Survey: Did Your Conroy Lose Its Stripes?

[sreader3]

Maybe I'm "old school," but I would sure like to get back to the good old days of Net 54 (circa 2006-2009), where there was serious T206 research and discovery going on here. In the interest of rekindling that renaissance spirit, I'm offering up a little known tidbit.

Conroy (Fielding) is a pretty tough subject to start with. But an even greater challenge is to find an example where there are no stripes on Wid's hat. To date, all examples that I have seen have stripes except for a few late production copies with the SC350/30 back.

So let's take a two-part survey: (a) What back does your Conroy (Fielding) have and (b) did Wid lose his stripes (or not)?

SURVEY RESULTS (Updated: 3/2/13)

Back . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Stripes . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . No Stripes
Piedmont 150 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . .
Sovereign 150 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . .
Sweet Cap 150/25 . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . .
Sweet Cap 150/30 . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . .
Piedmont 350 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 . . .
Sweet Cap 350/25 . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . .
Sweet Cap 350/30 . . . . . . . . . . . . 0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 . . .

[atx840]

Neat, this one just sold for $20. SC350/30

[GoldenAge50s]

My Wid has a lid & his lid has it's stripes & his stripes are on a Pid 150.

[sreader3]

Originally Posted by GoldenAge50s

My Wid has a lid & his lid has it's stripes & his stripes are on a Pid 150.

Well put. Thx.

[Runscott]

Scott, I'm one of the esoteric guys, and I've responded to several of your posts like this, and not once gotten a response.

I figured it was part of that deplorable 'T206 faction' thing, and I was on whatever side you weren't. Although, I still haven't figured out what 'side' people thought I was on.

[deadballfreaK]

Piedmont 150 with stripes.

[sreader3]

Hi Scott, I have read a bunch of your Net54 posts and enjoyed your insights. Sometimes I log-off after posting (not as an OP) and don't respond. But if I start a thread I always follow-up. Any input on Conroy (Fielding)? Scot

[sreader3]

Scott,
My only "faction" includes those who want to improve the T206 knowledge base (which I know from reading your posts you do). I have never meant to offend you. Any error on my part is one of omission--not commission. And I have two kids at home, which limits my time on the site.
Scot

Edited to add: Please feel free to email me at sarpc at qwestoffice dot net to discuss any topic T206.

[Jantz]

All I can add is that the missing stripes is interesting.

I don't own a Conroy yet, so I'm no help with the survey at this time.


Jantz

[Craig M]

Scot or is it Scott?

It appears your name has an error!

I love what you're doing and sure would like to know your theory why CONROY has two different caps. I believe the card without the black stripes is harder to find.

I have both; the card with the stripes is a SC150 #25 and the one without stripes that I have attached is a P350.

I look forward to hear your theory.

Craig

[sreader3]

I can't imagine any motive to drop the stripes in 350. Probably just a print anomaly--about which I have no particular insight. Just another T206 quirk.

[GoldenAge50s]

---is this:

From 1903 thru 1908 Wid was a NY Highlander. He started the 1909 season w/ Washington.

The picture used as basis for his T206 was a NY picture so his cap had stripes. By the time the 350 series was being produced they realized as a Washinton player he should have a cap w/ no stripes, so they simply brushed them out. Simple as that, no?

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by GoldenAge50s

---is this:

From 1903 thru 1908 Wid was a NY Highlander. He started the 1909 season w/ Washington.

The picture used as basis for his T206 was a NY picture so his cap had stripes. By the time the 350 series was being produced they realized as a Washinton player he should have a cap w/ no stripes, so they simply brushed them out. Simple as that, no?

Wow !! Nice Fred, interesting theory.

I am also lacking a Conroy so cannot participate in the survey.

Sincerely, Clayton

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by sreader3

Hi Scott, I have read a bunch of your Net54 posts and enjoyed your insights. Sometimes I log-off after posting (not as an OP) and don't respond. But if I start a thread I always follow-up. Any input on Conroy (Fielding)? Scot

I think I got thin-skinned during that period about 1.5 years ago. It was difficult to make out what was going on.

No, I'm kind of surprised that I never noticed a 'no stripes' version before. I'll have to go back and check my old images.

[deadballfreaK]

Originally Posted by Craig M

Scot or is it Scott?

It appears your name has an error!

I love what you're doing and sure would like to know your theory why CONROY has two different caps. I believe the card without the black stripes is harder to find.

I have both; the card with the stripes is a SC150 #25 and the one without stripes that I have attached is a P350.

I look forward to hear your theory.

Craig

I have no idea about stripes and no stripes. What I noticed was the W written in the upper border. I've had half a dozen cards with that. Sold them all I think, but I remember a couple of them were Washington players for sure. Never occured to me that W meant Washington.

[bunst]

My Piedmont 350 has stripes

[brianp-beme]

Always willing to help when it comes to research...I have a Piedmont 150 and and a Sweet Caporal 150 factory 30, and they have both earned their stripes.

Brian

[Abravefan11]

Hi Scot -

I believe the Old Mill Conroy cards don't have stripes. I have seen two but don't own one. Maybe a board member can confirm this.

The Piedmont 350 is a good example of how there were multiple printings of Piedmont 350 cards. Those with the stripes were printed in the early part of the 350 Series and those without in the later part.

[steve B]

SC 350 F25 no stripes.

It looks like this is another one that was reworked between 150 and 350.

It's much more extensive than just the hat stripes. The later version also lost the border between the left side of the arm and the green of the field and the black edge at the top of the shoulder.

Steve B

[sreader3]

Survey results added to OP.

The split so far does seem to be a function of print timing: stripes for most of the print run and no stripes at the tail-end.

The theory offered that ALC/ATC deliberately removed the stripes in response to Conroy's team change from New York to Washington is very interesting, although if that is true one has to wonder why the stripes returned to Conroy's cap in the later issued 350/460 "With Bat" card.

Thanks to all who have participated.

[sreader3]

Nice catch about the missing black edges. I would be interested to hear from printing experts whether they think these changes are the result of intentional removal or just a print fluke.

[frankbmd]

Two Wids both striped, P150 & P350

[steve B]

Originally Posted by sreader3

Nice catch about the missing black edges. I would be interested to hear from printing experts whether they think these changes are the result of intentional removal or just a print fluke.

If it was just one card without them I'd say it was just underinked. And the scans I've seen of the no stripes and mine show other signs of the black being inked lightly or the transfers not transfering well. Like the weak lower frame line, and mine has nearly no upper line for the top of the hat. So far it looks like all the no stripes share the same lack of borders and weak lower frames, so I'm thinking those are changes made in production rather than just bad printing.

The scans aren't good enough, but there may also be a third version with a narrower line between the arm and field.
Other maybe differences are possibly more blue in the right side of the lower arm, and a small difference in the green just below the knee at the right border. Mine has both of those. The blue I'm almost sure is a difference, the green below the knee not so sure.

While looking at the Conroys on Ebay I spotted a few other small differences. One might be just a mistake but seems consistent, the other looks like an intentional repair. All on the with stripes version.
The first is a gap in the border near the upper right corner.
The second is what looks like a manually repaired lower border, although I didn't see a second one or one with a lower border gap in that spot.

The 350s with stripes are interesting. I think they might indicate continuous production, or are from sheets leftover from the 150 printings that later got used up when 350 began. So technically wrongbacks.

I'll have to get a stripes Conroy to compare them up close.

Steve B

[Drew]

Hi Scot
P150 stripes
SC 350 25 no stripes
drew

[willworkforT206]

Scot,

Interesting observation.

I have a Sovereign 150. It has the stripes.

Steve

[sreader3]

Final survey update in original post.

Thanks to all who participated.

[spec]

Sorry to be tardy with this. I have 3 Conroy fielding T206s, all with stripes on cap. Two Sweet Caporal 150s (both Factory 30) and 1 Piedmont 150 (Factory 25).