Goodwin Auction is open + Peck & Snyder Discussion

[Leon]

I have no items consigned in the Goodwin auction but as a thanks to Bill I just want to let folks know his auction is open. Goodwin Auctions is now an advertiser on Net54baseball and it's appreciated. This is one of, if not THE, best looking auction I can remember them having.

http://www.goodwinandco.com/


Also for the record, as many board members will attest to, I will be more than happy to help if there are any issues with board advertisers. I am not saying that I can always get you an answer you want but I can at least help get an answer. As recent as today I had a "thanks" for doing so. Good luck if anyone goes for anything in the aforementioned auction!!!

(I changed the title to better reflect the thread. Great discussion....)

[terjung]

A small, but really impressive auction!

[slidekellyslide]

Will be fun to watch that Tango Eggs Cobb...any guesses on a the hammer price?

[Delray Vintage]

Bill he's some terrific items particularly the Harry wright 172 and delahanty cards

[oldjudge]

The auction does have some great cards, but the Wright is not one of them. An Old Judge with a badly faded photo is nothing to get excited about, regardless of the technical grade.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

The auction does have some great cards, but the Wright is not one of them. An Old Judge with a badly faded photo is nothing to get excited about, regardless of the technical grade.

Looks like it's mis-cut at the bottom as well, or was that common for OJ's? Shouldn't that affect the grade?

[GaryPassamonte]

I've found a reference that shows Snyder joining Peck in 1868 at 105 Nassau St. It also states Peck and Snyder did not move to 126 Nassau St until 5/1/1870. If this information is accurate, the dating of the whole series could be wrong. It would seem that any P&S with a 126 Nassau St advertisement would have been issued later than 5/1/1870.

[oldjudge]

Great work!

[barrysloate]

It seems odd that Peck and Snyder would honor the 1869 Reds a year late, but could it in fact be a photograph of the 1870 team? I would need to check the roster to confirm that. Or maybe they simply issued a card in the spring of 1870 with an image of the 1869 team, similar to the way current baseball cards review the previous season. Perhaps we are beginning to solve some of the mysteries of this issue.

[oldjudge]

Barry-Perhaps the cards were advertisments to show that the store had moved locations. That would place them on spring/summer of 1870 which would make sense for a Cincinnati issue. If the Creighton has the new address then it could have been isssued either before or after the team cards, but certainly after the move.

[GaryPassamonte]

The reverse of both the black and red versions of the Reds I've seen list 126 Nassau St as P&S's address which would indicate an 1870 issue date. However, a CdV version of the 69 Reds shows 22 Ann St as the P&S address. I believe Ann St was an address used between the 105 Nassau St address and the 126 Nassau St address. If this is true the CdV versions with the P&S advertising ( and possibly the purplish ink on the reverse ) would predate the more elaborate P&S cards.
At first glance it would seem that P&S issued the CdV version first, sometime before 5/1/1870 because of the Ann St address. Probably due to the success of this promotion P&S decided to expand their scope and issue more elaborate versions of the Reds as well as the aforementioned other teams on the 1871 sales list. This makes sense bcause the Reds were at the height of their popularity in 1869/70 and the most famous team in America.
Where the Creighton card fits into this I don't know. It seems the probabilty for it being issued before the team cards is small if the back has an 126 Nassau St address. It was more than likely issued at the same time or, as Jay suggested later. The odd thing is that it isn't on the 1871 sales list. This suggests that it may have been issued later.

[barrysloate]

That would be major news if we have just confirmed that the CdV's predate the trade cards. Of course, there are several versions of the CdV. If memory serves, I recall seeing one that had an ad for Chadwick's book The Game of Baseball on the reverse. Since that was first published in 1868, might that one be even earlier than the ones with the P & S ad? We don't know. But it sounds like we are making a breakthrough right on this thread.

Hope everybody is reading this.

[oldjudge]

Article from March 5, 1894 N Y Times on the sale of part of Peck and Snyder operation to Spaulding. The article appears to state that the store has been at this location for 30 years. What does that imply? Note: follow up article is on the death of Ned Williamson.

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...DB405B8485F0D3

[triwak]

Amazing stuff, Guys! I only wish I could acquire one - any version would do nicely!!! That's the number one card on my wish list, but I'm afraid this one in Goodwin is gonna far exceed my budget.


Edited to say: Actually, I was thinking of the rather pristine example in the upcoming REA. Hmmm.... This one has possibilities?

[barrysloate]

Well that would suggest since 1864, but "30 years" could be a round number. It would be useful to look at all the different backs on the Peck & Snyders to see what address is listed, as well as any other pertinent information. Then perhaps we could create a timeline.

It is certainly possible that each of the known teams was issued to the public in the subsequent year, so that the 1870 Athletics, Mutuals and White Stocking were first made available in 1871, etc.

[GaryPassamonte]

Is there any way we could get a scan of the reverse of the 1868 Atlantics team card? Since this is the earliest image, a 126 Nassau St reverse would further enforce the idea that all P&S team cards may have been issued in the same year, with the possible exception of the P&S Reds CdVs.