Partially ripping a card opening the mail

[sportscardpete]

I think my worst nightmare happened last night... I bough a raw card online and opened the package last night, and unfortunately it happened to rip the card that was in the package! There was no top holder, bubble, tape, or even cardboard to protect the card. All that came was paper from a receipt from the purchase. I really hate making a big deal out of this, but is this enough grounds to ask for a refund? Or should I have handled opening the package more carefully? I really think that even a little protective[Card was purchased on Ebay].

To caveat, I have opened hundreds of mail packages in the last 6 years and I never broke or ruined anything. This includes raw cards as well.

[I was going to show the ripped card but it's Friday morning and I don't want anything upsetting on the board right before a weekend.. I do have photos I can send to Ebay though].

Pete

[Eggoman]

I think that you can make an issue regarding how the card was shipped - I certainly would! AND you can ask for a refund, but I suspect that you will not get one.

Good Luck!

[frankbmd]

John Daly's Guide to Opening Mail

[vintagetoppsguy]

To me, it just depends on the purchase price. If it was anything over $20, I would ask for a refund. Anything under that, I would just move on and never do business with that seller again.

[Zach Wheat]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

To me, it just depends on the purchase price. If it was anything over $20, I would ask for a refund. Anything under that, I would just move on and never do business with that seller again.

Agree with David but I also think it depends upon what you paid in shipping charges. And I would tell them why you aren't doing business with them again...so they can correct their shipping practices.

Z

[sportscardpete]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

To me, it just depends on the purchase price. If it was anything over $20, I would ask for a refund. Anything under that, I would just move on and never do business with that seller again.

$880 to be exact. Which just makes it even more upsetting because the least they can do is protect the card for the price.

[nat]

Someone sent an $880 card in the mail, with no protection at all!?!??!!! Not even a ten-cent top loader?!? Good luck getting a refund, but that's beyond unreasonable.

[Stonepony]

Originally Posted by sportscardpete

$880 to be exact. Which just makes it even more upsetting because the least they can do is protect the card for the price.

What??? Contact seller , or EBay if necessary. Absolutely get refund. Card was inappropriately packaged and was damaged

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

To me, it just depends on the purchase price. If it was anything over $20, I would ask for a refund. Anything under that, I would just move on and never do business with that seller again.

+1. I have never, ever had that experience with an ebay seller--virtually all packing has been appropriately protective and in accordance with the price.

Best of luck on the refund,

Larry

[Jantz]

Now I know what to do with all the fishing lures in my tackle box that don't catch fish.

Its not my fault they don't catch fish, its the lure's fault!

I'll take them back to the bait & tackle store and get my money back.

Went deer hunting during archery season a few years ago. Shot and missed a deer. No way could it be my fault! It had to be the bow or arrow's fault!


I can't believe this thread has gone on this long.

Wait, yes I can.

[packs]

I don't know, if the card managed to make it you without being ripped I don't really see how you could say the card was ripped because of the way it was packaged. The card is ripped because you ripped it. I could see your point if the card arrived torn.

[markf31]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't know, if the card managed to make it you without being ripped I don't really see how you could say the card wasn't packaged properly. The card is ripped because you ripped it.

I lean towards Packs on this one. I do not think a seller should be held responsible for negligence on the part of the buyer once the item arrives into the buyers possession.

[Stonepony]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't know, if the card managed to make it you without being ripped I don't really see how you could say the card was ripped because of the way it was packaged. The card is ripped because you ripped it. I could see your point if the card arrived torn.

He ripped it BECAUSE of the way it was packaged. $800 card. Surprised there is even a conversation about this.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't know, if the card managed to make it you without being ripped I don't really see how you could say the card was ripped because of the way it was packaged. The card is ripped because you ripped it. I could see your point if the card arrived torn.

If the card was in a bubble mailer and packaged as the OP described, how is he supposed to know which end to rip from? A loose card like that is going to float around/shift inside the bubble mailer. Whenever I get a card in the mail, I always feel where the card is at inside the bubble mailer (its obviously easier on graded cards because if the thickness). Once I find the card inside the bubble mailer, I open from the opposite end as to not do any damage to the card. If the card was packaged as the OP described, how was he supposed to know where to open from - he probably couldn't have felt the card inside the bubble mailer? If he was expecting a card with no protection, I'm sure he would have been more careful. But when he spends $800 on a card, he was probably expecting some kind of protection and ripping the card was the last thing on his mind.

[jhs5120]

I'm sorry, this is the absolute worst feeling.

Talk to the seller, see if you can get a partial refund.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jhs5120

Talk to the seller, demand a full refund.

I fixed it for you.

[packs]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

If the card was in a bubble mailer and packaged as the OP described, how is he supposed to know which end to rip from? A loose card like that is going to float around/shift inside the bubble mailer. Whenever I get a card in the mail, I always feel where the card is at inside the bubble mailer (its obviously easier on graded cards because if the thickness). Once I find the card inside the bubble mailer, I open from the opposite end as to not do any damage to the card. If the card was packaged as the OP described, how was he supposed to know where to open from - he probably couldn't have felt the card inside the bubble mailer? If he was expecting a card with no protection, I'm sure he would have been more careful. But when he spends $800 on a card, he was probably expecting some kind of protection and ripping the card was the last thing on his mind.

I agree with you that it should have been packed better but from what the OP said about what happened it doesn't sound like the card was damaged during shipping. It was only damaged upon the buyer trying to open the package. The seller should have done a better job packing the card out of courtesy and common sense but unless the card was damaged en route I don't see how it contributed to the card being damaged by the buyer.

[scooter729]

Ouch! And based on the only raw card to have ended in the past couple of weeks meeting the price criteria, is it appropriate to say.....

Say it Ain't So!

[sbfinley]

Originally Posted by packs

I agree with you that it should have been packed better but from what the OP said about what happened it doesn't sound like the card was damaged during shipping. It was only damaged upon the buyer trying to open the package. The seller should have done a better job packing the card out of courtesy and common sense but unless the card was damaged en route I don't see how it contributed to the card being damaged by the buyer.

You can't say the first two bold items and then state the third. The card was damaged because the seller was lazy, stupid, or both. I'm baffled that someone so blatantly stupid enough to ship a $1k card with absolutely no protection carries no fault here. The fact his item was carried and delivered by a cavalry of featherlight angels instead of the usual diamond crackers is nullified since said angels didn't hang (float, they float) outside Pete's door to warn him upon his return of the trash of a seller he was dealing with.

File a SNAD claim, get the refund, out the seller.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't see how it contributed to the card being damaged by the buyer.

Yes, it was damaged by the buyer, but if the seller would have done a better job of packaging, this wouldn't have happened. That's how it contributed to the card being damaged by the buyer. It still falls back on the seller. His lack of properly packaging the card led to the card being ripped.

Let me approach this from another angle. Let's say you purchase a frozen food product that must be refrigerated (or kept cold) and have it delivered via USPS. The seller fails to pack the product with proper packing materials that keep it cold. Is it your fault that the item arrives ruined because the seller didn't do his job? Of course not. The same thing applies here. The card was ripped because the seller didn't package it properly. Period.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by sportscardpete

I think my worst nightmare happened last night... I bough a raw card online and opened the package last night, and unfortunately it happened to rip the card that was in the package! There was no top holder, bubble, tape, or even cardboard to protect the card. All that came was paper from a receipt from the purchase. I really hate making a big deal out of this, but is this enough grounds to ask for a refund? Or should I have handled opening the package more carefully? I really think that even a little protective[Card was purchased on Ebay].

Pete

Are you saying the card wasn't even in any kind of a holder? No sleeve or card saver? If so my opinion is that is very irresponsible on the part of the seller. I would file a claim and let ebay and paypal sort it out. I would also leave negative feedback describing the manner in which the card was shipped and obviously never do businesses with the seller again.

I would expect even a $100 raw card to be in some kind of a holder between two pieces of card board and either bubble wrapped or in a padded envelope.

[sportscardpete]

Thank you all for your feedback! I tried to contact the seller directly but he mentioned that he's positive it was in a hard protective holder (there was none - I am not strong enough to rip a hard protective holder even if I tried sadly).

I will be sending this to ebay to resolve directly and can keep you all posted.

[nameless]

I do not think you'll have a problem. This happened to me once. I paid over $300 for an item and it came shipped just as yours did. When I opened it I tore it. I should have probably kept it because I am yet to see another example but I did report the issue and sent it back. Paypal refunded me right after I gave them the return shipping details. I'd be surprised if you run into any issues getting your refund. Good luck with this.

[trdcrdkid]

Originally Posted by sportscardpete

Thank you all for your feedback! I tried to contact the seller directly but he mentioned that he's positive it was in a hard protective holder (there was none - I am not strong enough to rip a hard protective holder even if I tried sadly).

I will be sending this to ebay to resolve directly and can keep you all posted.

My guess is that the seller intended to put it in a hard protective holder, and thinks he did, but he spaced out when packing it and just stuck the card in the envelope (I assume a bubble mailer?) without one. I hope you get a refund, or at least some kind of restitution, because the seller clearly screwed up, even if it was technically you who tore the card.

[Rookiemonster]

I had a issue earlier in the year. I got a card in a bubble mailer and it was between two pieces of cardboard that was taped. So I opened the mailer and went to rip the cardboard open. Guess what? No top loader, penny sleeve etc.just the card.luckly I noticed it was like just before I bent the crap out of it.
It was also stuck to some of the blue tape that was put on the cardboard.


I left the seller natural feed and wrote in why. Since nothing went wrong I did not leave a neg. he promptly writes me a all cap message asking why. I told him to read what I wrote in the feed back and that he was lucky I didn't go full neg on his candy a$$.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Rookiemonster

I left the seller natural feed and wrote in why.

Is that anything like a neutral feedback?

[prestigecollectibles]

Every card I ship is in a holder and sent in a box like this. If I sent a $800 card it would be with signature confirmation packed securely, there are no excuses for what that seller did.

[7nohitter]

Originally Posted by prestigecollectibles

Every card I ship is in a holder and sent in a box like this. If I sent a $800 card it would be with signature confirmation packed securely, there are no excuses for what that seller did.

Completely agree with Robert here. For many people, $800 is a great amount of money. I would be blind with rage if I received a card, unprotected, as the OP did.

[mrmopar]

I didn't read any of the replies yet, but I shared something similar to this on another board and the overwhelming response was that it was mostly my fault. Considering how the shipper packaged my item, I disagreed, but I was not fishing for excuses or sympathy, merely looking for how others felt.

That said, I think that any decent seller should package an item that should prevent damage in most normal circumstances during shipping and that includes stuffing something into the smallest possible envelope that it will fit in, taping the living crap out of it and then basically forcing the buyer to cut it open!

Anything shipped loose in a mailer w/o a semi rigid sleeve (at a MINIMUM) is negligent, especially when condition matters. It also doesn't cost much or anything to team bag a single card or tape the top of a holder to prevent an item from sliding out.

If anyone cares for comparison, my item was an 8x10 brochure type item that was mailed "loose" in a thin padded mailer. It had absolutely no room to move, because the mailer was just large enough to fit the item tightly. I think it may have even been slightly taller than the mailer inner edge, so that the flap needed to be folded oddly to close it, but I can't remember now. I tore across the upper 1/2 or so of corner of the envelope, not expecting my item to fill that area that is normally empty in 98% of the packages I receive. I tore a 1/4" x 1' strip off the corner of the item. It was low dollar, but was a Garvey item I needed.

I take partial responsibility for my actions, as I could have opened it up several different ways, but had the seller given any amount of thought into shipping this item "correctly", the damage I inflicted would never have had a chance to occur.

[LuckyLarry]

Yesterdays mail included an eBay win for me. An off center 1961 Fleer basketball card #66 Jerry West In Action, the last card in the set. Well the seller must be an attorney because he used an envelope embossed with his firms name as the return address

Before I opened the envelope of course I thought "uh-oh" what the heck is this?

Seller only charged me $1 to ship, and the card arrived safely, and snugged in a Card Saver I. So I left positive feedback with this comment:

"I thought I was being "sued" when I got the envelope"

He just replied:

", that ensures priority delivery"

Larry

[the 'stache]

From Pete's wording, he "ripped the package open". I don't see anywhere that he specified the packaging, so I have to assume this is a bubble mailer?

First off, why the hell is a $900 card being shipped in a bubble mailer? For just a second, ignore what the card was placed in (top loader, card saver, etc). Common sense, alone, should mandate that a card with that value should be shipped in a box, and insured. That's on the seller.

Yes, Pete probably should have been a little more careful opening the package-I've received hundreds of cards in bubble mailers. It's fairly easy to squeeze the sizes, and, the card falling to the bottom, carefully cutting along the top seam to open it. Ripping a mailer open just leaves too much up to chance. But there's no way I can place the blame on Pete for the card being ripped in half. Nobody in their right mind would assume that a card of that value would have no protection at all.

The seller's negligence in packaging the card is directly responsible for the damage to the card. If it somehow arrived undamaged prior to opening, that's a miracle. Regardless, the buyer has a reasonable expectation that the card will arrive, and be extracted from the packaging, in the condition described in the auction.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

This is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard of. An $880 card shipped in not so much as a penny sleeve? Even if you didn't know cards, sometimes you get people selling dead people's stuff, if ANYTHING sold for $880 you would think they'd package it securely.

It's going to be a tough row to hoe as you technically did the damage, but fact of the matter is the damage shouldn't have been possible!

Good Luck.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

but fact of the matter is the damage shouldn't have been possible!

Yup. I keep repeating it: It's pretty hard to rip a card that's in a top loader, sandwiched between two pieces of cardboard inside a bubble mailer.

The new guy gets it when some of the other board members (that have been here for a while) don't.

Welcome to the boards BTW.

[Bpm0014]

Can we get a picture of the ripped card already!?!?

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Well like I said it's a tough case, there's blame to each party. Just not sure how ebay or paypal is going to come down on this one.

Thanks for the welcome!

[Mdmtx]

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

Now you are getting it Mark. Nothing is your fault even if you done it, good luck on the lawsuits.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

I just pulled up to Starbucks and ordered a large coffee. About 3 blocks away, I hit a pot hole and spilled it all over myself. Come to find out, the lid wasn't on good. Help me out here, Mark. My fault for ordering the coffee to begin with? My fault for hitting the pothole? My cars fault because the shocks are bad and shouldn't have caused such a big jolt? The girl at Starbuck's fault for not putting the lid on good to begin with?

Oh, and next time wear some shoes, Mark. Shoes are meant to protect your toes - kind of like a top loader and cardboard are meant to protect a card.