Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Tom A&nbsp; </b><p>If a low quality common card is graded, does the fact that it is in a PSA/SGC holder (or even a Topps T206 holder) increase its sale value?<BR><BR>The reason why i ask this is in the course of buying cards on ebay, i have happened to win a few cards that were already slabbed. I have not paid anymore for the card than i would have if it was unslabbed, so i don't put a premium on it, but was wondering what other people think. In my case, I am building a low quality, anything-goes-in T206 set. I generally bid a max of $10-12 on commons i need, no matter what the condition. I am right around the 450 card mark doing this, and all but 3 are unslabbed. The 3 that i received in holders are a PSA 1 Pattee, PSA 4 (MC) Stanage, and a Topps T206 Becker. I am inclined to rip these out of the holders so they "match" the rest of the set (besides, the psa ones don't fit in the box), but at the same time i have wondered whether they would sell for more than I could get a replacement for. obviously, i'm the sort of low income collector who would be happy for a $5-10 profit to spend on another card.<BR><BR>Along the same lines, most of the Topps T206 cards are commons in conditions that i normally can find in my price range, but they seem to sell at a premium. Should i put the Becker i have back up on ebay and find another one sans holder? <BR><BR>Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>ty_cobb</b><p>The value of T206s in Topps holders<BR>seems to be at a premium , I'd cash<BR>in now before the phenomena disappears.<BR>I'd liberate your low grade PSA's, there's little<BR>difference in value.<BR><BR>My take on grading is: it is unneccesary hip capitalism.<BR>Grading services need cards, cards don't inherently<BR>need grading services. Cards did just fine before <BR>grading services came along.<BR><BR>I quote from the infamous Alan Hagars's 1996 ASA<BR>card grading licensing ad: "the old-boys dealer<BR>network of doctored, repaired and counterfeit cards<BR>will eventually become obsolete as it did in the coin <BR>business. Literally tens of millions of dollars will<BR>be made by those dealers selling certified cards."<BR><BR>Grading remains a Faustian bargain, the unscrupulous<BR>use it as a marketing tool to foist the very offal<BR>it was intended to eliminate, on those comforted<BR>by illusory expertise.<BR><BR>Nowadays for every goodguy grader like SGC or PSA,<BR>there is a PRO or AAA... <BR><BR>

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>David Vargha</b><p>Like PSA, SGC and BGS are all a good thing in the land of the unscrupulous. Grading does not "create" value; rather it legitimizes it. Cards in EX condition or below often have no greater "value" in the marketplace, whether slabbed or unslabbed. Their NM/MT or better slabbed counterparts sell for far more than the unslabbed cards do.<BR><BR>The marketplaces establishes value. Legitimate grading helps to objectify (to a great degree) what it is that is being evaluated.

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Julie Vognar</b><p>If the card is rare or questionable, or even just 19th century, many people prefer to get these graded as authentication (recommend GAI or SGC) of the cards legitimacy. These two companies tend to grade 19th century stuff very low, but nobody cares! Lord knows what the Gypsy Queen Pud Galvin GAI2 finally went for in the S.C.P. auction; I quit at 1434. Leon wrote an interesting article about getting really rare cards graded by SGC in July, 1901 (19thcenturyonly.org).<BR><BR>Actually, I DON'T recommend getting 19th century cards graded, and took the only graded one I ever bought out of its holder (N162 Brouthers PSA6).

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Dr.Koos</b><p>....why don't we back it up about 5 or 6 pages. I may have been dreaming but wasn't there an entire thread on here that started with a seller's batch of Ebay auctions featuring cards that even HE admitted were trimmed so badly, they were still screaming from the anaesthesia-less amputations, ALL GRADED BY PSA. The cards were such dwarves, that much was so painfully obvious, that someone suggested the holders were changed. <BR> Why anyone keeps referring to AAA or NASA as a GRADING service is mystifying. A grading service solicits submissions on a web site. Grading S E R V I C E....a SERVICE for submittors to send their cards to for an opinion. AAA and NASA DO NOT GRADE CARDS. It's just letters that are affixed to a cheap lucite holder housing paper thin magazine pictures cut down to card size. They are SELLERS with a gimmick, not a grading service. The numbers, grades, designations, mean NOTHING. They are MADE up as they go by the Seller. And admittedly, they sell these "things" like hotcakes. Look at any week's offering of these AAA placebos. ADD UP THE BIDS, even on items that are no where near the end of auction. Then add up the resultant bids. You'll be astonished!!!! Has anybody done this on here? THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of dollars each week with a 98% profit ratio!!! What business in the world works on nearly a 100% pure profit ratio? The items they sell cost next to nothing, especially when they're XEROXes of the magazine clippings in many cases. Their only expense is the cost of the ad, the Ebay final acution value fee and the paper for the labeler (and an occassional band-aid when whoever is cutting these things out of periodicals slips). The lucites are 20 cents each in bulk. They undoubtedly have the most lucrative business on Ebay from a profit standpoint.

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>ty_cobb</b><p>While I believe the intent of grading companies<BR>like SGC and PSA IS to provide professional service,<BR>grading itself often does NOT provide any clarity<BR>at all. Fr'instance, here is a description of an ebay<BR>card right now...<BR><BR>The offered card has a story.....here goes: This card was once housed in a PSA 4 holder. Thinking a better grade was warranted, it was broke out and sent back to PSA for regrading. The card was returned as "altered", without explaination as to the actual problem. The card itself has a great image, strong corners and no creasing.

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>possibly true, most almost as likely a story to try and pass off an altered card as having one time been being graded. <BR><BR>If someone is going to make a claim like this, then having the old label with the serial number would go a long way to making the story somewhat credible.<BR><BR>Jay

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Julie Vognar</b><p>Mark Macrae, wandering around his own convention, saying to people he knew" that guy over there is selling xeroxed Colgan's" over and over. wE TOOK TURNS GOING TO HAVE A LOOK, AND TELLING THE SELLER: "hEY, THOSE CARDS AREN'T CARDS; THEY'RE XEROXES!" The guy would answer that he bought them as originals, so he was selling them that way.<BR><BR>What can you do? Except tell people?

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>David</b><p>My guess is that NASA and AAA are holdering vingtage clippings rather than modern xeroxes or similar reprints. I've never seen one of the items in person, so this is my guess and won't make an issue if someone disagrees. The significance is that, as some of these old guides (not the Funk & Wagnal dictionary) are expensive, the profit margin would not be as momentous-- though a sale of a single $400 Joe 'Mike Mitchel' Jackson would more than pay for the price of the original Spalding or Reach Guide (My guess is these guides sell around $100-$170 each). If they were selling modern reprints, it would be easy to shut them down. Even eBay won't allow someone to sell Xerox counterfeits.<BR><BR>Someone somewhere said that he beleived that many of the buyers of these items were greedy themselves, as they were hoping to resell the 'relative bargains' for a profit. The more I think about it, the more I tend to agree. It's kind of like those dolts who buy the overpriced stuff from SAH, then turn around and put them on eBay the next day to hoping to make a killing. They are half victim and half greedy.<BR>

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Bruce Moreland</b><p>Of course grading creates value, if the grade says something good about the card. It's the same kind of thing as taking a used car to a mechanic -- the knowledge that the car is in decent shape might be worth more than the cost of the inspection.<BR><BR>If you have old commons that are NM or NM/MT, or old stars that are maybe EX or better, having them graded can help a huge amount in some cases.<BR><BR>A T-206 common in 4 isn't helped much, because the grade doesn't really say anything good about the card. It says that the grader thinks that it's not altered, and that there's not some terrible problem going on, but with a T-206 common in that grade there's not that much problem with alteration, and it doesn't take a lot of understanding to tell that a card is VGEX more or less.<BR><BR>I'm used to doing 50's stuff, and I'd never try for a 4 or 5 on a common. It seems like you guys have more problems with alteration on this really old stuff, but I'd still think that it doesn't make great sense to slab a T-206 common in EX or worse.<BR><BR>I'd have to check eBay to know for sure.<BR><BR>bruce<BR>

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Bruce Moreland</b><p>I don't doubt that the stuff is exactly as described. They get old guides and cut them up.<BR><BR>I don't know what the motivation of the buyers is, but if it's greed, it's greed combined with intense stupidity. If it's greed, it's the kind of greed that buys the Brooklyn Bridge. I don't think that many people are that stupid, so I wonder what else it could be.<BR><BR>bruce<BR>

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Bruce Moreland</b><p>"possibly true, most almost as likely a story to try and pass off an altered card as having one time been being graded."<BR><BR>The above referring to someone who sold a card as a PSA-4 that had been returned as altered upon resubmission.<BR><BR>I have no problem believing the story, because I've seen it happen even with new cards.<BR><BR>The whole thing is subjective enough that I'd believe just about anything.<BR><BR>bruce<BR>

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Mike Williams</b><p>it should be no surprise to anyone here that the T206 Green Cobb is being sold by John Spencer. Since a scan of the previous PSA 4 holder isn't provided, I too would be skeptical of a card described as such. Having said that, I know John well....and I do believe the PSA story. Quite honestly, if John wanted to deceive, the PSA story would have been ommitted with no mention of "altered". Let's face it, this story is more of a black eye for the card than not. Whenever a card comes to eBay with a "story", knowing the integrity of the seller is key!

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Julie Vognar</b><p>The description of Mark Macrae wandering around talking about xeroxed Colgan's applied to a convention at the Coluseum, not his own convention at St. Leander's Chruch in San Leandro. Where, he said, he would have expelled the guy, permanently.

Does slabbing create value?
 

Posted By: <b>Lee Behrens</b><p>I personally only grade cards I am willing to sell that I feel will grade at least VG/Ex. I am like yourself where I try to get the cards as reasonable as possible, I spend alot of time watching ebay so I have a good idea wheree to stop my bidding if I need to make money in the future. Almost all the cards I have had graded and sold have gained me a nice profit. My best example is a T206 Willis that I paid $30 for that graded SGC 50 VG/EX and received $150 for in an auction. I once bought a T206 PSA 2 for $14 and on the reasale I got $25.<BR><BR>My recommendation is not to slab unless you are going to resell, there are people out there that only buy graded cards and at a premium. I would have to agree about not getting commons graded unless they aree EX or better, can't justify the cost.<BR><BR>Lee