Quote:
Originally Posted by travrosty
Richard mentioned the rare boxing signature with no exemplars.
It was 'deemed authentic' by two companies, then the certs were pulled after people complained and called them on it. But instead of pulling the item from the auction, the auction house mentioned that although due to a lack of exemplars, these companies both feel this piece is authentic. Based on what?
The auction place still wanted to sell the item. And they kept the listing up, and sold it. No exemplars, still sold it.
Based on what? We are looking into a crystal ball now? Why were the certs issued in the first place? They didn't have exemplars. They knew they didn't have any, and this auction listing should be investigated to figure out what is going on with these authenticators.
People want answers, because if they issue certs without exemplars in this instance, what other signatures have they done the same thing, only it went through undetected? The free pass has expired.
One of these companies recently certified a James Jeffries (boxing) autograph at a sunday memorabilia show and they listed the name as 'James Jeffers' on the certificate. If you look at the sig, the last name does look like it is signed jeffers, only because that's how his signature sometimes looks to the naked eye. They had no idea who this guy's name was, they went with what they saw. It's gone beyond silly now to crazy.
But they know Babe Ruth, and don't ever question them or you are a Monday morning quarterback!!! They can't get James Jeffries, Luis Firpo, John L. Sullivan, Robert Fitzsimmons, Joe Louis, Jack Sharkey, Jack Dempsey, Jack Johnson, Battling Nelson, Sonny Liston, Muhammad Ali, Max Schmeling, or Mike Tyson correct, and those screwups were no brainers, but let's trust them with one of the most expensive autographs in the hobby because these world experts must know something we don't.
Travis Roste-boxing expert
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That Sayers thing was appalling but not surprising; big packs of whores on both sides of that table when there's money to be made. No expert is beyond question; they are human beings and prone to human errors.
I spend a lot of time and study on the autographs I want and usually try to get them on a legal document, a contract, or a check. To me those are better media for likely authenticity than some random scrap of paper. But nothing is perfect. I've been burned a few times, fortunately on cheap items that I could return.
Sometimes the forgeries are innocent and look damned good; I was very disappointed with a Marciano 1950s postally used PC that turned out to have his wife's signature and I have secretarials of La Motta and some others on vintage postmarked PCs.
Even with the truth of everything said in this thread, and given the demonstrable incompetence of the TPAs, the vast majority of the public accepts their verdicts and that makes their products fungible. I don't think that is ever going to change. It is too entrenched. After all, misgraded cards abound but PSA and SGC chug along.
Ad@m W@rsh@w