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-   -   Fairly Important Historical Basketball Find (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=201919)

ramram 02-19-2015 02:46 PM

Fairly Important Historical Basketball Find
 
7 Attachment(s)
I recently came across this generic early basketball image on ebay. I liked the content and also the fact that it was very early, historically, for a basketball image made obvious by the fact that it was on a cabinet card. Some research I've done yielded the following interesting information:

Attachment 179863

Circa 1897 cabinet card of Randolph “Red” Cramer of the Camden Electrics.

The Camden Electrics (later known as the Skeeters) were founding members of the very first professional basketball league. The National Basketball League (NBL) was established for the 1898/1899 season only seven years after Naismith invented the game. The league consisted of six teams: the Trenton Nationals, Millville Glassblowers, Camden Electrics, Clover Wheelman (aka Philadelphia Clover Wheelmen), Germantown Nationals and the Hancock Athletic Association. The league eventually folded in January of 1904.

The Camden team formed in 1895 under player-coach William “Billy” Morgenweck. Cramer was listed as the team president and also was their star forward. Cramer played for Camden until the 1901/1902 season when, during the season, he moved over to the rival Philadelphia Phillies team.

The cabinet card was produced by Garns & Co. of 206 Federal St. in Camden, New Jersey. One source indicates that the studio existed from 1889 – 1906 while another places it at that location from 1889 – 1897. Cabinet cards of this type were on their way to extinction by the mid 1890’s which makes this a rather rare format for a basketball image.

Attachment 179864

The 1895/1896 Camden (pre-NBL) team. Cramer is standing in the back row, second from the right. These early teams often played with seven to nine players on the court per team, which is likely the reason for the large number of players in the photo.


Attachment 179872

Enlargement of Cramer.

Attachment 179866

The 98/99 NBL team with Cramer sitting in the honor seat and holding the ball. The players appear to be wearing the same shorts and socks as Cramer has on in the cabinet photo.

Attachment 179873

Image of Cramer, sporting a mustache now, from the 1901 Philadelphia Inquirer. Note that the shorts are the same pair that he was wearing in the cabinet photo.

Attachment 179868

Interesting note - The professional teams of this early era typically played at local armories on courts of varying sizes. Fencing was often placed around the court to contain the rough play and also to keep the ball in play. Thus the term “cagers” came about to describe these early basketball players.

Some rough looking “cagers” from a circa 1920’s team. Note the fence behind them.


Attachment 179869

Runscott 02-19-2015 02:52 PM

Thanks, Rob - I enjoyed that.

D. Bergin 02-19-2015 03:10 PM

Nice catch. That's an exciting find.

RelicSports 02-19-2015 04:03 PM

I am impressed with how long he wore his shorts...the fab 5 must have stole the style from him

baseball tourist 02-19-2015 04:10 PM

Great item! Excellent research.

aelefson 02-19-2015 04:45 PM

Great find! As you know it is exceedingly difficult to find any basketball items pre 1900.

Alan

vintagesportscollector 02-19-2015 08:37 PM

Very interesting. I very much enjoyed that too. Impressive how much you were able to find.

ooo-ribay 02-19-2015 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagesportscollector (Post 1382523)
Very interesting. I very much enjoyed that too. Impressive how much you were able to find.

Agreed! I also love the dog in the team photo.....they pop up in a lot of old baseball photos, as well.

Scott Garner 02-20-2015 03:29 AM

Great research. Very cool look at early basketball history!

slidekellyslide 02-20-2015 05:28 AM

Very nice research Rob! Did you happen to get the other "in action" cabinet as well?

aquarius31 02-20-2015 05:30 AM

Fantastic research, write-up and cabinet!


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ramram 02-20-2015 07:57 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide (Post 1382579)
Very nice research Rob! Did you happen to get the other "in action" cabinet as well?

Hi Dan,

No, I miscalculated and thought the price would come down and then somebody else grabbed it. The cabinet was from another Camden photography studio on Federal Street and the guy that was selling it on ebay was adamant that it was NOT Cramer. In retrospect, I do think it was likely him. Here is the image:

Attachment 179965

slidekellyslide 02-20-2015 12:58 PM

Shame they got broken up, but maybe it will resurface someday. I do think it's the same guy. FWIW I like your pose better because of the shorts.

rsn1661 02-20-2015 01:15 PM

Nice find! I always wondered where the term cagers came from. I learned something today

jbsports33 02-20-2015 09:31 PM

Some really nice early basketball info you do not see often

Great stuff!

Jimmy

1880nonsports 02-21-2015 10:35 AM

great share
 
thanks!

Andy Sandler 02-23-2015 07:16 PM

I got the other cabinet card!
 
Hi Rob,
I got the other cabinet card. I am very excited, too, to add it to my collection.
Thanks for doing all the great research.
Regards, Andy Sandler andy@allsportsauctions.com

Vintagecatcher 02-23-2015 07:37 PM

Very cool cabinets
 
Nice research Rob!

Congrats on your cool pickup!

Patrick

Exhibitman 02-25-2015 11:03 AM

I always forget that the era of 'modern' basketball starts a lot later than the era of 'modern' baseball or football or boxing. I was really surprised when I saw this card from the 1925 Exhibit Champions set that it was a HS team:

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibit...basketball.JPG

Michael B 02-25-2015 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman (Post 1384461)
I always forget that the era of 'modern' basketball starts a lot later than the era of 'modern' baseball or football or boxing. I was really surprised when I saw this card from the 1925 Exhibit Champions set that it was a HS team:

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibit...basketball.JPG

Adam,

This is one of the Passaic High School wonder teams coached by Basketball Hall of Famer Ernest Blood. He coached them from 1915-24 with a 200-1 record and a 159 game winning streak. The person on the left looks a little like Bill Mokray, Basketball Hall of Famer who attended Passaic H.S. and would have been a junior or senior. He was the first great basketball statistician.

ramram 02-25-2015 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael B (Post 1384514)
Adam,

This is one of the Passaic High School wonder teams coached by Basketball Hall of Famer Ernest Blood. He coached them from 1915-24 with a 200-1 record and a 159 game winning streak. The person on the left looks a little like Bill Mokray, Basketball Hall of Famer who attended Passaic H.S. and would have been a junior or senior. He was the first great basketball statistician.

Wow. Interesting. Sounds like they should have also made a card for that one team that beat them!

Exhibitman 02-25-2015 05:56 PM

The team that beat them cheated--they spread sawdust on the floor to prevent the Passaic team from going full speed.

I located an email address for the author of a book on the Passaic teams and dropped him a line to see if he can ID any of the people on the card.

UnVme7 02-25-2015 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman (Post 1384461)
I always forget that the era of 'modern' basketball starts a lot later than the era of 'modern' baseball or football or boxing. I was really surprised when I saw this card from the 1925 Exhibit Champions set that it was a HS team:

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibit...basketball.JPG

This is a highschool photo? Umm, the first "kid" has a mustache thicker than Sam Elliott. Sheeeeeit....

TheBig6 02-26-2015 12:09 AM

Heres a Picture of the 1900 Bucknell Basketball Team, from 1901 Yearbook.
Mathewson Center Back row.
http://photos.imageevent.com/ruckers...ize/matty4.jpg

scooter729 02-26-2015 08:03 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Love the early basketball items! My earliest are a Harvard program and team picture from 1908, from the estate of the coach Grebenstein.

Exhibitman 02-26-2015 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnVme7 (Post 1384696)
This is a highschool photo? Umm, the first "kid" has a mustache thicker than Sam Elliott. Sheeeeeit....

I think he was a coach. He is in a photo I saw of the Passaic team from 1921 too, in a suit.

Exhibitman 02-27-2015 04:05 PM

I got a response from Chic Hess, the author of a book on the Passaic HS teams and Professor Blood, ID'ing the people on the Exhibit card:

Here are their names from left to right: Prof Ernest Blood, Fritz Knothe, Fred Merselis, Michael Hamas, Samuel Blitzer, Milton Pashman, Assistant Coach Amasa A. Marks.

So, the card represents an early [first? only?] card of HOFer Ernest Blood. Fritz Knothe was a major league player, with the Braves and Phillies. Mike Hamas went on to play basketball at Penn State.


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