Huggins and Scott Auction bid increments good for buyers, bad for consigners

[Kenmarks]

I was just looking over the current Huggins and Scott auction. They have some really great items!! I was noticing some listings with lots of bids and was surprised by how low the current high price with so many bids. Seemed to me the bid should be higher with so much activity.

Just to pick out one lot as an example see:

1914 T222 Fatima Cigarettes Grover Alexander Rookie - SGC 2 Good

The starting bid was $250 and after 22 bids the current high bid as I write this is $775. Most auctions have a 10% bid increment, which if my math is correct would have the current high bid at $1850 not $775, a difference of $1075!!

As a consignor I would not be happy with this. However I looked at the H&S rules and it clearly states the increments as

$50-$249 increment of $10
$250-$999 increment of $25
$1000-$9,999 increment of $100

Using their increments the high bid of $775 after 22 bids is correct. I assume the thinking is to get more people to bid. And I understand that if the increments were to be 10% some of the bidders may not have bid which would bring down the $1850 figure above. However I have to believe the bids would be higher than the current bid. Just my take.

Curious if the increments H&S uses would cause pause for consignors? Have any of you who have consigned in the past known this? If so how did it work out for you? Were you pleased? Did your item go for less, what you expected or more?

If you were looking to consign to an auction house would this knowledge sway you not to consign or encourage you to consign with H&S?

Maybe I am forgetting/missing something. I would be interested in others thoughts.

As a footnote, I am not a consignor in this auction.

[egbeachley]

OMG. The sales price is based on what a bidder is willing to pay, not the number of bids.

[Casey2296]

Increments don't matter, astute collectors have known about thrH&S offerings for weeks, those cards are going to find market price no matter what.

[rjackson44]

Don’t co-sign

[Fred]

I guess you can look at this the other way too (good for consignors and bad for bidders).

The bad news for bidders is that with the smaller bid increments comes a plethora of bidders during the extended bidding session. This is bad for the bidder because that puts more potential bidders in the extended bidding session when the real bidding takes place.

[x2drich2000]

I think your assumption that 10% bid increments is the standard is flawed. Yes there are a few AH's that use the 10% increment, but a lot use a flat bid increment at different intervals such as REA, LOTG, H&S, and Goldin. Honestly, I would be less inclined to consign to an AH with a 10% increase as the variance between bids makes it so that a lot can easily be undervalued at one bid, but the next bid is significantly overvalued. I know with AH's that have the 10% increment I will place bids early to get the sweet spot bid that is undervalued.

[Stampsfan]

Originally Posted by x2drich2000

I think your assumption that 10% bid increments is the standard is flawed. Yes there are a few AH's that use the 10% increment, but a lot use a flat bid increment at different intervals such as REA, LOTG, H&S, and Goldin. Honestly, I would be less inclined to consign to an AH with a 10% increase as the variance between bids makes it so that a lot can easily be undervalued at one bid, but the next bid is significantly overvalued. I know with AH's that have the 10% increment I will place bids early to get the sweet spot bid that is undervalued.

Originally Posted by BobC

The OP started this same thread, with the exact same opening post, in the post-war up to 1980 forum. Check it out as I believe the thinking over there is that smaller bid increments are likely better for consignors in the long run, not worse.

+1

Could not agree more with this. 10% increments leave too large a gap between bids. There can indeed be a "sweet spot" where the low bid is too low and the high bid is too high. IMO consignors lose.

[timzcardz]

Originally Posted by Kenmarks

Curious if the increments H&S uses would cause pause for consignors?

Exactly!

That’s why no one uses them anymore.

[bounce]

Um...there's still 4.5 days to go in this auction. I don't think any of the prices right now will matter much come the final day.

Seems to me the final price is really the only one that matters.

[Republicaninmass]

Interesting take on people's mentality. I used to bid my max bid first when the auction opened so I didnt have to beat myself by someone else's 10%

[painthistorian]

They always do well and they are honest auction house. Not only are they a great auction house, but they get huge action from collectors and dealers. Sorry to say but that post really does not reflect even close to the years of quality results they produce. I wish more auction houses used their model!

[Orioles1954]

Originally Posted by painthistorian

They always do well and they are honest auction house. Not only are they a great auction house, but they get huge action from collectors and dealers. Sorry to say but that post really does not reflect even close to the years of quality results they produce. I wish more auction houses used their model!

Thank You!

[Orioles1954]

Originally Posted by Kenmarks

I was just looking over the current Huggins and Scott auction. They have some really great items!! I was noticing some listings with lots of bids and was surprised by how low the current high price with so many bids. Seemed to me the bid should be higher with so much activity.

Just to pick out one lot as an example see:

1914 T222 Fatima Cigarettes Grover Alexander Rookie - SGC 2 Good

The starting bid was $250 and after 22 bids the current high bid as I write this is $775. Most auctions have a 10% bid increment, which if my math is correct would have the current high bid at $1850 not $775, a difference of $1075!!

As a consignor I would not be happy with this. However I looked at the H&S rules and it clearly states the increments as

$50-$249 increment of $10
$250-$999 increment of $25
$1000-$9,999 increment of $100

Using their increments the high bid of $775 after 22 bids is correct. I assume the thinking is to get more people to bid. And I understand that if the increments were to be 10% some of the bidders may not have bid which would bring down the $1850 figure above. However I have to believe the bids would be higher than the current bid. Just my take.

Curious if the increments H&S uses would cause pause for consignors? Have any of you who have consigned in the past known this? If so how did it work out for you? Were you pleased? Did your item go for less, what you expected or more?

If you were looking to consign to an auction house would this knowledge sway you not to consign or encourage you to consign with H&S?

Maybe I am forgetting/missing something. I would be interested in others thoughts.

As a footnote, I am not a consignor in this auction.

Ken,

About 5-6 years ago we changed our format from larger bid increments to lesser bid increments because our prices realized on larger increments was substantially lesser. It does seem counterintuitive but since we've gone to the smaller increment model our prices realized for similar items is almost universally higher. I appreciate your concern for our consignors but there has also been a dramatic increase in that regard as well...and I think all will be thrilled with the items we've held back for the August auction! With 4-1/2 days until auction close, this period is definitely "the calm before the storm" and I ask for thoughts and prayers on my behalf as I will be one of the guys manning the phones on Thursday evening.

[BobC]

The OP started this same thread, with the exact same opening post, in the post-war up to 1980 forum. Check it out as I believe the thinking over there is that smaller bid increments are likely better for consignors in the long run, not worse.

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by BobC

The OP started this same thread, with the exact same opening post, in the post-war up to 1980 forum. Check it out as I believe the thinking over there is that smaller bid increments are likely better for consignors in the long run, not worse.

I would think so. I consigned a few times with H&S and was very happy with the results. Not just $$$ but their level of customer service.