So... do you think this Cap Anson auto is real? [Archive]

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05-09-2005, 02:29 PM

Posted By: CapChronicledHi All, I'm the creator of the website www.capanson.com. When I saw the following ebay auction, I had to know more. <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6958582708&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6958582708&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1</a> Of course I was wary. The auction photos were blurry. The guy is not a regular seller of sports memorabilia. Lots of red flags. I live by the rule if it's too good to be true, it probably is. But still, it did look like a first edition Anson biography. And I did have samples to compare it to, most noticably this recent Robert Edward auction: <a href="http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/site/bid/bidplace.asp?itemid=2421&getauctionid=10" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/site/bid/bidplace.asp?itemid=2421&getauctionid=10</a> So I made arrangements to see it in person. I drove 125 miles one-way to the tiny town of Sheffield Illinois, about 20 miles west of Lasalle/Peru where the book was found. The seller seemed like a genuine guy and we got along well. He met me in town and took me to his house (good sign - a scam artist probably doesn't want you to know where he lives). He said he found the book at a Salvation Army store and bought it for $1 after seeing the inscription. This was in 1996. The book is the real deal, a first edition "A Ball Player's Career" from 1900. It is in poor condition with broken spine, loose binding, but it's all there and the pages are still connected. The inscription appears on the second page. It reads "May 28, 1906 / To my little friend Edwin D. Wrenn / Adrian C. Anson" in black dipped fountain pen. It sure looks authentic to me. It was interesting that the word "friend" appeared in this inscription as well as the one in the Robert Edward auction. That along with the signature sample really made up my mind. The other main factor was that it was in a first edition book, and a hard book (and not cheap one) to find. I'll be taking it with me to the National to have authenticated by PSA/DNA. Just thought I'd post pictures now and see what you all think. Colors may be somewhat off because of lighting. Overall, I think the auto would grade a 9/10. It's very solid. Interested to hear your opinions. I can post the result after the grading. Brad W. <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1115670026.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1115670421.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1115670214.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1115670293.JPG">

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05-09-2005, 02:36 PM

Posted By: leonThis forum is not necessarily for this kind of topic. I don't want to be mean and just delete it AND I haven't updated the forum facts so it can stay. Please know that this site is primarily for the discussion of Pre-WWII baseball cards and related items. Regular participants get some slack on off topic stuff (which this is)....Hopefully you will join in some discussions on cards and be a regular participant....take care ....moderator dude (leon)

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05-09-2005, 02:41 PM

Posted By: CapChronicledYou can delete this topic if you feel it is inappropriate. I would like to adhere to the rules of the board and not anger any regulars with off topic material. Brad

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05-09-2005, 02:44 PM

Posted By: leonYour request is innocent enough and there's no big issue. I like to keep it fairly focused on a regular basis. Hopefully one of our expert autograph lurkers can help you here. In the future shoot me an email about off topic stuff and I will help you....take care

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05-09-2005, 02:58 PM

Posted By: Scott Forrestbut we now have a forum where this type of topic is not only welcome, but very much encouraged. From the following page you can visit the "game used" forum, or the "vintage memorabilia" sub-forum. <a href="http://www.network54.com/Forum/396879" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.network54.com/Forum/396879</a>

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05-09-2005, 03:08 PM

Posted By: leonI just spaced it....thanks.....I am sure Brad can get some help there...and probably here too....I never have an issue with a good occassional off topic question....especially from regular participants. Keeps things lively....later

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05-09-2005, 05:24 PM

Posted By: JulieJay Miller's--acquired last year--gorgeous photo on front. Somewhat less--modest! <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/jphotos/cap2.jpg">

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05-10-2005, 10:27 AM

Posted By: pete ullmanI'm no handwriting expert...but the 2 signatures look dramatically different...especially the capital A's in Anson. Seems odd to me!

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05-10-2005, 10:55 AM

Posted By: Hal LewisI don't think Jay's is a real Cap Anson autograph, and I don't think that Jay holds it out as such. I think the guy who was originally selling the cabinet card said that it "could" be his autograph, but I think someone just wrote Anson's name on the back of the card.

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05-10-2005, 11:48 AM

Posted By: Jay MillerFirst, the Anson signature on the Stevens Cabinet was real and had a LOA from Mike Gutierrez. Unfortunately, as pointed out to me by Lew Lipset and later confirmed by Rob Lifson, the item appeared to be from the Spaulding Collection. I returned the cabinet to the dealer who sold it to me with that message. Rob, who has been working with the FBI on recovering items missing from that collection, was going to have the FBI contact this dealer to see if they could trace it back to its ultimate source. I asked Rob as to the status of this a while ago and he didn't know. Hopefully, it makes its way back to the N Y Public Library.

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05-10-2005, 12:00 PM

Posted By: CapChronicledFrom the samples I've seen, there's a big difference between Anson autos signed "A.C. Anson" and "Adrian Anson." I've spoken to his great-grandson, keeper of his archives and he has confirmed that most of Anson's personal correspondence was signed A.C. Anson. Also most of his sigs on his City Clerk stationary dating from 1905-1907 are "A.C." versions. In presentation copies of his book, he would sign with his full name, a much rarer auto. The "A's" are completely different depending on which way he signed. When just signing "A.C." they are round and loopy. When he wrote out "Adrian" there is a forward tail, and the A is pointed. It's quite dramatic between the two types, and one wouldn't assume they come from the same person. As far as Jay's auto is concerned, I've never seen a writing sample from Anson that was so ornate. It's odd that it is signed on the back of a cabinet photo, not many people would have it signed there by the person on front. It would seem likely that it was done by someone else in order to identify the subject on front. But it is possible Anson took his time for an important friend and signed it that way. The actual signature is very close in style to the other A.C. sigs I've seen, such as the Topps Tribute card on the front page of my website www.capanson.com.

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05-10-2005, 12:17 PM

Posted By: Hal LewisMy bad, Jay. I seemed to remember some discussion about the signature not being from Anson. If you say it was and have documentation, then obviously I am mistaken in my memory.

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05-10-2005, 12:31 PM

Posted By: davidcyclebackHal, there was a discussion of a different Anson cabinet where someone (not Anson) wrote Anson's name on back. That's likely what you were thinking of.

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05-10-2005, 03:30 PM

Posted By: Julie Vognar<img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14>