I sold a T-206 Wagner ....25 years ago!
 

In the early 80s I traded a huge collection of football cards, ( complete sets of bowman and topps and misc others) including many unopened packs, for a beat up T-206 Wagner. One corner torn off and one corner burnt off and back damage and multiple creases but his name, team, and face were very clear.
In 87? I allowed De Mouchelle galleries in Detroit to auction it off..... the winning bid.....14K. Unless it has been repaired I never saw it or a picture of it again. The gallery told me it was purchased by a "gentleman in England". After the auction the gallery paid me CASH!! I tipped the 2 armed security guards fifty bucks each to escort me to my car. Up to that time I never ever had 14 thousand cash on my person and.....it Was Detroit.
As I recall that particular auction had another T206 Wagner I think it was the Ed Budnick Wagner.....Imagine that.....two Wagners in the same auction!!!!!!!!!!
For the youngsters here Mr.Ed Budnick was a pioneer in sports memorabilia and was good friends with Frank Nagy. I don't recall what his Wagner sold for, I remember talking to Mr. Nagy about it and he mentioned that if he didn't already have a Wagner he would bid.

Great story! Unfortunately none of these have burn marks.

http://www.centuryoldcards.com/1909t206wagners.html

As I recall
 

That DuMouchelle auction had one Wagner that was sold. There was another that was pulled because it was a fake. Among its suspicious characteristics-it was a thoroughly beat up card yet with corners so sharp you could practically cut your fingers on them. I also recall that a portion of the interior of the card was exposed, and it was the wrong color. At the viewing, attended by a number of well-known dealers/hobbyists, there was amazement that a replacement was substituted so quickly.

Yes, you have described the other Wagner that was in the auction with mine. I was told that it was "pulled and wasn't available now" I remember having the catalog and the other wagner was on the cover. Mine entered the auction too late to be pictured. The gallery was very grateful to have mine to sell seeing that they had lost thier big draw. I think they only had mine for a week or two before the auction.
Dave

David

Do you have a photo of your card before you gave it to the auction house? Would be interested in seeing it.

yes would love to see it or a copy of the original auction catalog:D

No, I don't have a picture of that card. I consigned it to them too late to be included in thier catalog. I believe my brother has a picture of us holding the card but at such a distance you can't see any details.
S. C. D. wrote an article about a few of my cards at the time my T cards and extreme rarities like the Glendale Houtteman card and uncataloged one of a kind cabinets etc. dave.

The seller claims he sold his Wagner in 1987, but the DuMouchelles sale Corey is citing was 1991. That auction had the most comprehensive collection of baseball books the hobby has ever seen. It was consigned to them because the family lived nearby. Never in the history of auctions has an auction company known less about the material they were selling. They never did one iota of research, and got nearly every description wrong. But most of the books still did well in spite of the simply dreadful catalog.

But those Wagners in the 1991 sale weren't real, and when it was pointed out to the auction house, their response was they didn't care, and the buyers didn't seem to care either. You have to love it!

Barry is quite correct. When the second Wagner was substituted, at the viewing thre was quite a scene when a number of the people there emphatically told the owner of the auction house that the second Wagner was absolutely positively a fake, and they gave their reasons why. Yet the card was sold anyway. Some years prior SCD I believe published an issue with a repro Wagner inserted, a darn good one as repros go. And as I remember it was that repro that was sold.

What happened with the reprint sale? Did it go through?

When someone spoke to the auction house, and it may have been Corey, they claimed the buyer was happy with his purchase. Please don't ask me to explain it, I can't.

Of course the buyer was happy with his purchase -- he thought it was real. This was before the days of slabbing, so unless the buyer got wind of the commotion at the viewing, how would he know he was buying a fake? While the card was clearly a repro to one with expertise in the field, that probably did not appy to a significant number of potential bidders, whose guards were presumably down because they had no reason to suspect the card was a fake. DuMouchelles, though not known as an auctioneer of baseball items, was still a recognized and reputable auction house (perhaps the largest in the Detroit area). So why would prospective bidders believe they might be buying a fake? The scene at the viewing was almost surrealistic. I mean here was an auction house with no expertise in baseball items being told by a number of recognized experts that the card had no chance of being real. Yet the auction house refused to pull it. Perhaps having already pulled one Wagner, they thought they would be the laughing stock of the auction world if they got it wrong the second time. The saddest part of this story is that it is not unique to DuMouchelles (e.g., "Creighton" tintype).

That's crazy not to mention criminal. Makes you wonder how many times this sort of thing has happened over the years.

Here's the Wagner that was being offered as genuine....what can I say? It's a beaut!

:eek:

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1...BIG-BUCKS.html

All that wear but the corners are sharp enough to shave with.Amazing!

I'll second that:eek::eek:

just curious
 

Just curious, David P, why would you consign a Wagner to De Mouchelle galleries which was not known for any kind of baseball items? My understanding is that the people in audience were experts and no one was fooled by either Wagner. Also, the auction house paid in cash? That seems a little curious too?

Aloha to all! This thread is the first time I have ever heard that the card consigned to D. Gallery might not have been authentic. I was not present at the auction and I don't ever remember any controversy over authenticity.
One of the younger members of the auction house family had gone to high school with a fellow I worked with and we saw a newspaper article about the upcomming auction of Ed Budnicks collection (mostly books and programs and only a few cards). I always thought that Ed owned the other wagner..the one on the cover of the catalog, but I am not sure of that. I never saw it in person.
Unless memory fails me Ed had owned a dry cleaning business that my cousin worked for and my dad kept the books for. This was a time before the internet and before wide use of mobile phones and before third party grading. I had never consigned anything to an auction house before. D galleries is a high class operation with a long history of excellence so being in Detroit they seemed like a logical choice (though I really didn't consider any other).
Some time after the auction D. called and said it was sold for 14 thousand.
I went down to the gallery. Young Mr. D. and I went to the bank next door to the gallery (with security) and I walk out with the cash. I was told the card was sold to an english card collector. Mahalo for your interest.

I wonder where that card is now? Dave P.

David P
 

So to be certain I understand what you are saying, you consigned it to DuMouchelles because you worked with a fellow who knew a fellow who was a member of the family that owned the auction house? And you were paid for your consignment in cash?

Gotta wonder if the owner who has this card now, feel he has an authentic card(if it is indeed fake).

Also, might the owner be hanging on to it hoping it will continue to grow in worth.

I'm thinking that RI buyer from the article Chris mentions (post 15) was probably Alan Shawn Feinstein.