e92

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Posted By: <b>david&nbsp; </b><p>does anyone own an 92 with the menagerie back

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>I used to own one. I have seen a few over the years. I know of a McGraw, Bemis, Shean and there was a Young in the last Mastro auction that they mistakenly called an "e102".<br /><br />Obviously the animal sets were printed at the same time as the Baseball sets.

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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>I have one...I think it's Shean.....

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>pete or anyone else who might know i have a question about the e92 backs. are there scaricity issues between the various sets aside from the inherent back scarcity. for example is a dockman matty harder to find then a crofts with black back for some reason.

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>David,<br /><br />I'm not sure I understand your question but all E92 players with Croft's Candy backs are harder to find then that player with a Dockman back.

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>pete, let me clarify a bit. with the understanding that crofts in general are more scarce then dockmans is there an instance where a particular player is actually easier to find with a crofts back then a dockman back. for example, recently i have seen more e92 nadja bresnahan's then i have e92 crofts bresnahan's.

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>Oh, ok. Now I see what you're asking. I haven't been able to clearly see any player/back combo that may be harder to find then others. The Bresnahan you mention is due to the fact that that he is not known with any other back besides the Nadjas so when that card becomes available, it will always be a Nadja back - unless you have something cool to tell me!!!! <br /><br />There are 40 players that are known with Dockman backs. Those 40 plus 10 additional players are known with Croft's Candy, Croft's Cocoa, and Nadja backs making 50 players known and 12 additional players, all St. Louis, are only known with Nadja backs. Are these 12 St. Louis players more or less scarce then other players with Nadja backs? Hard to say since you only see them with the one variety back.<br /><br />As far as scarcity levels, this is my experience:<br />- Dockman (most common)<br />- Croft's & Allen (black back)<br />- Croft's & Allen (blue back)<br />- Croft's Cocoa<br />- Nadja Caramels<br />- Croft's & Allen (red back) - Unique, only 2 known.<br /><br />There is a big difference between the Dockman and Croft's Candy availablity. There is little difference between the Croft's Cocoa and Nadja availablity.<br /><br /><br />WARNING! SHAMLESS PLUG: <br />I talk about this on my web site. Wait until tomorrow and go to: www.caramel-cards.com/e92.html<br /><br />Right now that page is about one of the scum on eBay who used a link to my site in his eBay auction to sell fake cards. I'll update the page tonight.

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Posted By: <b>Bob Shannon</b><p>Pete, I know you have one on your website and I seen the one Leon has on the SGC registry...but thats it only 2?<br />No wonder I can't find one.....Anyone else on the board holding a Croft & Allen with a red back? <br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>thanks pete, that helps. i was looking at the sgc registry for the cards and noticed that the crofts cocoa cards for the most part only have a single graded example. this is something you usually only find with the scarcest of issues. does the registry overestimate the scarcity of the cards at all. i dont think if have ever seen a e92 crofts cocoa cobb that i can remember at least

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>Bob,<br /><br />Leon has a Miller (Batting) I believe, I have a Davis. Those are the only two I am aware of. Are there more out there? Probably.

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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>As everyone knows my grading company of choice is SGC. With that being said they were late to the "registry" game. I wouldn't use their registry, necessarily, as a guide to scarcity. I would use this boards (especially Pete's -on caramel issues) knowledge as more of a base. I agree with Pete on the red backed Croft cards.......2 known and most likely more out there. I WOULD use the term "rare" on it. I also think the blue backed Croft's candy cards are quite scarce too. regards<br /><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1095797695.JPG">

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Posted By: <b>Scott Elkins</b><p>he has a Croft's Red Back Magee - he "rubbed it in" to me in one of our phone conversations because he knows I love the pose!

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>Believe it when I see it.

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Posted By: <b>Scott Elkins</b><p>Only joking Pete!<br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Just got around to scanning it....and as can be imagined it's back is way off center. I don't think quality control was too good on this one...<img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1095999748.JPG"> <br /><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1095999774.JPG">

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>thanks for the post on of the menagerie card. is it a reasonable task to try and complete either of the e92 crofts sets? i know it is a pipe dream for the nadja's

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>Just my observation, AND NOT ABUOUT ANYONE IN PARTICULAR: Newer collectors don't seem to have the patience that older collectors seem to have but of course it's reasonable to try and complete any of the E92 sets. Large auction house and eBay have changed the way collectors perceive the hobby.<br /><br />They will definitely be a test of your patience. Believe me, I tried. Even with a more than a decade under my belt I was only 1/2 to 3/4 on the Croft's back sets and I'm slightly over the 1/2 point on the Nadjas. Granted I couldn't just buy every card I saw and I did sell some throughout the years. <br /><br /> Will you complete a set in a year or two? With unlimited funds and some luck - sure. But "probably not" is the likely answer. Definitely have to be a collector in the truest sense to go for a set like this. <br /><br />I don't want to discourage anyone, but I don't want to mislead either.

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>thanks pete, i am only 28 so i have plenty of time and i am in no rush. i just wanted to get an idea of feasability and whether or not particular cards have only one or two known examples

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>As with other sets he appears in, Cobb is the key.

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Posted By: <b>david</b><p>i figured as much. i am getting the feeling that you just have to buy them when you see them because they may not come up again for quite a while.

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Posted By: <b>Peter Thomas</b><p>I have been working on E92's for over 10 years. results do far:<br /><br />Dockman 35 of 40 cards graded average about 5. <br /> Missing Bergen,Casey, Crawford, Matty and Wagner (throwing)<br /><br />Candy 19 of 50 cards graded average about 4 several M/C cards not graded<br /> Missing many<br /><br />Cocoa 15 of 50 cards graded average about 3.5 several M/C cards not graded<br /> Missing many<br /><br />Nadja 29 of 62 cards graded average about 4.5<br /> Missing many<br /><br />Composite 57 of 62 cards graded average 5.08<br /> Missing Barry (have M/C), Cobb, Dooin, Knabe and Wagner (throwing)<br /><br />Unfortuately I'm not 28, but still hope to complete, but 8 Wagners, 4 Mattys and 3 Cobbs make it expensive.<br />

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Posted By: <b>petecld</b><p>"....but 8 Wagners, 4 Mattys and 3 Cobbs make it expensive."<br /><br /><br />AMEN!!!!!!

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Posted By: <b>Scott Elkins</b><p>with the Dockman set - afterall, no Cobb to buy! Just in the past two weeks, I decided to put together a Dockman set and already have 20 of the 40 cards. I did "cheat" howver, because over the past 3 months or so I was collecting horizontal e-cards and ones with poses/backgrounds I liked, so I already had all the Dockman horizontals out of the way (except Matty - I was stupid a few months back and sold my SGC 50 Dockman Matty). A little hint - buy what is available - upgrade later. Just like my lowest graded E92 - Siegle - I had it graded - a "1" - but, it is a card down on the set! Other than this one, the rest range from 2-5. I have also thought about not upgrading, but getting higher graded cards of some players to get the set's "average" around a 3 or 3.5 (my goal).

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Posted By: <b>Scott Elkins</b><p>For beginners wanting to start a caramel set. Dockmans are the most readily available of the E92's and you ONLY have to acquire 40 cards for a complete set!

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Posted By: <b>BcD</b><p>The Fred Jacklitsch card is by far the most common E-92 in both the Croft's Candy & the Croft's Cocoa sets for some odd reason. Much like the Murphy card in the E-104 set.