worse than the other. I'm not excusing anyone's behavior.