Begsu1013 A good man
 

Hi all. I don't post here much but lurk often. I would have posted on the controversial thread with the cat photo, but it was closed before I had an opportunity. Leon has made his decision and I respect it. It is his board. The photo has been around for awhile and I am not sure why Bob felt compelled to post it. A momentary lack in good taste I guess.

That being said, I have always had positive interactions with Bob. I sold him a very high value card and he was always professional. He is very knowledgeable about cards and helpful to others in my experience. I cannot speak for everyone"s dealings with the man but I can't let his integrity be questioned while he is banned and he unable to reespond or defend himself go by without giving my input on my dealings with him which have been highly positive. He did not ask me to write this and I have not spoken to him about that thread or even in the past couple months. I hope Leon finds it appropriate to give Bob a second chance if Bob decides he would like to get involved again on Net54.
David Lamont

I won't defend what Bob did. But I too have had positive interactions with him and feel he's is very knowledgable and willing to share that knowledge. I also respect Leon's decision but just wanted to chime in and hope in time Bob is able to contribute here.

What happened??

delete...

See the " Free cat to a good home" thread on page 2. Sighhhh

So what happened?

Just saw the post, I don't agree with it...People need to get a better view on animals, they are getting abused enough as it is......

Bob should not be banned and it is absurdity to see him banned. A negative direction for the board to ban people for a bad joke. I've never had anything but positive interactions with him.

Agree
 

I agree totally with both Kevin and Sean. So much cruelty is directed toward animals who have no defense yet let him learn a lesson and get a second shot on the boards.

He will probably be let back soon if he wants to come back.... As soon as I can get that disgusting picture out of my head.

And Sean B., you told me some time ago the board needed to change. Well, just like I told you then, it's not changing. It's staying the course. This wasn't a bad decision on my part (suspension, at minimum) and the direction of the board is the same direction from day 1 (of my tenure).
What Bob did was unacceptable, at least on this board, and if anyone doesn't think so then that is their opinion and I disagree. One other comment, I don't think Bob is a bad guy, don't dislike him and I trust him. That doesn't change my feelings on what he did though.

Did any of you actually read why Bob got banned? Seriously you all act like it was for one post. Leon explained he has been a pain in the ass for a long time and it was this accumulation of things and not just the sick dead cat post.

I hate banning as much as the rest but just remember it is not your sandbox we all play in.

The other things I could live with. I don't want to ban anyone, never have. But there were a few other annoyances as you mention....as his tag line antagonizing me after I was trying to help him .....but that stuff just comes with the territory and I take it in stride. The dead cat thread was ludicrous. I don't know how any sane person can defend that even as a bad joke?

I agree with a suspension and explanation for that so he understands what he did wrong, but the term ban was used. There are a lot of people on this board who are a pain in the ass, that's not appropriate for banning - especially when he ships what you buy and pays for what he buys. I am trying to be impartial here.

I don't really see the impartiality here in your statements. I'm sure this will blow over soon. The post happened to strike a cord and I don't think anyone truly thinks it's a reflection of Bob's character or integrity. It was a big goof and I'm sure he'll be back contributing to the board very soon.

The photo is in bad taste. Fine. Not appropriate for these boards. Fine. I am a cat lover with three shelter cats and don't find it funny at all. What bothers me the most is that in the cat thread it was mentioned that Bob MAY have or is being accused of selling a stolen card which I for one have a VERY hard time believing. If that kind of accusation is being made I think all the accusations should be made public and Bob should be able to defend himself. If there is no truth to the accusation than that statement raising suspicion should be rescinded. Reputation is everything in this business. Also Jason said Bob went nuts or something like that after he refused to sell him a card. Bring the details to light. Don't throw Bob under the bus, make terrible accusations without any details and then ban him so he cannot respond. That is my issue.
David Lamont

You could have quit after your very first sentence. The reason that card issue was private was because I didn't have firsthand knowledge and, if there WAS an issue, I was trying to help Bob by telling him to just deal with it quietly and quickly, as I would anyone who "might" have made a mistake or had some kind of issue. But it was private for reason. If I recall correctly, I was told the card was reported stolen but then Bob had it. Bob disputed that, the other member didn't want to get into it, so I let it go. The card was posted on the board at one time, for some reason, or I wouldn't have even discussed it at all.
Then Bob put that in his tagline to antagonize me and I was just letting it go.... (your name is by your post, thanks)

Leon, I don't know. I guess if it all seems so vague regarding this lost or stolen card why bring it up at all is what I am saying unless someone wants to press forward with hard facts. The mere appearance of impropriety can stick and tarnish reputations. I do know that Bob would not bother with trying to steal a signed golf card, but let's hear it out or say there is no truth to it. By the way Leon, thanks for creating a fantastic board. I am trying to learn all I can from so much knowledge here on pre war card experts. I collect post war basketball football hockey only at this time but I am trying to expand my collecting interests to Prewar which I don't know a lot about but trying to learn all the time. I don't post much in this section because I don't have much important to say right now.
David Lamont

THere was NO APPEARANCE TO START WITH. All messages were PMs or emails.
It was supposed to be private. There was NO appearance until BOB and YOU posted it publicly. None, nadda....get it? It was private. No ones reputation was tarnished. And I didn't say he tried to steal a card, I have no idea and wasn't there. And no, I don't think he would try to steal a card but according to the other member, as already stated, it was lost or reported stolen and then shown on the board (*as if owned). YOU are the one mentioning it and saying it publicly. I didn't create the board but you are welcome for it being here....

The first time I saw it was in the cat picture thread and it was not by me. If it was mentioned earlier I missed it. The first time I made any mention of it on this forum or anywhere was just now, in this thread, about 10 minutes ago. Apparently there has been no resolution or desire to bring charges any further so why bring it up again yesterday without anyone willing to back it up or desire to carry through on it? I only brought it up because it was previously mentioned like there may or may not be truth to it. Well if there is truth, set it free and let Bob respond or never bring it up again. That is what I am saying. From what I understand Leon you are vouching or willing to give your friend the benefit of the doubt which is fine. I would too. Same thing with Jason calling Bob "nuts" Let Bob respond if he wants. But he can't now being banned. But if the person with the lost or stolen or otherwise golf card doesn't want to take it up why bring it up again again yesterday in the cat thread?I have never mentioned it until this morning. If there is more to it lets hear it. Otherwise Bob deserves a chance to respond to a mention again yesterday about it (not by me)
David Lamont

I know nothing about the golf card but Leon did not surface it in the Cat thread, someone else brought it up first.

You are making assumptions. I said I knew the guy 15-17 yrs so yes, that was insinuating I believed him. But I didn't accuse Bob of anything, only if there was an issue it should be taken care of. IF that issue was a mistake on the other guys part, he should have cleared it up with the other guy. This was all being done privately, no reputation being supposedly tarnished.
I brought it up because members asked about it and why the suspension. Well, antagonizing me, or anyone all around the board, is one reason but not usually a very good one. I take that day in and day out and it's usually not a big deal. But that is why it was brought up. I found the old PMs, just now, and everything I have said I have verified. I am done answering questions.

Geez point taken.....can we all move on now. (Not directed at Leon)

That's cool. If Leon decides to allow Bob to come back at some point and Bob wants to defend himself that is up to Bob at this point. Otherwise there isn't much more to say unless someone wants to clarify their issue with him (aside from the cat picture) which nobody including me enjoys. Peace.
David Lamont

Here's my 10 cents, my two cents is free...

Animals get hit by cars all the time - I hate the times when I've been the one driving, and I cringe when I see an animal by the side of the road. But IMO some people are wound a little tight on the cat picture. There was no animal abuse or cruelty in the picture, merely what some (many?) believe is bad taste.

I don't begrudge those feelings at all - everyone is entitled to their beliefs. Me, I have always found humor in that picture. It's been around for a LONG time. Maybe I (and others who find similar humor) are a little twisted, and I'm okay if you think that. I like irreverent humor and humor that pokes a little fun at difficult situations or subjects. It helps lighten, at least to me, what can sometimes be a pretty tough world. And again, if that type of humor doesn't jive with you, that's cool. That said, the torches and pitchforks that came out in the other thread were juuuuuuust a little over the top. To quote the late, great Sergeant Hulka, "Lighten up, Francis".

That's easy for you to say. Try putting yourself in another man's shoes for once. The picture was in poor taste. If I have to explain to you the reasons why, then you are denser than I thought.

+1 big time....

Not going to take the bait and get into another petty back and forth with you Bobby. I said that I don't begrudge others their feelings. If I wasn't clear enough, then I apologize to you in particular and the board in general and will explain further: I definitely understand that many find that picture, and other likewise irreverent pictures, in extremely poor taste, and I understand why they do. Saying that, I found the reaction of many to be way over the top. That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it. You believe otherwise, and you likewise are entitled to your belief.

Good day, sir.

No, that is a chocolate labrador. Her name was Angie, and we had to put her down on December 30, 2015, after she suffered a stroke. She was a wonderful friend and companion, and I still miss her deeply.

She's been my avatar on CU for over 10 years.

edit: here's a better pic
http://i68.tinypic.com/wmjehf.jpg

Beautiful animal, I lost my Jack Russell about a year ago....Sorry Geordie....

Sorry to hear that, Kevin. I really am.

Making that drive to the vet is really one of the hardest things a man is tasked to do.

I agree with a suspension and explanation for that so he understands what he did wrong, but the term ban was used. There are a lot of people on this board who are a pain in the ass, that's not appropriate for banning - especially when he ships what you buy and pays for what he buys. I am trying to be impartial here.

This is a vintage baseball card forum. Even though we all use a small part of that in the B/S/T, I do not think the reason Leon banned him was due to the fact he does or doesn't conduct buying and selling appropriately. The discussion should be mostly about vintage sports cards, not stupid jokes. We can all be funny. I can post sick pictures and make jokes about Hillary Clinton all day long, but that would inappropriate for this forum and should warrant a suspension or even warning at the very least. Memberships here should not be weighed on who buys and sells and purchases banners, but those who share, read and contribute about vintage cards. Period. Post your jokes on facebook and twitter.

Jason

You are absolutely right, especially if you are in the room with him. I will never do that again...

Wow, good thing no one posted a pic of someone beating a dead horse. Either that or people on message boards hate horses.

Get over yourself Barry. You two cents are not asked for nor needed here. All you ever want to do in your life is cause strife. Let it rest. You won't win this one. Leon is a fair man, and IMHO made the right call. He (begsu) will probably be let back on if he even wants to be. Hopefully he will be more considerate next time. There are alot of animal lovers in America. Why do you think there was such an uproar when Michael Vick engaged in dog fighting? When a gorilla got killed in a zoo?

Follow your own advice, Bobby. Did I speak directly to you? Why are you trying to start more of your drama with me? I think it's you who needs to get over himself. I directed nothing at you so why are you coming here directing at me? And why is your opinion worth more than mine?

Are we in some sort of a competition? I'm not trying to win anything. As usual, you can't see the humor and purpose in irony. You just want to bait me into your drama.

I hope you are not trying to insinuate that I support any type of animal abuse because that would be absurd.

Also, I never mentioned my opinion of Leon's decision. I think Leon can speak for himself about my posts. I don't think he needs you to speak for him but Im sure it fills him with joy that he has your full support in these matters. If anyone else wanted to know, I have no problem with Leon's decision. His playground, his rules.

All of my questions to you are rhetorical. No need to answer them because I have no interest in a back and forth with you. I avoid conversation with you so I think a good suggestion would be you do the same with me. But there is no way that Im going to not post just because you wont like that Im in a thread giving my opinion. Now settle down, Fabio.

?
 

It is perfectly acceptable when a thread is titled "I popped my cherry". It can't get much more sexist than that, but everyone seems to think that is ok.

Edited to add: My wife and I have had cats for over 40 years and we presently have 3 beautiful cats. I also have 2 daughters and a granddaughter, and I am much more sensitive to thoughtless sexist comments than to jokes about cats.

Personally I agree with you on this one. I think political correctness has gone way overboard on this one but I do find it to be quite vulgar. I chose to ignore it and not read the post because not worthy of my time.

The cat post was disturbing and not funny at all. Like I said before, I am a veterinarian and know how attached people are to their pets. Both threads had authors who didn't think about their choices. No wonder our choices come down to the Donals and Hillary for president.

Moving forward, if this forum stuck to baseball cards we wouldn't run into these issues.

Some bad decisions were made but its too late to do anything about them. Let's try and move forward and use this forum for what it was intended for.

There are many people on Facebook who would love to hear about your cats, horses, dogs, wives, etc. Lets discuss cards here.:)

It will continue exactly the way it has the last 14 yrs. thanks

ps...Bob was un-suspended this morning.

See....a two day suspension is nothing. PSA suspended me for a year because some members thought it funny to call my job to try and get me fired. Talk about placing blame on the victim!! Since I was "upsetting' some of the members that were attacking me, they got rid of me instead of the ones doing the attacking! ROTFLMAO! The year has long since come and gone, but I have no desire to post on a forum whose company treats people like that.

In a nutshell, this is the best baseball card forum on the net!! To get banned from THIS forum, you really have to screw up!! Leon let's all kinds of stuff slide. People are people. Personalities are personalities. He gets that.

I just went to that cat thread for the first time and caught the gist of it. Yeah, probably was in poor taste but I guess he did make some amends by donating to the ASPCA. Personally, I think everybody is getting a bit to sensitive. I'm surprised with everybody's responses that there is any comedians still in the business cuz 90% of them have that kind of humor in their act. Bill Cosby was one of the few that did not but, then again, .....

Rob M

Packers
 

All right! A kitten wearing Green Bay Packers colors. Awesome.

If I was a Bears fan, I might be tempted to call that abuse. At the very least I would be highly offended.

I kid, of course.

I'm glad this thing played out nicely. Bob is a solid guy in the hobby and should be on this board.....

A lot of the PSA members that cause trouble have totally ruined that board. I hope to god they don't do the same over here. Welcome back Bob.

+1

As a father of two young adult daughters, I agree. Sometimes we as a society take animal rights more seriously than people rights. I was also offended by that post, but chose to ignore and move on to more information about my favorite hobby.

We have more outrage on the posting of an old photo than is really required, especially in a hobby forum.

Where is the outrage over Hande Kader? Google her if you don't know the story, and try not to throw your Cheerios up.

Bob

Around 2008 a CU member (or members) made several complaints into my work. I don't know who did it (I have my suspicions) but I know for a fact they came from CU members because that was the only online forum I belonged to and the complaints came from disgruntled customers by the names of "Conner Fette" "Gretskee" et cetera. This was during a time when a small group of members there were harassing me for offering a few counterfeit (I naively thought reprint) Gretzky rookies on the BST forums that I picked-up as a kid at the Gibralter show in Michigan sometime in 1996. A novice mistake that I have, many times, again and again, apologized for.

Fast-forward to recent times. There was a forum by the name of "Cardboard Talk" where just about anything would go. This was a place, mainly, for CU banned members to ridicule members of the collecting community. The language they would use was absolutely terrible. They took shots at people's family members and shared images off facebook pages to make fun. In all seriousness, you'd be shocked at the kind of things that took place there. The cat image Bob posted is nothing compared to what took place there. Several of these people have replied in this thread.

It was on that forum that a member gave advice on how to get a CU member banned (to get them to threaten you in a PM). Shortly thereafter a CU member did just that to Bobby which led to him getting banned.

And now I just found out that one of these members PM'd someone on this forum telling them there is a rumor that I am the one that called Bobby's work to try to get him fired. This kind of behavior is unacceptable and has no place here or on CU.

Patrick- So give specifics. You have made some accusations so who exactly are you talking about? This almost seems like elementary school, not professional like... Kevin Mize

Kevin, if it is OK with Leon, I will share names. Otherwise, I'd like to just help validate that what Bobby posted is accurate.