Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>MikeU</b><p>"Breaking his cards out for Kevin to examine would offer little insurance."<br /><br />That I agree with, as soon as you break the card out, you have essentially voided the warranty. Many alterations will be relatively hard to detect in the slab. You will only be able to get the relatively obvious ones, which Joe should not have much of an argument with for refund. However, under 100X magnification in the slab, you can strongly solidify ones suspicions. The slabbed pile of "reasonable doubt" cards will be the hard part. If you truly wanted to complete the story, a agreed break out session with PSA supervision would need to take place. <br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Peter S</b><p>how was jury duty? this thread is so long i now can't recall if you had it today or yesterday lol

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Kevin Saucier</b><p>""This is exactly why Kevin would do this work for free. He is trying to gain credibiliy. If he can show PSA their errors, then he should gain their respect and maybe even land a gig."""<br /><br /><br /><br />All for free? Mike...let's not get carried away (LOL). It takes roughly 8 hours to examine approx 40 cards. I have even spent more than an hour on a few.<br /><br />At this point I'm no longer looking for credibility, I've proven my point. I won't be quiting my day job but looking for something to fill the time void left from American Idol.<br /><br /><br /><br />Kevin

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Peter S</b><p>How long does it take PSA or SGC to examine 40 cards?

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Kevin Saucier</b><p>From what I am told from a very reliable source, PSA spends about 30 seconds per card and no longer than a minute. Remember the article by Joe about not needing maginfication etc.? I forget exactly what he wrote but it wasn't reassuring.<br /><br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Peter S</b><p>Kevin I presume they "triage," i.e. spend more time on more important/expensive cards or those that require further examination, but even so if that is the average it is not hard to see how over many years many altered cards would escape detection especially given the level of expertise out there in various techniques.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>MikeU</b><p>"It takes roughly 8 hours to examine approx 40 cards."<br /><br />You would make approximately $40 per day in Newport Beach and would be about 18 times slower than the typical employee. No wonder there was little interest in your services:&gt;)

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Peter- my jury duty was yesterday and they discharged us by 3:00. It was really quiet at the Brooklyn Supreme Court.<br /><br />But my wife, who was called the same day, got empaneled on a murder case, but while they were doing voir dire there was a plea bargain (I think) and everyone was sent home.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Peter Spaeth</b><p><img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>And I was proud of myself because I thought I spelled it right...well it's French so I'm giving myself a free pass <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>I need to clarify what I meant in my earlier statement. From now on if you quote me it needs have the words "without being provoked" added. Also you might learn how to spell my name if you are going to quote me. It's spelled correctly below:<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />"If anyone else wants to (continue to) attack anyone on this board, without being provoked, including me, then they will be banned"--Leon Luckey

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Al C.risafulli</b><p>Jeez, Leon. Nobody quotes ME in their sigline. That's some rarified air right there.<br /><br />I think that quote would look awesome emblazoned on a plate, decoupaged onto a chunk of wood, or maybe written onto a fuzzy velvet blacklight painting of unicorns and rainbows.<br /><br />-Al

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Tom Nieves</b><p>Jim,<br /><br />Calling him "asphaltman" is very inappropriate. I would suggest using "asphaltboy" instead.<br /><br />Tom

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Scot Reader</b><p><br />JimVB,<br /><br />Thanks for the concise summary. Please summarize all future Net54 threads that exceed 100 posts. Should add about a percent to GDP.<br /><br />Scot<br /><br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Leon,<br /><br />I figured as long as you kept spelling my name wrong--CRANDALL--that I could reciprocate(not real<br />ly).<br /><br />Your new word additions put a different twist on it Leon. These three that make a career out of insulting me can claim that Crandell provoked me because he did not submit his 25,000 cards or I posted another damning post about Mastronet that provoked them. <br /><br />If you could persuade these three to act civil Leon it would be a much friendlier place. Simply tell them to ignore me and I will ignore them as I always do.<br /><br />I will drop my sign off line.<br /><br />Tom,<br /><br />Funny but I am taking the high road and will let his ongoing attacks speak for themselves--he must be embarrassed by now.<br /><br />Charlie,<br /><br />What is your basis for saying that PSA has imroved its ability recently to detect high-end alterations?<br /><br />Jim

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Dave F</b><p>Yes...asphaltboy is embarrassed and now has his tail between his legs. Good one Jim. And good one to you to Tom...whoever you are.<br /><br /><br />Edited to say...asphaltboy...god this must be 5th grade all over again. how original.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>PeterS</b><p>When my brothers and I were kids and cussing at each other my mother thought we were calling each other asphalts.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Charlie Barokas</b><p>Jim,<br /><br />Simple, the people that are doing what you describe are complaining about how difficult it has become to get the right answer from PSA. <br /><br />CB

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Charlie,<br /><br />Thats one of the more encouraging things I have heard recently.<br /><br />Kevin--have you heard anything to this effect?

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>PeterS</b><p>What Charlie says echoes what I have been hearing -- there seems to be a reluctance to grade high end big ticket cards recently. EDITED TO ADD To clarify what I am hearing is NOT encouraging -- I am hearing this reluctance extends to cards that are perfectly legitimate with no evidence of alteration.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Charlie Barokas</b><p>Jim,<br /><br />PSA is so scared to put big cards in their holders that many original cards are being kicked for "evidence of trimming". <br /><br />CB

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Charlie Barokas</b><p>I am surprised at how few nice cards showed up on eBay after the National. eBay seems to be very sparce for desirable cards right now and I think it is a function of how tough they are. Ordinarily immediately following the big shows eBay seems to be flooded with 8's and above from onsite grading. It certainly did not happen this year.<br /><br />CB

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Kevin Saucier</b><p>"Ordinarily immediately following the big shows eBay seems to be flooded with 8's and above from onsite grading. It certainly did not happen this year."<br /><br /><br /><br />We will have to wait until the graders get a little older and can count higher than 8 (LOL).<br /><br /><br /><br />"Kevin--have you heard anything to this effect?"<br /><br /><br /><br />Personally, I haven't noticed a difference or heard anything at all. <br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Wow, Peter and Charlie: I'm not sure that makes me feel better about PSA, but at least they're showing some trepdiation, right?<br /><br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Larry</b><p>Jeff-<br /><br />regarding PSA recently.........All they are showing everyone now is they can take dealers & collectors money without being prudent during their grading process. The policy of really nice cards getting trimmed or altered status in such quantities is a recent and dangerous policy. They are rejecting so many good and untainted cards it has made everyone uneasy and can only be balanced by dealers and collectors limiting their submissions, the wheel will slow down. Over compensating by ridiculous strict and unrealistic standards is no better than grading obviously trimmed cards and holdering them.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>I will take ridiculously strict and unrealistic over grading obviously trimmed cards any day.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Peter</b><p>Jim as a collector I agree with you, but consider the perspective of guys who submit cards for a living, who now can't get legitimate cards graded.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I'm with Peter 100% on this one. If I paid good money for a raw card and submitted it, I wouldn't want it rejected for no discernable reason.<br /><br />They shouldn't overcompensate one way or the other. They should get it right, every time. Period. That's what we pay them for.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Tony Andrea</b><p>I guess I'm a little bewildered about this whole thing.<br />The solution seems so simple to me.<br />1. Have qualified graders that are trained properly to authenticate cards correctly.<br />2. If a mistake is made, (people are human), stand behind your product and the collector<br /> 100% who has purchased your product.<br /> Am I wrong here??<br /> <p>Tony<br />

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Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Todd--I had the pleasure of seeing Jim's collection a few years ago. From what I saw the cards were spectacular and, although I am no expert, I didn't see anything that was obviously questionable.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>I agree, Barry. Here's a non-baseball example. I have a set of 1948 Bowman Basketball cards thay have been in my possession since before PSA, or any other graders existed. (They were my dad's.)<br /><br />Several cards in the set are mis-cut and would probably have trouble grading. But it's clear that the miscuts are factory, because they are identical. <br /><br />But if I send the Mikan in, I would anticipate it getting rejected for being "trimmed" or "cut from a sheet". As long as I'm not trying to sell, I don't care. But someday, my kids might care. For now, they'll stay ungraded.<br /><br /><img src="http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb189/jvb6034/1948BowmanBasketball.gif"><br /><br /><br />

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Dan Bretta</b><p>I think PSA is probably afraid of someone with the skills of say Kevin S sending something altered in and documenting it for the world to see. This tells me that the card doctors are ahead of PSA and that's why PSA is being so cautious right now.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jim- I'm sure those Bowmans came that way as you said, but I can see the graders having some apprehension with them. I guess graded with the MC qualifier would be the best they could do.

Mastro and Psa
 

Posted By: <b>Jim Crandell</b><p>I am sympathetic to the honest dealers but I think so many of them that are submitting are fooling around with the cards that I think if there is any question at all--don't grade it.<br /><br />Jim