Need some help with a 19th century baseball cabinet

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>I picked up a cabinet of a baseball team dated 1878. The image is beautiful; the backing is not. The team is called the "meteors" and is from North Attleboro, MA. I don't recognize any of the players. I will scan and post a link to a photo later when I get home. The cabinet is imperial sized and features a printed roster of the 10 players. They are all wearing high top shoes, bib uni's with bow ties and there is a player holding an orange peel ball. There is also a catcher's mask depicted. Any ideas; a google search has come up a dead end.

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Posted By: <b>Trevor Hocking</b><p>WOW Adam you are quit the 19th century baseball guy now. <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14><br /><br />Sounds like a GREAT item specially if it truly from 1878. that would be very early for such a large photo. I would love to see a pic.<br /><br />Trevor

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Posted By: <b>drc</b><p>Even if the team and players are obscure, a nice large 1870s mounted baseball photo will have good value. It depends on condition and aesthetics, but players wearing white shoes and bib uniforms and a lemon peal ball will be most desirable. The catcher's mask was invented in the 1870s, so this would be an early picture of that equipment. Pre-1880 baseball photos are limited, with large version especially desirable.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>As I stated the mount is deteriorating but the image is great. I've had enough old boxing cabinets that I am certain the piece is 19th century. The image shows toning like an OJ (albumen photo), the gold gilt on the mount is tarnished and faded in spots like some of my boxing cabinets. The cabinet is slightly bowed like many of my boxing cabinets. I will post what I can later on.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>I will post the item to my site with a high res scan shortly. The cabinet is too big to fit on the scanner. I have shown the top of the cabinet with the full image, a cu on a player with the catcher's mask, and a cu of the legend on the bottom. Any ideas as to value?<br /><br /><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1147480259.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1147480275.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1147480288.JPG">

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Posted By: <b>Joe_G.</b><p>Nothing to add at the moment, just want to congratulate you on a fine piece.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Joe G.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>link is gone

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Posted By: <b>drc</b><p>The image clarity is hard to beat. It's an 1878 MA team and the catcher's mask was invented at Harvard at 1877. A sports photo with signifcant equipment is worth extra. In part because it makes the image more interesting to everyone and in part because there may be demand from equipment collectors.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>anyone know what that abbreviation means?

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Posted By: <b>Andy Baran</b><p>I believe that "ch.c" stands for change (back-up) catcher, but I could be wrong.

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Posted By: <b>ramram</b><p>Actually, in spite of the condition, the mount adds some value to the image. The appeal is greater for a mount with the printed team and players name versus a blank mount.<br /><br />Rob M.

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Posted By: <b>jason</b><p>Hi Adam, thanks for your help earlier on the legal issue!<br /><br />I wanted to do my best to help you out in return but could not find too much info on the Meteors.<br /><br />I searched my baseball database but the only entry I found for a Meteors club was for an 1866 team listed in Addison NY. <br /><br />From an aesthetic point of view, I think the cabinet is outstanding! The uniforms are nice and the team appears well organised but the star of the show is, as has already been pointed out, the catcher’s mask. To have a shot of such an early example will increase the price about by about 40% over a standard imperial team cabinet. The problems with the mount do not have an overly detrimental impact on pieces pre 1880 (you almost expect clipped corners or stains)<br /><br />Nice Pickup!<br />

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>I got it as part of a large card lot and as I am not a collector of these types of giant pieces I have no idea how to value it for insurance purposes. Are we talking $500? $5,000? $50,000 (I wish)?

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Posted By: <b>drc</b><p>If you post the size of the mount, I can give you a better idea of value.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>It fits into a sleeve for an LP (remember those?).

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Posted By: <b>jason</b><p>Adam, <br /><br />The dimension of the cabinet will make quite a difference to the price! If the standard imperial size of 7x10 then probably about $500-700 but if it is a larger size like a mammoth cabinet then you are looking like $1200 (17x17 +).<br /><br />For your comparison, I recently sold a standard sized circa 1878 cabinet of the Greys Baseball Club displaying an early workmen’s glove for $312 on E-bay (smaller than yours) <br /><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8782424964&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESO%3AIT&rd=1" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8782424964&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESO%3AIT&rd=1</a><br /><br />and a year ago I sold a near mammoth size cabinet of the 1873 Osceola Team featuring the 1st image of HOFer O’Rourke at REA for about $2000 but I thought that cheap even at the time.<br />

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>Amazing what can fall into your hands sometimes.

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Posted By: <b>drc</b><p>The rule of thumb for photographs is that, all other qualities equivillent, the larger the photo the more valuable. Larger sizes have more display value and in general are rarer than smaller sizes. A 12 x 14 inches 1870s baseball is not the largest, but is oversized for the 1870s and even for the 1880s and 1890s. Comparing it to the cabinet card (4-1/2" x 6-1/2"), you can see that it's larger than normal.

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Posted By: <b>Adam J. Baxter</b><p>Nice pick-up Adam! Early photos like this from the New England area are always neat. The South Coast area of Massachusetts (Fall River, New Bedford, etc.)was a hotbed for baseball during the 1870's-'80's. Historical Societies in the area would go nuts over a piece like that.<br /><br />One person you may want to try for info on this team would be Bob Richardson. I corresponded with him by mail a couple of years ago regarding the New England League, but haven't been in touch with him in a while(Perhaps someone else on the board has contact info?). Bob's pretty knowledgable about New England baseball and I wouldn't be surprised if he's heard of this team.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>He had a wealth of information which I will pass on to the new owner of the photo.

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Posted By: <b>Jim Manos</b><p>Thanks Jim Manos