Are these Old Judge cards legit?

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Posted By: <b>tbob</b><p>I'm not a 19 Century guy but these cards look funky. The "5th generation auction sale" lingo makes me skeptical also. <br /><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31719&item=5113863975&rd=1" target=_new>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31719&item=5113863975&rd=1</a><br />The seller has 100% feedback but then again, lots of decent auction buyers have been hoodwinked by reproductions before...

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Posted By: <b>Jim Clarke</b><p>These cards look legit to me.. They even have the bend in them. I'm a buyer on them up to 50.00 a card... LOL See Ya

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Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>legit

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Posted By: <b>Julie</b><p>wouod put me off some--though I have seen black and white Old Judges, and the surface wrinkes--how can an Old Judge have surface wrinkles without its affecting the emulsion? I think it's funny looking.

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Posted By: <b>Jay Miller</b><p>They look good.<br />Julie--Old Judge have numerous shade variations and I have seen plenty like this.

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Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>The curve of the card is always a good indicator. That would have to be one of the hardest things for someone to fake.<br /><br />JAy<br><br>I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

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Posted By: <b>James Verrill</b><p><br />My opinion is that they are absolutely authentic. I have placed a few bids on them, myself.

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Posted By: <b>John/z28jd</b><p>I dabble a bit in the old judge cards and if i wanted any of those cards i wouldnt hesitate to bid on them,they all have normal OJ characteristics and wear.&lt;br /&gt;<br>&lt;br /&gt;<br>Did anyone notice how many peoples names start with J in this thread,Jay x2,James,Jim,Julie,I didnt want to feel left out.<br><br>edited to change my email address only

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Posted By: <b>Er. The Ohter One&quot;?</b><p><img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p>That is too much of a coincidence. Doesn't any one else feel the corner wear is atipical of Old Judges?<br /><br />O.K. I didn't want to bid on them anyway...<br /><br /> --The Other One(How rude can you get!)

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Posted By: <b>Kevin Cummings</b><p>Does everyone feel this guy's Old Judge cards are legit, too? At least Judy returned my emails. This seller has not.<br /><br /><a href="http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=rocketage&include=0&since=-1&sort=3&rows=50" target=_new>http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=rocketage&include=0&since=-1&sort=3&rows=50</a><br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>Dave</b><p>Julie, I think John was trying to exclude the lawyers from our group, Josh x2. That's the other one (or two).<br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>Tom Boblitt</b><p>at first glance the OJ's from the other seller look good to me. They do have some interesting border wear on a couple though. His N162 looks like it's okay with all that back damage. The paper inside looks to be vintage. <br /><br />p.s. I would vote for HOY if it could be definitively proved he started the hand signals as a PIONEER...............<br /><br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>I didn't look at the whole group the first time, just the Patton. A remarkably consistant, high quality group of pictures, which you normally dont see. And they are VERY B&W for OJs. Still, all the cards show the characteristic curve that I think would be really hard to duplicate. I'd still like to see them in perosn, just to make sure.<br /><br />Jay<br><br>I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p>...only, there are no Joshes posting in this thread, either I or 2.<br /><br /><br />5 or 6 black and white Old Judges in a row is 4 or 5 too many for me...just remembering how gorgeous the black and white Delahanty in the Mastro auction is...haven't looked at it in the last 2 or 3K.<br /><br /><br /><br />"and some walk in darkness, while others walk in light, and we see those in the light, but those in darkness, we don't see."-Bert Brecht, "Mack the Knife," The Threepenny Opera

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Posted By: <b>Jay Miller</b><p>I feel very strongly that the first group of Old Judge are good. I think the second group is also good, but I am alot less sure of that. They look very faded and have paper adhering to the backs which obscures what the cardboard really looks like. As long as the seller of the second group allows returns I would see no reason not to bid on them if there was a card that someone wanted.

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Posted By: <b>Josh K.</b><p>I have nothing substantive to add - but at least now there is a Josh posting.<br /><br />By the way, to get completely off topic, Ive counted three Josh's on this board so far - me, Josh K.(jkrasner2), Joshua Levine (j levine), and Josh (vintagewhitesox). <br />

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Posted By: <b>OJ</b><p>The seller of the OJs with the gray paper on the back is not taking returns on the cards.

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p>a rabbit would need some help (Rabbits can only count to five; then they go into tharn. Not really, they just count anything over 5 as "many, many,as many as you can imagine".<br />It's pronounced "hrair" Maybe the Scotts, too.<br /><br />I have 22 Old Judges, all high demand, all bought from random people and plces, and none are black and white. I used to have a Galvin with the thin, thin emulsion folded back on itself in one corner--that's how I know how thin it is. Some are curved; others are not.<br /><br /><br />"And some walk in darkness while others walk in light, and we see those in the light but those in darkness, we don't see." Bert Brecht, "Mack the Knife," The Threepenny Opera

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Posted By: <b>JimB</b><p>We are everywhere. The bus came by and I got on, that's where it all began.<br /><br />The card looks legit to me.<br />Jim

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p><img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>James Verrill</b><p><br />I feel that the second group of N172's is authentic, as well. <br /><br />Aside from the cards themselves appearing authentic, a couple of other factors strike me as noteworthy:<br /><br />- The seller also has Old Judge actress cards listed, which also appear authentic. My feeling is that, when a person is selling a reprint (or reprints) of an Old Judge BASEBALL card (or cards), rarely do they also have Old Judge cards that are non-baseball offered in other auctions. I feel this is because they recognize (on a subconscious level) that - even if authentic - non-baseball Old Judges don't carry the same earning potential (generally speaking, of course). Basically, I just look at this as evidence that supports the N172's are authentic. When a person REALLY acquires a group of old cards, they generally cover the spectrum with regard to value, condition, and often - genre. When a person sells reprints, they tend to try to maximize their return on just a small group (or single example) of known valuable cards. That is because (I feel) they KNOW what they are doing. I call this the Shoeless Joe phenomena. If you are selling a reprint - why sell one of an Old Judge actress card that will maybe get you enough to buy a cup of coffee, when you can just conceal the bidder ID's and try to land a big fish by selling a reprint of a Shoeless Joe card? Anyway - to me, the fact that this seller also lists the actress cards is an indication to me that he/she is not knowingly selling reprints. This does not, of course, mean the cards are NOT reprints (although, as I said, I feel they are authentic), it just (to me) supports the argument the cards are likely real.<br /><br />- Other cards the seller has listed appear authentic - particularly the Fatima team cards (T200's) which are very difficult (impossible?) to create "real looking" reprints of. <br /><br />And, as a side - the "J" factor is even more confusing when Julie posts messages as "JV". As you know, "JV" is also my own set of initials. A few times, I have had people email me, thinking it was me (James Verrill) that had posted a thread, when it was actually Julie (Vognar).<br /><br />Bye for now...<br /><br />"JV"

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p>those are my initials, and it does make it more confusing. Oh, hit's me, Julie, here. So anyway, it's very unlikely that someone wrote to you, and I responded, or whatever, because I have NEVER POSTED AS JV. i'd like to be able to say, 'how could someone confuse us, since JV is a moron," but i don't remember JV's posts being particulaly moronic, whereas i...<br />omyachingBACK!

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Posted By: <b>&quot;JV&quot;</b><p><br />OK, Julie - my error. I thought you were the JV, in question. The person ("JV") has had two posts recently, and did not identify themself in any way, in either thread. My assumption it was you is obviously wrong.<br /><br />And, I didn't mean <u>you</u> had emailed me - I said other folks from this board had emailed me, thinking I was the JV who had posted the messages (when, in fact, it was not me, either).<br /><br />I guess there is still one more (possibly several...?) JV still lurking out there, identity unknown.<br /><br />James Verrill

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Posted By: <b>FatBoy</b><p>JC has fat fingers?<br /><br />

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Posted By: <b>The Other One</b><p>NOT!

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Posted By: <b>John/z28jd</b><p>I know someone named Johnny V,who has posted here as JV and it wasnt him either.He only collects t206 errors so he wouldnt start any other topics in all likelyhood<br />