View Full Version : Keeler or McGraw?
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03-03-2009, 04:54 AM
Posted By: <b>Greg Martin</b><p>The VintageBall site indicates this is Keeler's image, but Prewarsports indicates this is John McGraw's image. If this has been discussed before, I couldn't locate the thread. Thanks, Greg<br><img src="http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm25/gbmartin34/1905YouraKnocker.jpg" alt="[linked image]"><br><img src="http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm25/gbmartin34/1905YouraKnockerr.jpg" alt="[linked image]">
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03-03-2009, 05:14 AM
Posted By: <b>David Atkatz</b><p>"Little Napoleon"<br><br>(McGraw)
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03-03-2009, 05:26 AM
Posted By: <b>Pennsylvania Ted</b><p>It's hard to tell from your scan.....but, am I seeing quite a bit of the butt end of his bat below his grip ?<br><br>If so, then the pix most likely is Keeler He choked up quite high on the bat.<br><br>His "mug", however, looks more like McGraw.<br><br>
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03-03-2009, 05:52 AM
Posted By: <b>Steve Murray</b><p>No way that's Keeler. McGraw gets my nod.
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03-03-2009, 05:56 AM
Posted By: <b>David Atkatz</b><p>"If so, then the pix most likely is Keeler He choked up quite high on the bat."<br><br>So did McGraw.<br><br>Besides, that drawing is a copy of a somewhat famous photo of McGraw.
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03-03-2009, 06:31 AM
Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>McGraw.....
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03-03-2009, 06:59 AM
Posted By: <b>Steve Murray</b><p>Another way of analyzing it is that the PC is copyrighted in 1905. The Giants had just boycotted the 1904 world series the year before and won the series in 1905. Keeler and the highlanders weren't doing much in those days.<br><br>Consider too a couple of the definitions of Knocker:<br><br>"a big shot who knows it and acts that way; a boastful immoderate person"<br>"an important influential person"<br><br>Who then do you suppose would be the "Knocker"?
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03-03-2009, 07:12 AM
Posted By: <b>Mark L</b><p>That might be McGraw's batting stance, which began with his chest facing the pitcher.
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03-03-2009, 07:20 AM
Posted By: <b>Steve Murray</b><p>Does this help?<br><img src="http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/SGC%20Postcards/u3.jpg" alt="[linked image]">
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03-03-2009, 08:32 AM
Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>If someone could post McGraw's T206 or T213 red type portrait you will see it's a dead ringer for him....at least to me.
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03-03-2009, 08:40 AM
Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/calvindog/2909265411/" rel="nofollow"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3205/2909265411_1d1f247c2d_o.jpg" width="450" height="754" alt="T206 Portrait With Cap"></a>
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03-03-2009, 10:39 AM
Posted By: <b>bmarlowe</b><p>VintageBall gets a fair amount of stuff wrong - so no surprise to me that it can't be Keeler (see photo). The ear angles are way off.<br><br>It can be McGraw.<br><br><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1236105918.JPG" alt="[linked image]">
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03-03-2009, 04:55 PM
Posted By: <b>Greg Martin</b><p>All the responses were very interesting and convincing, approached from angles I would not have considered otherwise (choking up, open stance, definition of knocker, 1904-05 season information, etc.) I appreciate it, and thanks for posting those very sharp cards as well.
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03-03-2009, 06:06 PM
Posted By: <b>Marty Ogelvie</b><p>bears a striking resemblence to McGraw.. looks nothing like Keeler.. IMO.<br><br>marty