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The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: CoreyRS.hanusOkay, I know we’ve been this route before. REA asked us to consider the Jordan Marsh CDV/ticket of Harry Wright (to be subsequently joined by other players of the same issue), the CDV/trade card of the Currier & Ives image “The American National Game of Baseball” and the “Old Man” CDV depicting Dave Birdsall. Other candidates would of course be the Peck & Snyder memorial trade card of James Creighton, the Peck & Snyder trade card of the 1868 Brooklyn Atlantics and the 1860-61 CDV of the Brooklyn Atlantics. While reasonable people may differ on the precise year of issuance of some of these items and, more important, whether some of them even should be defined as baseball cards, they are the candidates for that hallowed title of the first baseball card. That is, until now. Presented below is the ticket (hereinafter referred to as the baseball card), costing $1, which gained the lucky holder entry to the first annual ball of the Magnolia Ball Club. Its dimensions are 5 1/8" x 3 1/4". It is blank-backed and printed on heavy cardboard stock. It was issued early in 1844 and is the oldest known baseball illustration depicting the modern game of baseball (i.e., the Knickerbocker game). What makes the image even more historically significant is that the game is being played at Elysian Fields, as confirmed by known images of the grounds and its structures. For those of you wondering who the Magnolia’s are, well they are a baseball club that played a version of baseball substantially identical to the game the Knickerbockers codified, referred to now as the modern game of baseball. They played at Elysian Fields (the home ground of the Knicks), dating back to at least the early 1840’s. They thus predate the formal organization of the Knickerbockers in 1845, though in fairness to the Knicks it should be pointed out that they certainly were playing ball together prior to the time they officially organized. Now to anticipate a question, if it was issued as ticket, what suddenly makes it now a card. On that one REA adequately addressed the issue – it can be both, as long as it satisfies the criteria of each. As to its card characteristics, it was publicly available, depicts baseball subject matter, was issued for commercial purposes and has the physical characteristics of a card. As to those naysayers who will look to bring to the surface reservations I expressed at the time REA called the Jordan Marsh ticket a baseball card, let’s just say I have evolved in my thinking to be now in step with REA. In regard to how the item can be dated to early 1844, here reprinted in its entirety is an ad that ran in the New York Herald February 6-8, 1844: THE FIRST ANNUAL BALL of the New York Magnolia Ball Club will take place at National Hall, Canal st. on Friday evening, Feb. 9th, inst. The Club pledge themselves that no expense or exertions shall be spared to render this (their first) Ball worthy the patronage of their friends. The Ball Room will be splendidly decorated with the insignia of the Club. Brown’s celebrated Band is engaged for the occasion. Tickets $1, to be had of the undersigned, and at the bar of National Hall. JOSEPH CARLISLE, Chairman. PETER H. GRAHAM, Secretary <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1221670752.GIF">

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: barrysloateFirst Corey, nice little pick up of a piece that has not been discussed before in the hobby. Obviously, over the years the parameters of what we call a baseball card have expanded. As such, your discovery can in fact be called one, too. However, exactly what kind of baseball card this is is a fairer question. It is a lovely engraving, earlier than anything we have seen before. The tie to Elysian fields is of course of great significance. Over time I am sure we will learn more about this unusual artifact.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: barrysloateI would be remiss if I didn't add that I always felt the Peck & Snyder of Jim Creighton was the first baseball card. Now that you found this, the owner of the Creighton sure will be mad. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: leonGreat discussion question. I have always held that the stamp "admit the bearer" to mean that the item in question was a ticket and not a baseball card. So that does it for those tickets, in my mind, though it is certainly debatable. I think it might be easier to identify the very first professional (all paid) baseball card, which is the 1869 Red Stocking CDV. Of course the 1868 Atlantics predated it but to the best of my knowledge I don't think that team was "professional" in the sense that all members were paid. Very good topic....

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: ramramNow, just to clarify, the "ticket" is for the dance, not a game of baseball. Rob M. Edited typo

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: PCNo matter how you spin it, that is a ticket, not a card. And a dance ticket, not a game ticket. So, what we have here is the earliest known example of an admission ticket to a baseball team's annual dance. That's something. Just not a card.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: ramramGotta say though, that representation is incredible, considering it's 1844! What's the story behind this item? Where was it hiding and where is it currently?? Rob M.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: AnonymousGotta say, I agree that this is not a baseball card. It's a ticket with a baseball theme on it. To me (personally) the oiginal intrinsic value should be on the photo of the player or players. That's when it becomes a card. If we use the interpretations above then we open the door to all sorts of advertising displays. It's certainly interesting and probably historic. But its a publication item, not a card.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: leonThe only way to tell a card from a ticket: If you are selling it- it's a card. If you are buying it- it's a ticket Reality- ticket Unreality- card Could it be more clear? just my opinion.....

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: barrysloateLeon has just articulated the meaning of the term "baseball card" better than anyone else to date.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: JayCorey--You missed the one rule that is needed for an item to qualify as the first baseball card--it has to be in Rob's auction. Unless you consign this it cannot so qualify.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: ShawnHere is a neat little article referencing (the same?) Magnolia Ball Club in 1867 on page 248. <a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=o7w0qByyixsC&pg=RA1-PA248&dq=magnolia+ball+club&ei=61rRSJfaHZXKigHC8Nn mAw&sig=ACfU3U1sczjJN8IcoryH0H6DpHVImz0Z2A" target="_new" rel="nofollow"><a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=o7w0qByyixsC&pg=RA1-PA248&dq=magnolia+ball+club&ei=61rRSJfaHZXKigHC8Nn mAw&sig=ACfU3U1sczjJN8IcoryH0H6DpHVImz0Z2A</a" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.com/books?id=o7w0qByyixsC&pg=RA1-PA248&dq=magnolia+ball+club&ei=61rRSJfaHZXKigHC8Nn mAw&sig=ACfU3U1sczjJN8IcoryH0H6DpHVImz0Z2A</a</a>>

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: CoreyRS.hanusPutting aside the issue of whether it is a card, a ticket, some combination of the two, or something else (and in all fairness even though technically it does possess such characteristics as to allow one to reasonably argue it is a card, I do agree its ticket characteristics are more pronounced than its card characteristics), to me what is most significant about the item is that it identifies a never-before known baseball club playing what appears to be the modern game of baseball before the modern rules were formally codified. Historically, to those of us into that sort of thing, it is extraordinary. It is concrete evidence that the 20 rules the Knickerbockers codified in 1845 (baseball's ten commandements) reflected in substance a game already being played at Elysian Fields, not only by the Knicks but apparently now also by a least one other club (the Magnolia's). That coupled with the item being the first known illustration of baseball more or less as we know it today is what makes it so special, much more whether it should be characterized as the first baseball card.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: barrysloateCorey- I think the way you described it in your last post better captures the historical significance of the piece, which is great. When the discussion concerns whether or not it is the first baseball card, it loses focus.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: PaulJust as a matter of personal taste, I would be more interested in owning "the first baseball card that depicts an identifiable player" rather than "the first baseball card." Regardless, it's obviously a fantastic item.

The First Baseball Card -- Latest Candidate

Posted By: davidcheck out the latest american memorabilia auction. they have a card they date to the 18th century. i guess they are too busy taking pictures of women in game used jersey's to employ a proof reader.