T204 TTT Population Info

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Posted By: Anonymous

For those of you interested, a gentleman had a large lot of very nice T204's authenticated this weekend. Approximately 23 (i don't remember if it was 22, 23, or 24) of the cards had TTT backs. Just fyi. They are not being circulated or sold anytime soon.

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Posted By: Mark T

Are they being graded by SGC or PSA?

I know there are certain players to have the TTT back. Do you know if there are any new finds in that lot with players not previously known to have that back. thanks

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Posted By: Anonymous

I'll look through my notes that i joted down. I'm not familiar with the set enough to know "new" finds, but if you want to email me a list of players with known backs, i'll let you know if i can confirm any new additions. (shoelessjoe@blacksoxfan.com)

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Posted By: Peter Thomas

I would be very interested in any information on the players identifications. As many of you know Scott Brockelman and I have been speculating on the numbers and a few years ago I pooled the board and we identified 2 additional players that Scott and I did not have or know of by actual observation. All of the square border cards, Anderson, Bancroft, Bransfield, Burkett, Dineen & Moran have TTT backs. In addition the following cards are Known with TTT backs, J. Ball, Beebe, Brown, Burchell, Chance, Cheech, Coakley, J. Collins, Criger, Donahue, Donlin, Donovan, Dorner, Ferris, Fromme, Gessler, Griffith, Hartzell, Hemphill, Hobitzel, Howell, Huggins, Johnson, Jones, Karger, Lord, Lush, McAleer, McConnell, McIntyre, McLean, Murname, O'Leary, Pelty, Powell, Schaefer, Schlei, Schulte, Sebring, Stahl, Tenny, Wagner, Wallace.

This is a total of 49 different. Between Scott and I we have 40 different and we know of from personal observation and input from two board members an additional 9 players. Any additional information would be welcome. I feel that there are either 55 or 66 possible TTT's. But feel that 55 is far more likely. Scott thinks that all 121 players might be possible with TTT backs. Information from a new group of more than 20 TTT's would really help.

Peter

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Posted By: leon

Peter will be adding one more (already known one) to his collection as we did a trade at the National....Peter- please send me your shipping address to my email....and I still owe you a beer but will have to catch you at the next National...It was great seeing ya'll again....best regards

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Posted By: Anonymous

I just looked through my notes and i "think" there were two new ones, but seeing as I am not very familiar with the details, I'm not sure i'm reading my notes correctly. I'll try and see if i can find the guys contact info.

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Posted By: Peter Thomas

I would expect that a group of 23 TTT's would yield 2 to 3 new cards if there are 55 TTT cards - 2.51 to be exact.

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Posted By: scott brockelman

they will be on the pop report if they were graded by SGC and then we can find out who was graded, if they went to PSA we will never know,.

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Posted By: Anonymous

PSA handled them. I'll post what I know when i get home.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Confirmed TTT Backs...i didn't write down a full list, only stuff that I found eye catching....
E. Collins, Plank, Tinker, Bender, Kahoe (just thought it was a cool name).

They were all in really great condition. I'd say EX or better. As i haven't handled a ton of these, I can't say if they're going to come back 7s or 5s or what. Happy to answer any other questions.

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Posted By: Peter Thomas

Ted sent me an email making sure I had seen his post, which I had. The following was my reply to Ted.

"Hi Ted,

Thanks, I did see the post on the board. Those 5 new TTT back players brings the known total to 54. I think that pretty much eliminates 55 as the likely numbers of TTT backs. If 66 are possible then from a group of 23 I would expect 5.5 new cards which fits your observation. This actually fits my theory that the t204's were printed in 2 sheets of 66 cards (6 by 11). 1 sheet would have 66 players and the other sheet 55 players with 11 of the players double printed. Scott thinks that there was 1 sheet of 121. Mastro tells me that the only known sheet had about 80 cards before it was cut about 10 years years ago. He did not see the sheet. So the mystery is not solved but all new information helps - thanks again. Peter"

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Posted By: BlackSoxFan

Hey Peter,
Just out of curiosity, why would 54 known eliminate 55 total?

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Posted By: Peter Thomas

It would not eliminate the possibility that there are a total of only 55 players with TTT backs, but probability analysis would make it extremely unlikely (about 1%). Among the cards on currently on ebay is 1 more player not known by Scott or me making the number 55 (if the other 5 are confirmed). So I think it is very likely that a sheet with 66 cards was printed with TTT backs.

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Posted By: BlackSoxFan

Yeah, I kinda thought that was your rationale, but if there "are 55", then they could all be found eventually. Looks like the other guy who had a tone of TTTs graded by PSA at the show is jettisoning them ASAP

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Posted By: Mark T

again on ebay and a bunch are TTT.

In my opinion, the new TTT cards in PSA holders should not have been listed all at once. I know they will go for big money but don't you think he should have listed 2 or 3 to start with.


I don't know the seller and have never dealt with him before. I assume he has more since there were 24 total cards graded at the Nationals i think. I know a few guys will be bidding on them from Net 54 and i hope you guys win them.

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Posted By: Mark T

PSA is listing TTT backs in the Pop reports. I believe this started when the guy at the Nationals had PSA grade them. Of course the pop is low because there are many out there that were slabbed over the years as just Ramly cards.