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06-30-2005, 04:00 PM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>In my lifetime, there is no debate in my mind. As a kid I played<br />hooky on Oct 8th in 1956. Little did I know what I was in for.<br /> Well, as most of us know, that was the day Don Larsen pitched a<br />perfect No-Hit game against the Dodgers.<br /><br />He was quite modest afterword when he told the press the Dodgers<br />made it easy for me, I only needed 97 pitches to win the game.<br /><br />Well, it might have been easy for him; but two events occurred<br />that could have changed the complexion of the game. Jackie Rob-<br />inson hit a sharp grounder that was booted by the 2nd baseman<br />and was fielded by Gil McDougald (at SS) who whipped the ball to<br />1st base to get Jackie out by half a step.<br /><br />The 2nd event was a monster hit by Gil Hodges to the monuments<br />in deep left-center (death valley in the old Yankee Stadium).<br />Mantle took off like a rabbit and caught up with it to preserve<br />the No-Hitter and possibly the game. Mantle, also won the game<br />with a two-run homer.<br /><br />Sal Maglie pitched a great game for the Dodgers that day limiting<br />the Yankees to just 3 hits, until Mantle homered.

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06-30-2005, 04:07 PM
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>Nomo no hitter at Coors Field.

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06-30-2005, 04:14 PM
Posted By: <b>Lee Behrens</b><p>The 2 pitchers, yes 2, in the longest games ever. Brooklyn's Leon Cadore and Boston's Joe Oeschger. They both pitched all 26 innings of a 1-1 tie that was called because of darkness.<br /><br />You certainly wouldn't even see a modern day pitcher pitch half those innings.

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06-30-2005, 04:17 PM
Posted By: <b>Glenn</b><p>I'm inclined to go with Larsen on this one, but I'd have Harvey Haddix 2nd among pitchers. 19 total bases for Shawn Green in his four homer game is the best single-game hitting performance that comes to mind.

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06-30-2005, 04:19 PM
Posted By: <b>Andy Baran</b><p>I think it was the 1977 World Series. 3 pitches / 3 homers. Hard to beat that in a pressure situation.<br /><br />Edited to say that this is an unbiased opinion. I HATE THE YANKEES!

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06-30-2005, 04:23 PM
Posted By: <b>dennis</b><p>i've always thought if i could see one game it would be harvey haddix 1959 perfect game thru 12 innings against the milwaukee braves.best pitching performance ever?

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06-30-2005, 04:45 PM
Posted By: <b>Julie</b><p>('72? 74?): He scored 10 points; everyone else on the team scored ten points. It was like he was the hub of a giant wheel...<br /><br />I neither saw it nor heard it, but I'd have to go with Larsen...

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06-30-2005, 06:14 PM
Posted By: <b>Adam J. Moraine</b><p>Oct 8, 1956 (Larsen's p.w.s.g)<br /><br />Best Regards,<br /><br />Adam J. Moraine

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06-30-2005, 06:18 PM
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>Shawn Green 4hr and two more hits in a nine inning game. Alltime TB in 1 game record (19). 5/23/2002<br /><br />Pitching, whoever struck out 20 in a game. Shutouts and no hitters are team-oriented achievements. 20Ks is the pitcher's sweat.

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06-30-2005, 06:23 PM
Posted By: <b>Adam J. Moraine</b><p>Adam W,<br /><br />Who is Shawn Green? Why are you logged in as anon? Mr. Boxingcardman.... J/K Buddy! <br /><br />Best Regards,<br /><br />Adam J. Moraine

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06-30-2005, 06:41 PM
Posted By: <b>Chris Counts</b><p>I remember a game a few years that was pitched by Kerry Wood. He was facing a typically loaded Houston Astros lineup (Bagwell, Biggio, Alou, etc.) in a day game at Wrigley Field. I don't remeber all the details, but I remember him giving up one hit and striking out about 20 without giving up a walk. I read the box score the next day and I thought "This has got be to be just about the greatest game anyone has ever pitched."<br />

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06-30-2005, 08:53 PM
Posted By: <b>Lee Behrens</b><p>Strikeouts are overrated, I believe Clemens gave up 2 runs in his 20 K performance, Woods was better I believe a 2 hit shotout. I don't think they last 12 or 13 innings.

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06-30-2005, 08:57 PM
Posted By: <b>davidcycleback</b><p>The time outfielder Jose Canseco headed that home run was impressive. Eat your heart out Bo and Deon. Jose not only did two sports, he did them on the same play.

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06-30-2005, 09:01 PM
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>Gotta be Rick Wise:<br /><br />No-hitter and two home runs. He dominates on both sides of the baseball. Who can top that?

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06-30-2005, 09:02 PM
Posted By: <b>R. Cook</b><p>Small Trivia:<br /><br />September 4, 1993 at Yankee Stadium<br />

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06-30-2005, 09:17 PM
Posted By: <b>MikeB</b><p>I think the guys name is Tatis...2 Grand Slams in the Same Inning a few years ago.

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06-30-2005, 09:38 PM
Posted By: <b>john/z28jd</b><p>Trivia answer would be Jim Abbott throwing a no-hitter which could be considered one of the most remarkable feats.How about Pete Gray getting 3 hits and 2 rbi's in a game vs the Yankees and Atley Donald who had a career record of 65-33.The guy had only one arm!

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06-30-2005, 09:44 PM
Posted By: <b>ramram</b><p>Vander Meer's second no-hitter. Could you imagine the late-inning pressure of the second no-hit game in a row.<br /><br />Rob M.

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07-01-2005, 12:36 AM
Posted By: <b>pete</b><p>that 2 grand slammers in one inning i think was miguel tejeda, oakland a's i believe...

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07-01-2005, 03:52 AM
Posted By: <b>Mike McGrail</b><p>Rennie Stennett 7 for 7 on Sep 16 1975

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07-01-2005, 05:02 AM
Posted By: <b>Jimi</b><p>the best single inning by a player?<br /><br />Carlos Baerga hits switching homeruns in the same inning. Still the only player ever to do it.<br><br>Jimi

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07-01-2005, 06:23 AM
Posted By: <b>Peter_Spaeth</b><p>Maybe not THE best, but a badly injured Pedro Martinez coming in in relief and pitching 6 near perfect innings to keep the Red Sox alive against the Indians in the 99? playoffs was an incredible performance.

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07-01-2005, 06:33 AM
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>The guy who hit two grannies in one inning was Fernando Tatis for the St. Louis Cardinals.<br /><br />The one hit Wood gave up was an infield single.

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07-01-2005, 07:38 AM
Posted By: <b>identify7</b><p>It is great when you finally get everything to come together after trying and failing for soo long. The NY Giants did it in 1954 and a few years earlier Pat Seerey did it.<br /><br />Pat Seerey was a player in the fourties who every time he came up to bat he wanted a home run. Well he got as many as 26 in a year, but he typically also had a strikeout ratio of greater than 25% and a BA in the low .200s (he also had three stolen bases in seven seasons.<br /><br />Well on July 18, 1948 Pat joined the elite circle of players, including Gehrig, Hodges, Delahanty, Klein, Adcock, Mays et. al., who hit four homeruns in a game (11 innings - but it still counts).

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07-01-2005, 08:05 AM
Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>Bottomly had 12 RBI in 1 game. <br /><br />"Listen up, Sunny Jim, I ate a baby!" Fat Bastard

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07-01-2005, 08:19 AM
Posted By: <b>john/z28jd</b><p>Hard hittin' Mark Whiten had 4 hr's AND 12 rbi's in one game.I think the funny thing is that he finished the season with 99 rbi's.If he couldve just hit that 5th homer instead of popping up he wouldve had a 100 rbi season.His 2nd best season he had 53 rbi's.He also was coming off nearly a month long stretch of not hitting a home run before that game

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06-20-2006, 07:35 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>The worst single game performance!<br /><br />My vote for this took place in the Oeschger/Cadore marathon which Lee cited. Of course, one hitter had to set the standard for futility in that contest. And that player was the second baseman Charlie Pick, who went 0 - 11. Hitting into at least one double play, that I know of.

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06-20-2006, 07:43 AM
Posted By: <b>H Murphy</b><p>What`s almost as hard to believe, Tatis hit 2 grannies in one inning and they BOTH came off the same guy! Wow, give up a GS and still be in there to give up the second one in the same inning.

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06-20-2006, 08:16 AM
Posted By: <b>Jerry</b><p>Brooks Robinson 1970 World Series, You pick the game.

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06-20-2006, 08:33 AM
Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>I think Larson is still it, a World Series game is a bit more than a normal game.<br /><br />I listened to the Tatis grand slams and the Whitten home runs on the radio. My recollection is that Whitten came close to hitting a fifth.<br /><br />Musial hit 5 home runs in one day, but it was a double header. My recollection is that he had a sore wrist, and took only 5 swings that day...<br /><br />Since this wasn't limited to a major league game, I turn to my T210 interests... Fred Toney pitched a 17 inning no hitter on May 10, 1909, as Winchester beat Lexington in the Blue Grass League. My recollection is that Toney won his next outing, didn't allow a hit the first 2 innings of that game, and finally won it as a 1 hit shutout. Toney was later involved in the double no-hitter in the majors on May 2, 1917. Toney was up for Cincinnati pitching against Chicago's Hippo Vaughn, each pitched nine hitless innings. The Reds won, 1-0, in the the 10th as Vaughn yielded two hits, while Toney finished the game without allowing a hit.<br /><br />So 17 innings of no hits, that is a good day. A long game in the day light! Not some half=lit night no hitter.

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06-20-2006, 08:46 AM
Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p><img src="http://photobucket.com/albums/j106/greatwake/th_1909TeamStudio300dpi.jpg"><br />This is a neat cabinet of the 1909 Winchester team...<br /><br />And one day I need to learn how do do this photobucket thing... wish the image was bigger.

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06-20-2006, 08:47 AM
Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p><img src="http://photobucket.com/albums/j106/greatwake/th_56ToneyWinchesterT210OldMills.jpg"><br />Fred Toney

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06-20-2006, 09:04 AM
Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Frank--Great post! Do you have more stories about players who appear in the T210 set?

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06-20-2006, 09:44 AM
Posted By: <b>Bill Stone</b><p>I agree with Frank --May 10, 1909 Lexington Colts and Winchester Hustlers --Fred Toney's 17 inning no hitter.

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06-20-2006, 01:23 PM
Posted By: <b>nbrazil</b><p>"What`s almost as hard to believe, Tatis hit 2 grannies in one inning and they BOTH came off the same guy! Wow, give up a GS and still be in there to give up the second one in the same inning."<br /><br />Took the words right out of my mouth. The pitcher actually did well for himself...given that he got a 60 million dollar deal a few years later from the rangers (chan ho park).

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06-20-2006, 01:59 PM
Posted By: <b>ScottIngold</b><p>For sheer amazment and a single event i say Kirk Gibson's homer off of Eck. Than gimping around the base's.<br /><br /><br />I know it's one at bat..... but for drama!!!!!!

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06-20-2006, 02:41 PM
Posted By: <b>Joe D.</b><p>Kirk Gibson home run was one of the best things I have ever seen on a baseball field.<br /><br />Hobbling up to the plate, smacking a game winning home run, and "running" around the bases.<br /><br />Maybe it doesn't compare to some of the others because the others were whole game performances... but Kirk Gibson's HR is pretty hard to beat all by itself.<br /><br />

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06-20-2006, 03:34 PM
Posted By: <b>J Levine</b><p>I was actually at the game at Dodger Stadium when Park gave up the two Grand Slams in one inning...after the first one, he was booed badly. When Tatis came up again with the bases loaded, I clearly remember my friends and I taking bets from the guys behind us that if he hit another, we would buy the next round of beers...that was an expensive day for us. Park was booed for nearly 10 minutes after the second. Tatis was cheered loudly though even when he took a curtain call. We were shocked to see the second one go out. I still have the ticket...<br /><br />Joshua

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06-20-2006, 06:46 PM
Posted By: <b>anthony</b><p>Me...i pitched a 1 hitter (cheesey in field single), struck out 12, and had the only rbi which was a triple in the first inning to clinch the little league city championships...

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06-20-2006, 08:46 PM
Posted By: <b>andy becker</b><p>i have to agree with the posts above. the larson perfect game is the greatest single game acomplishment. no question, imo.<br /><br />i also recall mike scott of the astros pitching a no hitter as the astros clinched the division. that was something too.<br /><br />the greatest single at bat in my lifetime was the gibson home run. the a's were prohibitive favorites and gibson changed the whole series with one swing. i still get chills watching replays.<br /><br />mike, rennie stennent was 7 for 7....but that cub team was bad....really bad.<br />i was in the stands for that game. <br /><br />the kerry wood strikeout game was amazing, but the astros were a free swinging team with virtually no lefties. what made that game even more impressive was that it was kerry's fifth (or so) major league start. i wish he could've stayed healthy......as we say in cubbyland....what could have been....<br /><br /><br />

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06-20-2006, 09:09 PM
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>I think one has been missed and I throw it out there as an honorable mention. Ernie Shore's perfect game for the Boston Red Sox after the starting pitcher walked the first batter and was thrown out for arguing balls and stikes. Poor Babe Ruth. Here is Shore's 1916 Green Joyce card:<br /><br /><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1150772916.JPG">

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06-20-2006, 10:36 PM
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>Cesar Gutierrez of Detroit, a liftime 230 hitter, went<br />7 for 7 in a game....that is pretty good for a lame boy.

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06-20-2006, 11:18 PM
Posted By: <b>Brendan</b><p>I dont know if any of you have seen video of Wood's 20K game, but it is an incredible performance. I downloaded the game off mlb.com because I hadn't seen it and was curious. The things he was able to do with the ball back then were incredible. I recall an article talking about the most dominant single-game pitching performances based on several statistical measurements, and Wood's was #1. Number 2 was a Koufax perfect game I think.

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06-20-2006, 11:38 PM
Posted By: <b>Dan Koochin</b><p>Joe Carters' World series winning home run. <br /><br />But I did see a great 'performance' last year, had very<br />little to do with baseball (but Scioscia and Robinson<br />were putting on a helluva circus performance)<br /><br />2005<br />During the seventh inning of the Angels’ 6-3 loss to the Washington Nationals, Nationals Manager Robinson had umpires check Angel reliever Brendan Donnelly’s glove. The umpires found a foreign substance on Donnelly’s glove and Donnelly was ejected. After Donnelly’s ejection, Angel Manager Mike Scioscia had some 'choice words' for Robinson and that incensed Frank. Frank began to go after Scioscia and both benches cleared and both bullpens cleared. Former Angel and current National outfielder Jose Guillen had to be restrained from going after some of the Angels by Washington coaches. A huge melee of players struggled and grapple on the pitchers mound as if in a 'rugby scrum'. Out from underneath them, wily ol' Frank Robinson crawls out with the doctored ball! <br /><br />Anyway, after that inning, Scioscia engaged in his own gamesmanship and asked umpires to check the Nationals’ pitcher’s glove. They did , but Sciosia insisted it was not good enough, <br />and amazingly the umpires complied with his demands to 'check it more'. As far as I recall the glove tassels were deemed to be 'too long' so they stop the game to find a pair of scissors to cut the offending rawhide tassels! <br /> <br />Scot Shields came in for Donnelly, and he's now facing the still enraged Guillen who from what I saw, points to Sciosia defiantly and 'calls his shot'. Shields gave up a game-tying home run to Guillen in the eighth - along with two more runs and the Nationals won.<br /><br />(Note: Donelly suspended for 8 games by MLB)

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06-21-2006, 08:19 PM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>I could pick the game in which Bill Bevens came within one out of a No-Hitter<br />against the Dodgers, only to lose it by a hit off Cookie Lavagetto's bat.<br /> But, any one of the 7 games in that Series are exciting. To me the 1947 World<br />Series between the Yankees and Dodgers has to rank as one of the most exciting<br />post seaon contests ever played. If you can view a tape of it, I think you will agree.<br /><br />Check-it-out.<br /><br />T-Rex Ted<br /><br />

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06-21-2006, 10:48 PM
Posted By: <b>Mark</b><p>Addie Joss. Perfect game, on the next to last day of the 1908 season, in a four team pennant race, against another Hall of Famer(Ed Walsh).In a pressure packed game that was incredibly hyped before it even started, Joss threw only 74 pitches! And he was perfect! That's an average of 2.74 pitches per batter. The Indians (Naps) won, 1-0.

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06-22-2006, 10:57 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>Although not the greatest anything, I like the no name players who due to statistical quirks or by advantage of extended games, wind up in the record books. Players such as Gus Triandos having the best rate of success in stolen bases solely because he stole a base in his only attempt, and Tom Cheney who struck out 21 of the opposition in a game, and Johnnie Burnett who got nine hits in a game.<br /><br />I collect cards which to me represent this trivia, and I really enjoy this diversion from the Cobb/Hornsby/Mathewson/Young etc. type of cards.

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06-22-2006, 07:00 PM
Posted By: <b>Bruce Babcock</b><p>After the 1956 WS perfect game Don Larsen was asked by a reporter "Is that the best game you ever pitched?"

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06-23-2006, 05:12 AM
Posted By: <b>dennis</b><p>may 26,1959 harvey haddix throws 12 perfect innings...36 retired in a row!

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06-23-2006, 05:24 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>And the other side of that coin, DCWD, Lew Burdette demonstrates a tremendously gutsy performance by hanging in their for the win, while his opponent hurls a 12 inning perfecto.

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06-23-2006, 05:44 AM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>GIL M.<br /><br />You noted Gus Triandos "great base-stealing" record.....but do you know<br />his real accomplishment that I think no other Catcher in Major League BB<br /> can boast of ?

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06-23-2006, 05:58 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>Gee, I never thought of Triandos as very accomplished. I recognize that he was one of few catchers able to catch Wilhelm's knuckler in Hoyt's prime.<br /><br />But what were you thinking of?

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06-23-2006, 07:27 AM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>Yes, you are correct that Triandos was the only guy who could handle Wilhelm's knuckler. And,<br />because of this, he was the catcher who caught Wilhelm's NO-HITTER (9/2/58 Balt. 1 - NYY 0).<br /><br />Also in 1958....Jim Bunning pitched his 1st NO-Hitter (Detroit 3 vs Boston 0).<br /><br />And, on June 21, 1964 Bunning (Phillies) pitched a PERFECT NO-HITTER vs the NY Mets<br /><br />Guess who caught that game.......Gus Triandos.<br /><br />So, both of these guys have been involved with No-Hitters in both Leagues.<br />I don't think there are other Major Leaguers that have done this ?<br /><br />Another TRIVIA ?....Who pitched a NO-HITTER in his 1st ML appearance ?<br /><br />HINT....he is on a tough T206 card.<br /><br />T-Rex Ted

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06-23-2006, 07:49 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>Was it that 9/2/58 game where Mantle struck out his first three times (or was it 2?) batting left handed against him, then out of frustration, tried it right handed, and struck out again?<br /><br />I'll get back to you on that t206 question, unless someone beats me - I know the answer .... but it is waay back in the dark section of my memory, back where all the spiders live, down the stairs, way down.

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06-23-2006, 08:31 AM
Posted By: <b>Rich Klein</b><p>Jeff Torborg caught no-hitters in each league:<br /><br />Koufax perfecto in the NL and a Ryan no-no in the AL<br /><br />Ted Breitesttein tossed a no-no in his ML debut.<br /><br />I miss your questions at Willow Grove/Fort Washington<br /><br />Rich

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06-23-2006, 10:08 AM
Posted By: <b>Gilbert Maines</b><p>I guess I did not know that after all. I never heard of Ted Breitestein.<br /><br />I also didn't know that Charles (Bumpus) Jones threw a no-hitter in his 10/15/1892 debut.

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06-23-2006, 12:14 PM
Posted By: <b>Scott T</b><p>Rick Wise threw a no hitter and also hit two home runs in a game in 1971. (I think.)<br /><br />Scott <br />

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06-23-2006, 12:20 PM
Posted By: <b>Scott T</b><p>I nominate my favorite modern "vintage" player, Nate Colbert.<br /><br />Five home runs in twin bill with 13 RBI.<br /><br /><img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y133/scottopotamus/Nate%20Colbert/1977_Topps_TBC.jpg"><br><br>Scott <br />

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06-23-2006, 01:14 PM
Posted By: <b>Josh Adams</b><p>2005 American League Divison Series, Game 3. <br />Bottom of the 7th, bases loaded and no outs. <br />El Duque comes in on relief for the White Sox, and retires three Boston batters in order to preserve a 4-3 lead, and helf lead the White Sox to the ALCS. The rest, is history.<br><br>Go Go White Sox<br />2005 World Series Champions!

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06-23-2006, 03:03 PM
Posted By: <b>JimB</b><p>If memory serves me correctly Tim Keefe once pitched 18 shutout innings in a single day by pitching both ends of a double header. I would like to see a modern day pitcher do that.<br />JimB

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06-23-2006, 03:25 PM
Posted By: <b>Dustan Hedlin</b><p>"Another TRIVIA ?....Who pitched a NO-HITTER in his 1st ML appearance ?"<br /><br /><br />Wilson Alvarez isn't on a T206 card, but he threw a no hitter in his 1st ML appearance. It was around 1993, for the White Sox.<br />

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06-23-2006, 07:52 PM
Posted By: <b>bob donaldson</b><p>9/10/1999 Red Sox 3 Yankees 1<br />Pedro gave up a HR to Chile Davis, that was it. I don't even thing they got a loud foul ball off him after that. 17 Ks, totally dominating.<br /><br />David Cone (he of the perfect game) said it was the best pitched gaem he'd ever seen.

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06-23-2006, 08:47 PM
Posted By: <b>Mark Evans</b><p>I'll sign on to Rennie Stennett. I remember this feat when accomplished, and it struck me as remarkable at the time. Not to take anything away from Larsen (or others), especially as a lifelong Yankee fan. Mark

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06-24-2006, 07:46 AM
Posted By: <b>Rich Klein</b><p>But Mr. Alvarez had made his major league debut in 1989; in a showcase game just before he was included in the now infamous package which included Sammy Sosa to the White Sox for DH Harold Baines.<br /><br />What you <i>CAN</i> say about Alvarez which is correct and a neat trivia fact is that he was the first player born in the 1970's to play in the major leagues.<br /><br />Regards<br />Rich

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06-24-2006, 09:42 AM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>Rich<br /><br />You are correct....Ted Breitenstein was the 1st pitcher to throw a No-Hitter in<br /> his very 1st ML game.<br /><br />And, I knew there had to be another Catcher who had caught No-Hitters in both<br />Major Leagues.....Jeff Torborg......once again you got me.<br /><br />It was a lot fun exchanging Trivia with you in the good old Willow Grove days.<br /> If I recall right, you won every time.....Except when I got you with my W.S. quiz<br />regarding Johnny Sain.<br /><br />So, here is a follow-up on Johnny Sain....what is special about him ?

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06-24-2006, 10:00 AM
Posted By: <b>Rich Klein</b><p>Johnny Sain was the pitching coach for 3 different AL teams which went to the World Series in the 1960's:<br /><br />Yankees 61; Twins 65 and Tigers 68<br /><br />He is also credited with being the mentor for Leo Mazzone.<br /><br />He was traded to the Yankees in a very similar manner to Doyle Alexander to the Braves in which the Braves picked up a future big winner (Lew Burdette)<br /><br />Could you be a "tad" more specific in your question<br /><br />Rich

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06-24-2006, 11:30 AM
Posted By: <b>Ted Zanidakis</b><p>RICH K.<br /><br />I still cannot stump you....Johnny was a very effective Pitching Coach after his<br />playing years. Johnny was the Yankees coach during their 1961 to 1963 World<br />Championship years. And was major factor in the Twins' Pennant winning year<br />of 1965. Then, he went to Detroit and helped them become the Champs in '68.<br /><br />Finally, Sain went to the White Sox in the early 1970's and Goose Gossage (in<br /> his book) "glowingly" credits Sain for making him into an effective pitcher. Be-<br /> fore Sain became his coach, Gossage admitted he was just a "power thrower".<br /><br />Ted Z<br /> <br /><br />