GAI vs SGC Market Value [Archive] - Net54baseball.com Forums

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10-03-2007, 08:37 AM

Posted By: MattI've got about 30 pre-war cards that need grading and am debating between SGC and GAI. The sold criterion for my decision is $ (I don't care which one is more accurate or has nicer plastic). On the ebay market, which of the two sells for higher, or am I better off going with PSA despite the additional grading expense/club fees.

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10-03-2007, 08:44 AM

Posted By: Mark Tsince your only motivation is $ then my opinion would be PSA. I say this because GAI/SGC don't have the same Registry following (in my opinion). Most collectors who use the registry are trying to complete it and get the best grades. PSA seems to be popular. I have heard GAI is trying to do a better job at grading but the fact remains that once you see a GAI holder you don't know if its been graded last week or a few years ago. But, it will depend on the cards you are having graded. If they are caramels and in nice shape then SGC or PSA are the way to go. Of course you will have to spend $100 for PSA membership and get 6 free vouchers. You get their POP report and SMR so everyone is different. My opinion would be pay PSA the $ for membership and have them grade your cards. Remember: this is only my opinion and you will get many more.

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10-03-2007, 08:46 AM

Posted By: Jimmyfor Pre-1930s cards SGC would be fine and with 1930s cards PSA seems to get a bit more - it really depends - both PSA and SGC prices have been good GAI values have been down Jimmy

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10-03-2007, 08:49 AM

Posted By: Joe D.no doubt - SGC is the right way to go.

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10-03-2007, 08:49 AM

Posted By: ZinnSGC vs. GAI, go with SGC regardless of issue. E cards prior to 1913 go with SGC E cards post 1913 go with PSA T cards that appear Ex or better go with PSA T cards that appear less than Ex go with SGC Goudeys, Playball and the like go with PSA Just my 2 cents

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10-03-2007, 08:53 AM

Posted By: MattJoe D - are you saying in your experience SGC graded cards bring in more then PSA?

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10-03-2007, 08:54 AM

Posted By: Mark LI will agree with Zinn

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10-03-2007, 09:12 AM

Posted By: Phil GarrySGC is thhe far better choice between those two.

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10-03-2007, 09:20 AM

Posted By: Joe D.it really depends on the cards you have. I think PSA brings in more money when we are talking about key registry cards (but maybe someone else knows better on the subject). Other than those situations... I don't know that you will get more for a PSA graded card than you would an SGC card. I am not a big seller of cards - so maybe someone has better statistical information for you. But, even with statistical information - you don't know how each company would grade the cards (we can hope the graded would be the same, but that is not how it goes). What I do believe, without question, if I was in your shoes... and was deciding about which company to send my cards to... I would send them to SGC without hesitation. The customer service is second to none, the quality and the reputation is top-notch - and the value will be there in the cards.

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10-03-2007, 09:42 AM

Posted By: MattI'm certain for my own cards, I would send them to SGC as well; the question is in terms of realized market value.

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10-03-2007, 09:55 AM

Posted By: MVSNYC"realized market value"...? SGC, no questions!

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10-03-2007, 09:59 AM

Posted By: Joe D.without knowing the cards you are talking about - I can't imagine it would make that big of a difference either way. So, again - my preference is SGC (by a wide margin). But - if you list the cards - and the grades you think you might receive (even a range would work).... maybe someone who is familiar with registry toughies might be able to tell you if there are any to consider. Its difficult to give a better answer without knowing the cards and condition.

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10-03-2007, 10:23 AM

Posted By: MattLet's say this is an average card for the lot (this one actually isn't mine; but the player and condition approximate mine): <img src="http://i6.ebayimg.com/07/i/000/b4/ed/44d5_1.JPG">

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10-03-2007, 10:29 AM

Posted By: T206CollectorSGC for that condition card, easily. Follow Mastro's lead in having Lionel Carter's collection graded -- if the card is a key registry component on the PSA Set Registry, go with PSA. Otherwise, SGC is the way to go.

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10-03-2007, 10:31 AM

Posted By: BobHas PSA finally fixed their holders for caramel cards so they don't bounce around and slip all over the place in those condoms?

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10-03-2007, 10:50 AM

Posted By: JimBI agree with Zinn as well. GAI is definately not the answer. Maybe one day they will get their **** together, but I am not holding my breath. JimB

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10-03-2007, 10:53 AM

Posted By: MattI thought perhaps PSA would give me a price boost for cards on this low end since they don't differentiate between poor and fair so that a buyer checking old sale prices would presume a poor condition card to have the same value as a fair condition card.

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10-03-2007, 10:54 AM

Posted By: Dave FFrom my own experience...any of the common pre-war issues...T206's, T205's, Goudey's...I would go with PSA because of the registries. Otherwise, anything scarce or off the wall, I do think SGC is the way to go.

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10-03-2007, 11:03 AM

Posted By: Frank WakefieldWatch eBay for a couple of weeks. T206s would be the easiest to follow. Find some in GAI holders, then look for similar cards in SGC. I think you'll find that SGC cards sell for more. SGC cards have more bidders. Buyers seem to think that if a card is in a GAI holder there must be some reason it isn't in an SGC or PSA holder, such as maybe it was graded, came back low or A, then it was sent to GAI. The straightforward answer to your question is SGC. And that is from someone who doesn't collect slabbed cards, but who occasionally buys a slabbed card only to bust him out. Most cards I've sold that were graded for sale were graded by SGC, they know what they're doing, and buyers know they know.

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10-03-2007, 11:11 AM

Posted By: MattFrank - what about SGC vs PSA?

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10-03-2007, 11:26 AM

Posted By: Frank WakefieldAgain, you could watch eBay for a few weeks, and get a feel for it. In looking at what Zinn and Mark L posted, I think they/Zinn has it about right. Seems to me that SGC is a bit more exacting in what they do. PSA gets the card identity incorrect (sometimes the player, but what I mean is that sometimes they have incorrectly identified the set from which the card came). Still, a lot of folks love graded cards and all the set registry stuff, and a high grade T206 in a PSA holder may well outsell the same card in an SGC holder. Kinda like what Zinn said. Personally, I think SGC is better than PSA. But the market for PSA cards seems stronger, so for some cards get them graded according to Zinn to maximize your sales price. A catchy phrase there, "according to Zinn".

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10-03-2007, 11:46 AM

Posted By: Zinn<img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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10-03-2007, 12:46 PM

Posted By: JimBIn that grade, I think SGC and PSA are about a toss-up. For more obscure issues, go with SGC. For T206 in low-grade, it doesn't matter. All that matters is who is bidding that day and how much they want the card. SGC has nicer holders and that may make the difference. JimB

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10-03-2007, 02:01 PM

Posted By: BobOn the other hand, I am glad you all are trashing cards in GAI holders, it makes for less spirited bidding from my competitors. For the umpteenth time, buy the card not the holder. The idea that cards are in GAI holders instead of SGC and PSA (that something is wrong with the GAI cards) is crap. I split my first 50 E94s, sending 25 to SGC and 25 to GAI. The grading was almost identical, GAI was just as tough as SGC was on the caramels. I have had some problems with GAI regarding customer service or lost cards but not on the grading. I have not had a lick of problem with SGC on customer service, that's where GAI needs to get its s$#% together.

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10-03-2007, 02:09 PM

Posted By: MattBob - this thread is about which grading service gets the most on ebay auctions; not which grading service provides better service or is more accurate in their grading. That is an entirely different discussion. I believe the argument advanced here is that the market does not yet give GAI the weight they give to SGC/PSA.

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10-03-2007, 02:13 PM

Posted By: BobMatt- I agree GAI gets the least bang for the buck in most cases. I was simply responding to the comment made by a previous poster about GAI's grading and why GAI cards might go for less because of that. I don't think that's irrelevant in discussing the relative values of PSA, SGC and GAI cards. tbob

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10-03-2007, 03:10 PM

Posted By: sagardYou have to look at your costs of grading vs. your overall cash return. PSA has a $100 signup fee and may depending on issue be a lot more expensive than SGC to grade on a per card basis. Low grade cards are going to sell based off their Ebay presention and the cards individual eye appeal more directly than which holder the card is in.

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10-03-2007, 03:11 PM

Posted By: Mattsagard - I agree; that's why the question is out there. With cards like the example posted, which grading service would get me the highest bottom line; grading fees included.

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10-03-2007, 03:22 PM

Posted By: Frank WakefieldT Bob, I almost completely agree. I buy the card and trash the holder. That's almost 'buy the card, not the holder', isn't it? Seems to me that there's usually something wrong with a GIA card if you look for it. Maybe because if it is near mint then it is sent to SGC or PSA....

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10-03-2007, 08:46 PM

Posted By: bigfishSGC with any card issue is the way to go. They rarely make mistakes and you know what you are getting when you buy their card. I bought a GAI 2 cracker jack the other night off ebay with a pin hole in it. That is terrible. SGC vs all of the companies. Not even close IMO. SGC wins and will continue to win. They are rock solid. It also appears that their pre war cards are selling alittle higher than the other companies.

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10-04-2007, 07:50 AM

Posted By: JKI agree completely with bigfish (hey Toby) regarding SGC. They are the best by a long shot.

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10-04-2007, 02:08 PM

Posted By: JoannMatt, I understand the boat you're in with the SGC half-grades. I just sent in 6 to SGC and debated a long time whether to use PSA for that exact reason. There were a few that I thought were low end 2's maybe. PSA would almost certainly have given them 2's, if they had to choose between a 2 and a 1. I really don't think they would have given them 1's. But SGC doesn't have to choose between 1 or 2. They have that 1.5 option, and I was afraid that I would be sacrificing the half grade by not making PSA pick between a 1 and a 2. So I looked on cardpricer to see what the difference was. I was surprised that, for the few cards I had, the PSA 2 price was comparable to or lower than the SGC "1" price (the SGC 1 on cardpricer combines all sales for both the 10 and 20 - so the 1.5 is in with the 1's). Three of the cards did get the dreaded 20 - and I absolutely know as sure as I'm sitting here that PSA would have given them 2's. But I don't think I'll end up with less money for them. I debated a long time though, and in the end once I thought it wasn't that much of a money difference I went with SGC because their submission process is easier and it only cost $10 per card instead of $15. Joann PS - all three of the borderline cards are worth less than $100 graded. If it were an expensive card - like $250 or more (okay okay all you high rollers - $250 is expensive to me! lol) - I would have gone with PSA without a second thought. At some point I do think the difference between a PSA 2 and an SGC 1.5 would show up in price.

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10-04-2007, 03:05 PM

Posted By: barrysloateIn my recently concluded auction SGC cards realized higher prices than PSA or GAI cards in the same grade. I think SGC has finally overtaken PSA in every condition.

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10-04-2007, 03:28 PM

Posted By: JKBased on the scans, I think that Jim's estimate that they would all grade in the vg to excellent range is incorrect. I think you are looking at anywhere from an SGC30/PSA 2 to an SGC50/PSA 4 on your cards. Even so, those are great cards and will be in demand if you chose to sell.

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10-04-2007, 03:32 PM

Posted By: ZinnMy guess is that 80% of the participation in your auction was from Net54 memebers, active or lurkers. It is therefore not surprising, given the majority preference for SGC, that you would make that observation.

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10-04-2007, 03:55 PM

Posted By: barrysloateZinn- that's actually a fair point. Obviously, this board is pro-SGC by a large margin. I didn't think of it that way.

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10-04-2007, 04:48 PM

Posted By: Mark LIt may be true that SGC is overtaking PSA but in certain sets, at high grades, my PSA cards sell for more than my SGCs. Registry fever, I think.

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10-05-2007, 08:22 PM

Posted By: peter chaoSGC has their own registry and over time it may become as popular as PSA's. Peter C.

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10-05-2007, 08:25 PM

Posted By: Jeff LichtmanActually, I doubt that very much.

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10-06-2007, 11:44 AM

Posted By: peter chaoWell, you would have said the same thing 5 years ago about whether SGC would have ever been as highly regarded as PSA, now they are almost there. PSA registry people want and expect high quality service. But isn't that what SGC is known for? It's quite possible that SGC's registry will be more popular as time passes. Peter C.

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10-06-2007, 12:00 PM

Posted By: Steve Murray From the SGC Website: There are currently 1741 registered sets. From the PSA Website: Today there are 30019 sets registered. Do the math.

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10-06-2007, 12:04 PM

Posted By: peter chaoSteve, Obviously PSA has a big edge right now. But how about all the people who think that SGC is a higher quality service, won't they start registries with SGC? On a sidenote, wouldn't it be nice for the Cubbies to get into the WS this year? Peter C. Edited to add: Sometimes it just comes down to aesthetics, I prefer the SGC holders simply because it seems like I see the card first. Whereas, with PSA the red holder is the first thing you see.

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10-06-2007, 12:15 PM

Posted By: Ricky YPSA I think will always be ahead on the registry issue. Its simply branded into people's minds...like Coke..and that's a hard thing to overcome. But I suppose it could be done..Japanese cars overtook Detroit over time...by listening to what the customer wants... <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14> as for SGC vs GAI on a pure dollar return basis...I think the same thing...SGC is more brand name than GAI and will get better dollars. Ricky Y

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10-06-2007, 01:04 PM

Posted By: BobWell, I was told 3 years ago to submit my complete set of SGC graded 1910 Series 150 Obaks to SGC and they would add it to their Registry. Despite a couple of follow up phone calls, it never appeared. Scott H. apologized to me at the National in Chicago a year later and said it would be added. That was over a year ago and it still doesn't appear. It doesn't make me want to rush to add any of my other sets to their Registry...

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10-06-2007, 04:37 PM

Posted By: MikeU"Well, I was told 3 years ago to submit my complete set of SGC graded 1910 Series 150 Obaks to SGC and they would add it to their Registry. Despite a couple of follow up phone calls, it never appeared. Scott H. apologized to me at the National in Chicago a year later and said it would be added. That was over a year ago and it still doesn't appear. It doesn't make me want to rush to add any of my other sets to their Registry..." tbob, They have the T212 set listed? <a href="http://www.sgccardregistry.com/index.asp?action=2&setcategory=1&setid=581" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.sgccardregistry.com/index.asp?action=2&setcategory=1&setid=581</a>

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10-06-2007, 04:46 PM

Posted By: BobMike- they now have the 1910 T212 Obak Series of 175 listed but not the series of 150. The 150 series has cards with different fronts than the 175 series (many are the same) but all backs are different. This isn't a situation similar to the T206 set where all the Uzits comprise a subset or in the T207s where all the Cycles are a subset, this is a totally different set. tbob

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10-06-2007, 06:21 PM

Posted By: MikeU"Mike- they now have the 1910 T212 Obak Series of 175 listed but not the series of 150. The 150 series has cards with different fronts than the 175 series (many are the same) but all backs are different. This isn't a situation similar to the T206 set where all the Uzits comprise a subset or in the T207s where all the Cycles are a subset, this is a totally different set. tbob" I think they meant the one registry to cover both sets. Here is the comment they have for the set. "* Indicates a card that exists with both "150 subjects" back and "175 subjects" back"

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10-06-2007, 06:38 PM

Posted By: MikeUtbob, A potential confusing part of the request could have been the reference to 1910, which relates to T212-2 with 175 cards. The T212-1's are dated to 1909 with 76 cards.

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10-07-2007, 01:50 AM

Posted By: BobMike- I see where you are coming from, that the 1910 Obak series of 150 cards doesn't (for some bizarre reason) have its own designation such as T212-2A or T212-4 but the mere fact SGC says that "certain cards exist with both 150 and 175 series backs" doesn't make sense as the fronts of cards like McArdle, Griffin, Willis and Mundorff have completely different fronts from the 175 series cards. Makes no sense. Also if SGC had kept its word about putting the 150 series set in the registry, then you would at least find a registry entry in the regular T212-2 section with my set in it and indicating that the "set" was almost 40% complete. Makes no sense. I could care less one way or the other but it is pretty careless the way the omission was handled.... tbob

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10-07-2007, 06:58 AM

Posted By: FYSDoes a formal T212-2 (150 Subjects) checklist exist?

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10-07-2007, 07:20 AM

Posted By: JimCrandellI think you could do a Harvard Business School study on the different approaches that GAI and SGC took to penetrate the market SGC slow and steady with an emphasis on quality and GAI with an emphasis on their prior dealer(and collector) relationships. So far, SGC seems like the better business model. But the game is not over. Mike Baker still maintains a reputation by many old-time collectors in the hobby as the best grader there is and I think it is too early to count them out. I am having dinner with Mike this coming Monday(with Kevin and others) and it will be interesting to hear first-band their strategy going forward. Last point is I have to agree with Jeff(and others) and disagree with Peter(once again) that PSA has a huge embedded advantage with the PSA Set Registry nand is not going to be overtaken by anyone unless there is a huge scandal or something truly unexpected. A stroke of genius by David Hall.

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10-07-2007, 09:05 AM

Posted By: jeffK If SGC's registry was as friendly and functional as PSA's registry, there would be many more participants. For example, there's no convenient way of checking to see what's "new" on the SGC registry. Any new or updated SGC registry set is the falling tree in the forest that no one hears. There are other issues too, but this thread isn't about registries. Neveretheless, an inferior registry hasn't affected the market value of pre-war SGC cards. I think buyers/bidders have a confidence in SGC's accuracy and consistency, and this confidence grows steadily, card by card. And unlike GAI, SGC won't lose your cards.