raw cards are getting harder to find

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Posted By: <b>jdunbar</b><p>i just want to say that it is grtting harder and harder to find ungraded cards! i'm currently collecting the e90-1 set and having a rough time finding raw cards for this set every one has them graded. i like to touch what i have if anyone has any feed back or knows where to find raw e90-1 cards let me know? thanks jason

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Posted By: <b>Scott Fandango</b><p>ebay may be hit or miss with raw.....

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Posted By: <b>Tony Andrea</b><p>Hi Jason -<br />I would bet if you were to post your request on the B/S/T you would have alot of cards to choose from. Just a thought.<br /><br />Tony A.<br /><br />edited to fix my bad grammar.

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Posted By: <b>jdunbar</b><p>i just have a problem with ebay you can get ripped off not everyone is honest and you don't have to be rude i was stating a fact you can not get high end hofer's that are not graded so hah

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Posted By: <b>Adam</b><p>"with eBay you can get ripped off" . . . correct, so if you want raw cards, buy them graded on eBay (so you don't get ripped off with reprints) and crack them out!

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Posted By: <b>Jason</b><p>If I had a high end HOF prewar card. Why on earth wouldn't I get it graded?<br /><br />Just buy them graded and crack them out.

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>that is true but the high end players like jackson and mitchell are even more money graded than raw in any condition.

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Posted By: <b>boxingcardman</b><p>People selling cards through any venue, whether it is Ebay or auction houses, know that (1) there is not much trust out there (for good reasons) and (2) you leave a lot of money on the table if you try to sell high grade raw cards. Frankly, only a person who doesn't know cards or who isn't all that bright would sell high grade raw prewar HOFers. Lamenting the lack of those items for sale is like complaining that you can't find gas for a buck a gallon any more. <br><br>Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>do you understand that a lot of collectors like raw over graded who's to say what the condition of the card is have you read the book called the card? their is no way they spend the time to grade the cards and give the cards the proper condition it deserves. i'm not bill mastro that can pay for a grade that is higher than deserved and sending it to art restorer and still they grade the card as origanal and give it a 8. thats why i like raw cards over graded. and a nother thing their are cards out thier that are graded and are not real.

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Posted By: <b>Randy Trierweiler</b><p>I smell a storm brewing.

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Posted By: <b>Bob</b><p>Troll alert...

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>i want everyone to read the book the card it has t206 honus on the front i think it's written by tim o'keefe not sure but i think it's the name of the author. thats where i got some of my info from thanks

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Posted By: <b>Mark</b><p>Yikes...

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Posted By: <b>Pcelli60</b><p>Buy them in the holder and then take them out!<br>All you have to do is get good at taking them out without damaging them.<br>Problem solved!!

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>yeah those cases are hard to get the cards out of and not damaged them

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Posted By: <b>J Levine</b><p>Almost as hard as getting a card out of a case is using a spell check.

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Posted By: <b>Bruce Dorskind</b><p><br /><br />Mr. Dunbar.<br /><br />We find it astonishing that you are surprised that it is difficult to collect raw cards.<br /><br />1) Graded cards, as Boxing Man correctly points out, command a price that is significantly<br />higher than raw cards. Often times a graded card will sell at 3x to 100x that of ungraded<br />cards in the same condition Only the very old time collectors still actively collect "raw cards"<br /><br />2) Secondly, when one is acquiring a piece of cardboard from a stranger through<br />a system like E Bay- there is a very strong chance that the seller and the buyer will<br />disagree about condition. Scans are not always accurate. One can argue until the cows<br />come home, but condition is the major factor in determining the value of a baseball card.<br /><br />3) Whilst the grading services are far from perfect, they are more accurate and consistent<br />than the thousands of individuals who randomly call "beaters" excellent or near mint. Grading<br />brings consistency...it is not perfect but it is the best we have<br /><br />4) If you want to collect raw cards-we suggest you walk the floors of card shows across America<br />and remember the words of WC Fields- There is a sucker born every minute<br /><br /><br />Bruce Dorskind<br />America's Toughest Want List

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>i understand that but i like raw cards i can touch them and they are not in a hard plastic case where they will never be touched again. they where ment to be touched or they would have put them in hard cases then.

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>Backwards logic. <br /><br />There are graded cards that are not original, therefore the ungraded cards must be original.<br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>i still remember the thrill of opening a pack of cards to collect the set and never even thought of putting them in a hard plastic case you never could touch. thats the problem with the hobby.

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Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>What's the big deal about touching the cards???<br /><br />Take your best examples, put them in plastic or grade them for protection. Then take your worst example to caress and rub all over your body if you are so in love with the feel of 70-120 year old cardboard.<br /><br />Geez.

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Posted By: <b>Red</b><p>1) Graded cards, as Boxing Man correctly points out, command a price that is significantly higher than raw cards. Often times a graded card will sell at 3x to 100x that of ungraded cards in the same condition Only the very old time collectors still actively collect "raw cards"<br /><br />"Often times a graded card will sell at 3x to 100x that of ungraded cards in the same condition."<br /><br />Same condition, or same advertised condition? Often the big difference in price is due to the owner's unwillingness to assign an accurate grade to his card. <br /><br />A graded card has a much better chance of being acceptable to buyers at the advertised condition. The price realized will be higher because the advertised condition will be accurate.<br /><br />An ungraded card has a much better chance of not being in the advertised condition. The price realized will reflect the true condition of the card judged by what can be seen in the picture. For example, a seller calls a card NM and you can clearly see creases. Or when a seller's lowest grade is VG and all the cards would clearly grade poor.<br /><br />To somebody who doesn't know any better it would appear that raw cards sell for a fraction of the value of graded cards. If the seller had a rock solid guaranty that his cards would grade at the same grade with SGC or PSA, and all bidders trusted him completely, prices for his raw cards would be much closer to the graded card price.

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Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>One great aspect about buying a raw card is that you don't have to concern yourself with whether the grader misgraded or misidentified it. It is astonishing how frequently that happens. My most recent mistaken slip is of a T206 card, which according to the slip is "Randall throwing". I see no ball, no arm up or out, I think it is the normal portrait card that folks who know the white border set are used to seeing. <br /><br />Most know how I feel about graded cards, so I won't repeat that. Buy a graded one and bust it out, as suggested above. Lots of us do that. So many of us do it so much that I really wonder about folks who quote population reports as gospel. No doubt they wonder about me, too...

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Posted By: <b>boxingcardman</b><p>That's boxingCARDman, Brice <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14><br /><br />Oddly, we agree on this one; most sellers don't know near mint from chocolate mint. Must be a frozen lake in hell somewhere...<br><br>Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>"Brice" = plural of Bruce ????<br /><br /><br />Priceless. Thanks for starting off this week with a laugh.

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Posted By: <b>peter ullman</b><p>obviously there are fewer raw cards on the market these days...as prices have increased in the past, people have their raw cards graded to optimize their revenue/profits. This is the ONLY reason I've had cards graded...to resell them.<br /><br />I see plenty of raw cards...as a lot of you do...in our own collections!!!

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Posted By: <b>Joe D.</b><p>I think if baseball card shops would put internet kiosks in their shops....<br />then raw cards would be easier to find.

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Posted By: <b>Matt</b><p>well done Joe.<br /><img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Raw cards are a gamble but they are still out there. I have bought several lately that turned out fairly well.......it is definitely caveat emptor though. (knock on wood).....

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Posted By: <b>DJ</b><p>Graded cards are still raw if you remove the casing. <br /><br />Why not simply buy the graded card and set it free with a couple hammer shots to the corner of the holder?<br /><br />DJ

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Posted By: <b>Jimmy</b><p>I feel with raw cards, it really depends where you are getting them, yes eBay is a gamble and sometimes you win or lose. There are many dealers that have raw cards at shows or on websites. There are always raw cards to buy, sometimes you just have to look harder or ask. I understand over the years it has been harder to find them, but buy lower graded cards and just crack them open.<br /><br />Jimmy<br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>larry moe</b><p>I have about 50 in vg or better shape, no dupes but will trade for some of my pcl wants. Larry

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Posted By: <b>jason</b><p>the problem is there are not alot of card shows in the area where i live they only have two good card shows a year maybe and a lot of new product. the card dealers sell the new product and late 60's and up.