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Reload this Page 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
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  #1  
Old 09-25-2008, 01:27 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: James Feagin

Hello there,

Has anyone ever seen the following 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser? I never have and it's obviously different than the regularly issued SP. There are staple marks on the top and bottom.




Thanks,

James

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  #2  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:07 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Bobby Binder

Just to show the standard one..




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  #3  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:07 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Josh Krause

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Old 09-25-2008, 02:07 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Paul

Do you have the card in hand? If not, could it be a photoshop job?

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  #5  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:14 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Bobby Binder

I am sure our Leaf experts Ted or Anthony will know.

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  #6  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:31 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: barrysloate

Don't let Ted Z. catch you guys calling these 1948 Leafs. They're 1949 Leafs, and the labels are incorrect.

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  #7  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:36 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

James

Bring this card to Reading....I want to see it close up.

1949 Leaf 2nd Series cards were faked back about 14 years ago.

Thanks,

TED Z

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  #8  
Old 09-25-2008, 02:43 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Anthony N.

that would be unbelievable if a new variation turned up at this point, but since it looks like it was graded some time ago it's odd that it never surfaced before.

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  #9  
Old 09-25-2008, 03:05 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Paul

Just for fun, assuming it's real, what are everyone's guesses as to value? Would the registry nuts "need" to have it?

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  #10  
Old 09-25-2008, 03:15 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Bryan Long

I have not collected this set in a long time, but like everyone else as said, assuming it is real, this is a HUGE find is it not? I to wonder how it got by this long being graded - unless those at PSA at the time didn't have any idea that it looked any different that the normal card. Which is what my guess is.

.

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  #11  
Old 09-25-2008, 03:30 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: James Feagin

Howdy,

I believe the card will be brought to Reading.

James

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  #12  
Old 09-25-2008, 03:58 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: barrysloate

Companies such as Leaf typically kept samples of their cards in notebooks, either glued or stapled. Assuming it's real, could this have been an unissued pose that was removed their archive?

It doesn't really have the look of a 2nd series card, however; the colors are bold and the registry is near perfect.

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  #13  
Old 09-25-2008, 05:10 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Anthony N.

<<
Just for fun, assuming it's real, what are everyone's guesses as to value? Would the registry nuts "need" to have it?>>

There are relatively few sets on the registry for '49 Leaf. I think the set collector nuts, registry or not, would need to have it.

File copy sounds plausible, assuming it's real. Can you imagine a different pose of Paige? Or if a 3rd series, with the rest of the missing numbers, was found?

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  #14  
Old 09-25-2008, 05:42 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: DD

I purchased about a dozen Fleer produced uncatalogued comic books in a Mastro auction awhile ago. CGC (grading company) said they would grade the Captain Marvel shown below, for sure, but not the others. All were produced by Fleer, but never distributed.

Uncatalogued comic books, from the 20th century anyways, are tough to come by; Overstreet has been a cataloguing force since the early 70's, and has constantly expanded it's coverage, and definition of what gets catalogued.

Topps Vault has unleashed a slew of test and prototype cards, including for major distributed sets. Fleer archives are known to survive in bits and pieces, and I specifically remember them opening a lot of what they had left to auction in the mid 90's.

Point being, uncatalogued examples are out there. I'll bet it's real.

Here's some comics, as an example:



CGC said they do not grade newspaper comics (understandably so), but I could not convince them the Playmate comic is not from a Sunday paper, but a separate issue.

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  #15  
Old 09-25-2008, 06:34 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Pennsylvania Ted

JAMES F

Here is the back of the known 1949 Leaf Newhouser......it is different than the one you have.

Also, none of the 49 cards in the 2nd (SP) series of this set have the "split-color" background
design.

This color design is only found in the 1st series of 1949 Leaf's.

You have a very strange card; and, the fact that it is graded does not guarantee that it is not
a fake.
Perhaps, it might be some kind of "proof" card......however, after having seen several 1000's of
these Leaf's since 1949, I think I would have seen this card by now ! ?

I'm at Booth #308 in Reading this weekend, I'd like to get a real close up look at it.





TED Z



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Old 09-25-2008, 08:45 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: James Feagin

Ted,

I won't be attending the show as I have two small children to attend to and I am sick. However, if you meet up with Bill Huggins or see our booth, we will have it at the show.

Until then....

James

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  #17  
Old 09-25-2008, 11:36 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: DD

Seems like the difference in text just reinforces it is some kind of mockup or prototype. If it is fake, it's ingenious. Can't wait to hear the opinions of whoever sees it live.

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  #18  
Old 09-26-2008, 10:21 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Marc S.

with the way the number on the flip is placed, it seems like PSA graded this in the past 2-3 months, not a long time ago.

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  #19  
Old 09-26-2008, 11:46 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Anthony N.

Marc, you're right. It had to have been graded since they went to half grades in January/February. That doesn't make me feel quite as good that they got it right, since things seem to be slipping even more lately. Still an interesting card, I hope it's legit.

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  #20  
Old 09-27-2008, 08:28 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Paul

Are there any other cards in the set that describe the player as "left handed" or "right handed"? I see that the normal Newhouser just says "left", but the variation says "left handed" at the top of the card back.

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  #21  
Old 09-27-2008, 10:21 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: ROBERT ADAMS JR

PhotobucketPhotobucket Really interesting that the text is quite different .

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  #22  
Old 09-28-2008, 04:34 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: barrysloate

Can anyone show scans of the album you could send away for? I don't think I've ever seen one. Thanks.

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  #23  
Old 09-28-2008, 08:51 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Anthony N.

Barry- I don't have a scan of the album, but it's really plain- basically a black cover. Not nearly as ornate as the Cracker Jack or Goudey albums.

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  #24  
Old 09-28-2008, 09:10 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks Anthony. I guess you don't see them too often.

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  #25  
Old 09-29-2008, 07:58 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Lyman

Hi Barry. There is an image of the Leaf album in Ted Z's very comprehensive article on the Leaf set in Issue #9 of Old Cardboard magazine (p. 38). --Lyman

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  #26  
Old 09-29-2008, 08:07 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks Lyman- I'll check it out. I obviously saw it when I read the article, and just forgot.

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  #27  
Old 09-29-2008, 09:07 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Upon close observation of this card and brain-storming with Bill Huggins, Bill and I concluded that this
"mystery" card is definitely for real. My theory is that it was designed to be printed in the 1st series
of 49 cards in the 1949 Leaf BB set. I base this theory on the fact that the "split-color" background
design was only employed in the 1st series.

Furthermore, minor differences such as the wording "left-handed" (vs "left") for Newhouser's throwing
and batting is wording that is found only on (some) 1st series cards....and, not on any 2nd (SP) series
cards.

So, for unknown reasons (possibly contractual), Leaf did not include this Newhouser card in their 1st
series. But, relegated a different Newhouser pose to the 2nd series....which most of us never saw.

This was a mistake, as this "prototype" card of Newhouser is certainly more attractive than the one
they issued. And, us kids back in the Spring of 1949 would have had one of the few cards of this HOF
southpaw.


TED Z



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  #28  
Old 09-29-2008, 09:19 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

So if this card was never released to the public, how does one like this survive?

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  #29  
Old 09-29-2008, 09:58 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Most likely, some Leaf Gum (Chicago) employee, who was involved with producing these cards, took
it home with him back in 1949. And, now, this unique card has come out of the woodwork. I saying
it's "unique" because we have not seen another one in 59 years; and, I doubt if we will see another
one.

JEFF

Your old HS classmate was at the show....I'll email you.

TED Z

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  #30  
Old 09-29-2008, 11:26 AM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Anthony N.

File copy perhaps- like the '56 Bowman prototypes, or the '33 Goudey #106 Durocher. Or like Ted says, a first run that got changed and an employee grabbed it.
Makes you wonder if there are any more like this, and if Leaf planned the 2nd series at the same time as the first, which card got swapped out for Newhouser?
Peterson, Blackwell and Hudson are the only ones with this background color, but Hudson is the opposite as this one, in that the yellow is bigger on top.

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  #31  
Old 09-29-2008, 01:38 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

All together, there are 12 cards in the 1st series with the "split-color" design. There are NO "split-color" designs
in the 2nd series.

Vertical split cards......

Ewell Blackwell
Del Ennis
Sid Hudson
Jim Hegan
Kent Peterson
George Vico

Horizontal split cards......

Jake Early
Joe Gordon
Johhny Lindell
Martin Marion
Gerald Priddy
Roy Smalley



TED Z


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  #32  
Old 09-29-2008, 02:18 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Bobby Binder

Vertical...













Horizontal...












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  #33  
Old 09-29-2008, 02:32 PM
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Default 1948 Leaf #98 Hal Newhouser Pose Variation??
Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Thanx BOBBY B

I was going to scan my 12 split-color cards when I arrived home....but, you beat me to it, and saved me the effort.

TED Z

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