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The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Brian H  I went to the national here in Chicago (ok its actually in Rosemont, IL near the airport) for part of the last 2 days. I enjoying actually meeting several of the other characters from teh Board and a bunch of us had dinner on Thursday Night -- someone else has photos and can provide commentary about this historic caucus. The national was different than the other 2 I have been to here in Chicago. First of all there was virtually no free stuff and no real lines for anything but still decent attendance. I will leave it to someone else to describe from the dealers' perspective whether it was "a good show" and how our fledgling economy may or may not have effected the event. The "Big Four" grading companies (PSA, SGC, Beckett and now GAI) each had a pressence both in terms of submissions and cards on the tables. SCD was also there but their cards were relatively few and far between. None of the other alphabet soup of grading companies had much of a pressence at all. It seems that the long forecast shakeout has finally occurred in this market. Although I only really submitted to SGC at this one (as usual) I did talk to PSA and GAI directors who were both informative and helpful about some of my concerns about grading vintage cards (primarily T202s). The grading business seems to be finally becoming more consumer (non-dealer) friendly. Generally there was less vintage stuff there than I had hoped (so if you missed it you didn't miss that much). As I expected there were no (vintage, not El Duque) Cuban cards and very few high quality T202s or T205s either graded or raw. Old Judges (and even Mayos) were, however, relatively prevalent -- and not just at the TIK table. Alot the other big vintage dealers had graded (SGC, PSA or GAI) Old Judges priced very high in all grades (GAI has even more lower half-grades than SGC I learned). In fact, surprisingly, some of the most affordble Old Judges were at the TIK table along with Terry's usual assortment of mouth watering rarities and one of a kinds from the 19th Century. Terry also still has a bevy of the one of a kind Alleghanys including some nice HOFers -- but I held off becoming a type collector and getting one even though getting Bresnahans ultimate Rookie was tempting. As far as sight seeing the most interesting cards I got to look at were the Mastro cards for the current auction, the TIK table, some of Scott B's stuff (I have never seen so many T204s or Breisch-William cards in one place in my life), some of the stuff Sportcards Plus is putting in its next auction and horde of very rare types Leon had brought with him from his collection.... As Pink Floyd said "wish you were here"

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Julie Vognarthough I'm surprised there were not many T202s. Terry Knouse is a gold mine...

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Jaime LeidermanThanks Brian! Living/Working part time outside the US, gives me no chance of attending major shows.

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: VarghaJust my 2 cents, but doesn't it seem that with the proliferation of collectors and with the advent of grading that high quality vintage cards are only going to get more and more scarce? I mean, unless an amazing "find" occurs or someone sells their collection, people like you and me will be affecting the supply as we squirrel away cards into our collections with no intention of selling them. That would then result in higher prices as the market finds more hands chasing fewer cards. I have seen a microcosm of this in the 1951 Bowman set as PSA 9 commons have almost tripled in price just in the last 2 years. With the PSA Set Registry (and I think SGC is following suit), more people should be submitting raw cards for encapsulation and permanent placement within their collections. DavidVargha@hotmail.com

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Kevin CummingsRelated to David's point, there is a limit to the supply of vintage cards, but there is also a limit to the prices an everyday Joe (I'm one of those) is willing to fork over for an Old Judge - slabbed or not. So what's the going rate for a slabbed Old Judge common and, in your estimation, are they actually selling or are they just expensive table ornaments for the dealers?

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: PaulJust out of curiosity, how much is Tik&Tik selling the Alleghany Bresnahan for (and other Alleghany's if you remember)? Paul

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Julie Vognarwhen the economy's bad, good cards go into hiding, because they won't bring as much. When it gets better, they start popping out for sale. However, that is a sort of scary thought. The more there are of us the less there are of them...

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: John(z28jd)I noticed at the ft washington show i went to that all the Old Judges seemed to be overpriced no matter who the dealer was and was suprised at some of the prices of commons. Put it this way,the price they get on ebay is about half of what they were for sale for at the show.Dont know how well they sell and i was thinking the same thing,unless you get a person who wants a certain card real bad those cards wont sell and they end up being just "window dressing". But i know theres also certain people out there who really want certain players and will be willing to pay the high prices

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Andy BaranI believe that TIK's asking price was $2,200.

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: David VarghaHowever, that is a sort of scary thought. The more there are of us the less there are of them... I believe that was the basic premise of Invasion of the Body Snatchers. DavidVargha@hotmail.com

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: Jay MillerBesides Wayne Varner and Terry Knouse, who were the main dealers with Old Judge cards at the National?

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: B. HodesJay - In addition to TIK, I recall that Mike Wheat; Shoebox (Wayne Varner); Sportscards Plus (CAL); John Billingsley and a few others had several Old Judges. Of these many were graded (regrdless of condition and often by GAI). Hope this helps -- maybe someone else remembers which other dealers had Old Judges. Best, Brian Hodes

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: leonI saw quite a few good things. The dealers I spoke to all said they did good with a few of them saying it was their best Nationals ever..I think more selling went on than buying though. That' not so good for the dealers in the long run <img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14> ....there was even one card that you caramel collectors are going to enjoy <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14> No letting the cat out of the bag for those that saw it.... till later (cause it's real late) best regards....

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: TomTWO cards.......................congrats buddy...........

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: goudey guyHey Brian, I managed to pick up some Diaz Cigarette cards from a dealer at the National. Did you see those? Eric

The National review (not the conservative magazine)

Posted By: TBobCan someone relate if there were any (or many) T207s, Obaks or E94s and E97s for sale, and general shape? Thanks, Bob