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-   -   N172 question ? (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=265637)

garymc 02-11-2019 06:35 AM

N172 question ?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Recently just put together a "pose run" of Deacon McGuire. I'm noticing now variations of the card, All are either with the Old Judge logo on the top and the font on the bottom ? I was wondering if the variations were the result of a different print run or a different factory printing
I have a passion to research and find out everything about my cards....

oldjudge 02-11-2019 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garymc (Post 1853657)
Recently just put together a "pose run" of Deacon McGuire. I'm noticing now variations of the card, All are either with the Old Judge logo on the top and the font on the bottom ? I was wondering if the variations were the result of a different print run or a different factory printing

"I have a passion to research and find out everything about my cards...."


If you really had a " passion to research" you would have looked at the Old Judge book and already had your answer.

ramram 02-11-2019 10:21 AM

Hey Gary,

I think Jay (Old Judge) is a little cranky this morning. Yes, as he mentioned, there is a fantastic book out there called "The Photographic Baseball Cards of Goodwin & Company (1886-1890)" that will answer all of your questions. It's available for around $40 on the internet. It's invaluable for any Old Judge collector. Btw, Jay was one of the co-authors.

Rob M

Ricky 02-11-2019 10:28 AM

I bought this book about a week ago and it is a phenomenal resource.

trdcrdkid 02-11-2019 10:49 AM

Gary --

To answer your question briefly: all four of your cards are 1887 OJs, which have the Old Judge logo at the top of the card. The ones with the hotdog-style logo are type A, and the one with a rectangular logo in the upper left (second from the left in your picture) are type B. (At least I think that's right, off the top of my head.) OJs from 1888, 1889, and 1890 have "Old Judge" at the bottom of the card below the picture, and can be distinguished as follows:

1888: "Cigarettes" on line below "Old Judge"
1889: "Cigarette Factory" on line below "Old Judge"
1890: "Cigarette Factory" on line below "Old Judge", and "(N.L.)" or "(P.L.)" after team name.

There are more complexities that that, but those are the basics. If you want to know more, you should definitely get the Old Judge book, which has everything you could possibly want to know about these cards.

oldjudge 02-11-2019 12:52 PM

Thanks David. “passion for research” just seemed incongruous with a question which is answered in multiple places in the Old Judge book and was also answered on the chat board about a week ago. As I get older I get more sensitive to incongruity.

barrysloate 02-11-2019 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldjudge (Post 1853735)
Thanks David. “passion for research” just seemed incongruous with a question which is answered in multiple places in the Old Judge book and was also answered on the chat board about a week ago. As I get older I get more sensitive to incongruity.

I'm with Jay on this one. The Old Judge book is the best research book ever written about baseball cards, and I think any question you can possibly have about Old Judges will be answered if you make an effort to read it.

Given how cumbersome some research can be, having so much information in one place makes it indispensable. If Jay is a little cranky about it, so am I.

ramram 02-11-2019 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barrysloate (Post 1853763)
I'm with Jay on this one. The Old Judge book is the best research book ever written about baseball cards, and I think any question you can possibly have about Old Judges will be answered if you make an effort to read it.

Given how cumbersome some research can be, having so much information in one place makes it indispensable. If Jay is a little cranky about it, so am I.

Come on Barry, you mostly just like the fact that he used the words "incongruous" and "incongruity"! :)

Rob M

RCMcKenzie 02-11-2019 03:35 PM

2 Attachment(s)
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Ricky 02-11-2019 03:48 PM

I will say this in defense of the OP... he may not have known about the Goodwin book or had easy access to it. He may have seen it available on Amazon and not known the type of information it contains. Isn't one of the purposes of this forum to ask and receive answers to these types of questions?

oldjudge 02-11-2019 04:28 PM

1 Attachment(s)
A close relative

garymc 02-11-2019 06:49 PM

I wouldn't read that book now if you gave it to me.....thank you for your kindness !

SetBuilder 02-11-2019 07:28 PM

Time for a 2nd Edition?

insidethewrapper 02-11-2019 07:41 PM

Must be some updates to the book, hope to see it on here.

garymc 03-03-2019 11:54 AM

Not happy
 
It's been two weeks since I made the initial post about the n172's. I bought the book and love it, found all my answers to my questions,

But, I'm still upset about the aggression I recieved,! I feel I was blindsided from members of the forum where others in the past have always been kind to me.

I thought one of the objectives of the forum was to answer questions and have collectors in kind answer them without the fear of ridicule or verbal aggression.

I also would thank those who were kind to me........
Gary McNabb


Sharing my Yankee’s.............
https://www.flickr.com/photos/151843924@N04/albums
Share your Yankee’s...............
https://www.facebook.com/groups/554519474738304/
Share your Yankee memorabilia ...................
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2943...location=group

Joe_G. 03-03-2019 03:44 PM

Gary, glad to see your enthusiasm, you have a nice start on McGuire. Jay (oldjudge) has helped many of us over the years, his objection stemmed from your passion declaration which fell short of researching a number of posts or the book you are now familiar with.

Deacon McGuire is an interesting player to collect. While you are complete at 4 different poses, he was issued and re-issued cards from 1887 to 1889 such that he has 17 different variations currently checklisted (may be others out there as well). Five of the listed variants will be tough including Gypsy Queens (Es), 1888 re-issues (Fa & Fb), and cabinet (G). Most of the other twelve are possible given enough time and patience (the 1887 long numbered cards (type A & B) and the 1889 (Fc) re-issues).

Here is the run-down on Deacon McGuire, I've highlighted in blue the variations you posted:

312-1 Hands on knees
- a. McGuire, C., Phila (B-0149-A)
- b. McGuire, Catcher, Philadelphia (B-0149-B)
312-2 R/hand on hip, L/arm at side
- a. McGuire, C., Phila (B-0150-A)
- b. McGuire, Catcher, Philadelphia (B-0150-B)
- c. J. McGuire, Catcher, Phil (Fa, Fb)
312-3 Catch, hands shoulder high
- a. McGuire, C., Phila (B-0151-A, B, Es, Fc)
- b. McGuire, Catcher, Philadelphia (B-0151-B)
- c. McGuire, C. Phila (G)
- d. McGuire, C., Torontos (Fc)
312-4 Strike, looking down at ball
- a. McGuire, C., Phila (B-0152-A, B, Es)
- b. McGuire, Catcher, Philadelphia (B-0152-B)

Leon 03-06-2019 03:22 PM

Hey, at least you know who is saying stuff. Go to other forums and you never know. Jay is just ornery sometimes as we all can be...He means no harm:).. The forum is a mixture of society, no more and no less. With close to 10,000 members there are all kinds. Happy collecting and nice run of OJs.


Quote:

Originally Posted by garymc (Post 1859640)
It's been two weeks since I made the initial post about the n172's. I bought the book and love it, found all my answers to my questions,

But, I'm still upset about the aggression I recieved,! I feel I was blindsided from members of the forum where others in the past have always been kind to me.

I thought one of the objectives of the forum was to answer questions and have collectors in kind answer them without the fear of ridicule or verbal aggression.

I also would thank those who were kind to me........
Gary McNabb


Sharing my Yankee’s.............
https://www.flickr.com/photos/151843924@N04/albums
Share your Yankee’s...............
https://www.facebook.com/groups/554519474738304/
Share your Yankee memorabilia ...................
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2943...location=group


ramram 03-06-2019 07:00 PM

Hey Gary, just roll your back and let it run off. Like Leon said, you get a full mix of it. About 90% will be glad to share whatever wealth of information they may have, about 9% like to take pot-shots for whatever reason and about 1% are just bat-sh*t crazy...and that’s when it gets really fun.

Rob M

RCMcKenzie 03-06-2019 07:23 PM

Gary got a very detailed answer to his question. He should be overjoyed. I know I enjoyed reading it.


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